Suggestion:20080130 Allow survivors with construction to use pipes

	Removed
	This suggestion has been removed from voting because zombies aparently should be able to block pipes..

20080130 Allow survivors with construction to use pipes

Studoku 14:42, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

Suggestion type
Balance change

Suggestion scope
Survivors with construction

Suggestion description
Since the most recent update, pipes have become a useful defense in seiges since the zombies can't stop people using them. However, survivors with construction can't use them. This means that, in this situation, survivors with construction are at a disadvantage compared with those who don't have construction.

The solution to this is simple- allow survivors with construction to use pipes as barricades.

Voting Section

Voting Rules

Votes must be numbered, justified, signed, and timestamped. # justification ~~~~ Votes that do not conform to the above may be struck by any user.

The only valid votes are Keep, Kill, Spam or Dupe. If you wish to abstain from voting, do not vote.

Keep Votes

1. Author Keep- Because author kill would be rather silly.Studoku 14:43, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
2. Clarify - Put this in keep to prevent early spamination. Pipes can make loose barricades right? Are you saying that if you have Construction you can't make loose barricades with pipes? I've never tried it myself. --Jon Pyre 15:06, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

   http://wiki.urbandead.com/index.php/News/2007- check the news for August 24. Most people ignored it because until the recent update, most people just used normal barricades anyway.Studoku 15:12, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

3. Keep - Specifically searching for them is a bigger drain than trying to barricade by hand. If you've got one, you should be allowed to use it. --Midianian|T|T:S|C:RCS| 15:15, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
4. Keep - it doesn't make sense that the more skilled playa can't do the simpler task. --Funt Solo ^QT 15:27, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

   Because, as mentioned, it makes no sense that the less skilled player for some reason can use the pipe, while the more skilled barricades can't. Two options present themselves, nerf newbies and say their attempt to barricade with pipes be subject to the same rules as regular barricading, or allow the more skilled barricader to use the pipe (actually there is a third option which is do nothing about it). But it makes sense that barricading with a pipe gets past zombies blocking, as you aren't dragging some heavy piece of junk over to the door. - W 16:07, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

5. Keep - Agree with the three people above me --Zach016 16:28, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
6. keep - It doesnt make sense that a survivor simply unlearn how to build a 1-level cade with a pipe once he buys construction. It's like i would unlearn how to use ms office once i started using open office --People's Commissar Hagnat ^{[cloned] [mod]} 16:32, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
7. Keep - Though Grim makes a good point, this is (I feel) a minor change and makes more sense.--Seventythree^Talk 16:41, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
8. Keep - I see Grim's logic, but it just doesn't apply in this case. Construction should not be any kind of regression in ability, including using lead pipes for barricading. Equal opportunity for pipes! --_└^Frozen_┘^┌_Flame^┐ 17:25, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
9. Keep - Because gaining a skill shouldn't make it impossible to use an item that you could use without the skill. Plus I like the excuse to carry pipes. --Ms.Panes 17:39, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
10. Keep - Excellent suggestion. --Themanwhocares4 17:51, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
11. Keep Tried to use a pipe over in Giddings a few days ago, not knowing that construction prevented me from using it. Would've made a difference of 20 AP (due to 17 zombies being present, *growl*) getting to loosely barricaded had I been able to use that pipe. This issue should never have existed, it makes no sense that a survivor would ever lose an ability they've had since level 1 (since the ability existed) because they learned to do something better. --Nightforge 17:59, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
12. Keep - It makes sense. --Pdeq^Talk* 18:17, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
13. Keep - i agree for reasons already listed--Scotw 18:26, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
14. Keep - As so many before me, particularly Funt, Ms. Panes, and oddly enough the latter part of Actingupagain in the kill section. - Headshot Hal 18:52, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

    Keep - As before, need I say any more? --FXI 20:51, 30 January 2008 (UTC)Vote placed after removal. --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 21:00, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

    Keep - See above.  Billy Club Thorton  T!  RR  20:54, 30 January 2008 (UTC)Vote placed after removal. --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 21:00, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

Kill Votes

1. Kill for now - Grimch makes a solid point in waiting a few months to see the overall impact of the most recent change. However, if it continues to go like it currently is, it may be a good suggestion. Survivors will start carrying a couple of pipes like we do with FAKs right now - and the slight impact on inventory would make a good balance.--Actingupagain 16:40, 30 January 2008 (UTC)
2. See talk page. It's a bug. - W 19:24, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

Spam/Dupe Votes

1. Spam - Completely undermines the purpose of the last update, and for no good reason whatsoever. Lets wait and see how the update plays out before rushing to nerf it, shall we? On the other hand, i could see myself voting keep for this on the condition pipes were removed from the game first. There, thats constructive criticism. Nowpeople can stop bitching about me never offering any. --The Grimch ^{U! E! WAT!} 14:54, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

   Pipes aren't anywhere near as good as barricades. They can't be found in malls, require a lot of searching, take up inventory space and can only provide one level of cading. Besides, I'm trying to change their usefulness, I'm saying that survivors with construction shouldn't be prevented from using them.Studoku 15:09, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

   The whole point of the update was to make it harder for survivors to build cades. If you are going to let them get them started with a single click, you undermine the entire point of the update. As i said: Let this run for a couple of months and see how it plays out. There are a number of ways survivors can adapt to this changed world, hell, i even wrote a guide detailing those methods before the update, and they are still applicable even now. --The Grimch ^{U! E! WAT!} 15:12, 30 January 2008 (UTC)