Talk:Guides:kiZombie-English Dictionary

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Darh Naghrg

Would this be acceptable for Dual Nature? -Scout talk!!!! 03:16, 14 October 2010 (BST)

Daa Nazarh would be what I'd put forward. For hate's sake I spit my last breath at thee 03:19, 14 October 2010 (BST)
Nazarh seems best for nature. Pronounced ney-zar, compered to ney-cher. Not a big difference. As for dual, I'm somewhat inclined to have something based on two. Perhaps a word that would translate literally into Two-Nature. If not, I'd prefer Darh to Daa. --VVV RPGMBCWS 05:22, 15 October 2010 (BST)

Lexicon

Does this dictionary now reflect everything listed in the zombie lexicon page?

I think so. I'm not sure, feel free to verify. Daniel Hicken 04:26, 1 April 2007 (BST)


"Barg z!ngz" - food" - YES! And here I didn't think anyone got that when I spoke at the Quartly Lib... ummm. Damn. Let's try again: Arragh! An Rrrgang nah z anabagah grab-gab grh Rrrgang gabbah-gabbah anzagh rabrarah. - Wolfgang Puck 00:03, 10 May 2007 (BST)

Sorry I didn't get that at the library... Daniel Hicken
ARGH! Az aragh. Grh, manah zambahz graagh. Manah zmargh zambahz an Margan. Wolfgang Puck 21:13, 10 May 2007 (BST)
Maz hab marh zmargh zambahz an Margan. Daniel Hicken 21:57, 10 May 2007 (BST)


Has anyone tried to turn this dictionary around to make translation from English to kiZombie easier? --Evan Cord 17:33, 23 July 2007 (BST)

Evan-- if you're using Firefox, just hit the / button and at the bottom of the screen a window will pop up for you to type in a search term. This makes it quite simple to browse the dictionary in English. If you're using Internet Explorer (DON'T!), I think you can hit Ctrl+F for a similar but clunkier function. --Buddhagazelle 21:13, 23 July 2007 (BST)

disregard of ! as a vowel

Mah zambah nah grah "!". "!" az harm, "!" az zzzzargh, mah zambah ahm "!"-zaggar --~~~~ [talk] 22:51, 17 October 2007 (BST)

Manah, manah zambahz grah "!" az barah. Mah zambah nah zgr!b!r z!ngz az mah zambah z!ng zam ab. Mah zambah zgr!b!r anrah z!ngz mah zambah z!z ahn Marban. Daniel Hicken 04:44, 18 October 2007 (BST)
Mah zambah nah grah ahn "zgr!b!r"-ang, anrah "graagh"-ang. Manah zambahz ganna grah "!"? abar mah zambah nah grah zam "Zamgrh"-zambahz. Mah zamgrh-grah az "!"-nah zamgrh-grah! [OOC: !-free dialect] --~~~~ [talk] 17:19, 18 October 2007 (BST)
Ah gah "zgr!b!r z!ngz" anrah har, an zah R!g!. An mabah !z nah arr zambahz, bag manah, manah zambahz gah "ggh mm amr mmr am rm am mmm mm mmmmm mm rr" an gannah annarzanz !g. Nah zambah grah, zah. Az mambrrrng, nah zbaazh. Daniel Hicken 04:22, 19 October 2007 (BST)

Alphabetization of ! as a vowel

All matters of disregard aside, should ! be alphabetized as a punctuation mark, before "a", or should it be alphabetized like the letter "i", between "h" and "m"? --Sterling Bershadsky 00:38, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

As a punctuation mark --~~~~ [talk] 09:40, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Yes, Duke, we know your views on "!". But other zombies who use it as a vowel-equivalent in Malton use it as both. Because of that, I've placed it after z, which is convention when it comes to non-roman letters in foreign language dictionaries. Nome Chompsgi 17:32, 6 February 2009 (UTC)

Personal Pronouns

We lack some personal pronouns here.. What do you think of Gaar for your (sing.) and Grazzar for your (plur.)? --Kenny Larson

I think it should be 1 word for both. kiZombie is a simplified language and no reason to make 2 words where for exapmle english has 1. Oh and mah zambah mmm gaar zamgrh! --~~~~ [talk] 19:26, 26 March 2008 (UTC)
OK, but then we should remove the plural "you" too :) Should I proceed? --Kenny Larson 12:05, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
Please, don't remove anything. You see, kiZombie is not an unified language. Actually every zombie speaks on it's own dialect of kiZombie. For example, few headers above i'm complaining that "!" is not an "i" for me, but i didn't remove such words. The purpose of dictionary is to cover as much as possible of different words from different zombies. You can add both gaar and grazzar, i'm not against, though you know my opinion on it. So basically you can add whatever you want, in common sense limits. And back to the question, i only use gaa myself :) --~~~~ [talk] 21:21, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
What about "y'all"? -Ornithopter 18:21, 27 March 2008 (UTC)


Words not included in dictionary or lexicon

Just a submission for your approval of words not included in the dictionary, but occur in wikipedia's 100 most frequent English words. Running the words through a translator, the words with the highest occurrences of the letters used in kiZombie were selected and translated, omitting the letters that do not appear in the XSANSA chart, and substituting the ones that do for the appropriate letters.

English Word Alternative word Language of origin kiZombie Suggestions Nome Chompsgi
at na polish na agh or a!
back belakang indonesian bragang bag or bagg
been adalah indonesian agarah b!n -- but the zombie tense structure doesn't favor this
before innan swedish !nnan this would be talked around, using past tense
could moglby polish mgrb! mabah - maybe
down omlaag dutch mraag zahn
get bekommen german bgmmn grab
going gaan dutch gaan ganna or gah
got mandapatkan indonesian mangabaggan hab
great grobartig german grbarg!g grab!g - great big
has haz
hey halla swedish halla h! - if they say it at all
is !z be doesn't really exist in Zamgrh, from my experience.
its !g !z
just hanya indonesian han!a
little mazs latvian mazz namazh -- not much.
made maagb hab mag - have make
may maggio italian magg! gan - can
mean oznaczac polish znagazg na-nazz - not nice OR zah -- as in "I'm SAYING ---"
my minun finnish m!nn mah (this is attested in Malton)
ok labi latvian rab! agah.
one ena slovenian na ahn
our nasz polish nazz arrh or arh
said berkata indonesian brgaga gah (I go -- as in "so I go, "No way!" and she goes, "Yes!")
she hun danish hn zh! or harr
should hauria catalan har!a b! naz mabah gannah (to be nice, maybe going to)
something nagonting swedish nagnt!ng zamz!ng
such sellainen finish zrra!nn zazh
tell erzahlen german rzahrn gah or zah
than daripada indonesian gar!baga zan
that's yang indonesian ang zagz
their mereka indonesian mrga zamz, literally them's
then dann german gann zan
these nama finish nama zaaz
this denhar swedish gnharh z!z
two oradoua romainian raga zma, according to Rrgang Bag (Wolfgang Puck)
up namraag ab
upon terhadap indonesisn grhagab ab ahn
well brunn swedish brnn Mrh. (well, healthy, life, revive.)
will griba latvian gr!ba gannah
would avrebbe italian abrbb mabah gannah
yeah yeah english !ah agah.
your sinun finnish z!nn ZOMBIENAME'z or pl. arr mah Zambah'z (all my zombie's)

Portalcore 11:53, 27 November 2008 (UTC)

Some of these are pure awesomeness, though there are some, that i don't like. I might come in with list of explanations later. Great job anyway! --~~~~ [talk] 18:54, 27 November 2008 (UTC)
No problem. That's why I submitted here instead of the main page. Let me know any specific problems (incorrect letter use etc), and I'll try and sort it out. --Portalcore 08:24, 28 November 2008 (UTC)
I've listed my take on your suggestions. Nome Chompsgi 17:57, 6 February 2009 (UTC)

translation of words yet to be added.

Looking through the various kiZombie discussion pages, I've come across a few things which makes me wonder if there are any loose procedures in working out a translation?

Here's my take on it.

  • If the word isn't present in the dictionary, use a thesaurus for an alternative.
  • If no alternative words are present in the dictionary, get as many translations of the word as possible.
  • Then see how many occurrences within the word the letters a,b,g,h,m,n,r,z and add them up.
  • Divide the amount of occurrences by the length of the translated word to give a ratio.
  • The nearer to 1 the better (contains the most matching letters for the given length of the word).
  • Select the word with the highest ratio (personal choice if there are more than 1 result).
  • Then using Kevan's rules for how plain text is processed by death rattle, but substituting characters based on the XSAMPA chart, the final translation appears.
  • Then submit the translation to be discussed if appropriate.


I know it's all a bit arbitrary, but as kiZombie is a kind of a mish mash of different words from different languages, and some just made up to sound alike, I wasn't sure if there was a formal method.

Currently I have found around 960 combinations of where a kiZombie word has one or more english meanings, or an english word has one or more kiZombie words linked to it.

Any feedback is welcome! --Portalcore 11:30, 28 November 2008 (UTC)

there's no formal method. as i like to say (or maybe i just like the sound of my graagh), every zombie speaks it's own dialect of Zamghr. So basically whatever is used by whoever... is a valid word. :) --~~~~ [talk] 20:25, 28 November 2008 (UTC)
Duke Garland has hit it on the head -- every zombie's idiolect is acceptable. Given that Zamgrh is still coalescing as a language, I'm doing my best to document what I'm "hearing" in the game. Does that make sense? I figure anything you do that works, is fine. I wouldn't necessarily put it here on the list, unless other zombies pick up on it/understand it. That's my take (a bit after the fact). Nome Chompsgi 17:39, 6 February 2009 (UTC)

Clarifications and observations.

I know that each zombie has it's own version of Zamgrh, so what I'm asking is redundant, but it would be nice to have some clarification of some aspects, as I am attempting to produce a translation, where the majority of the words are not in the dictionary yet.

How are words put together? example: Everywhere - would it be a combination of 'every' & 'where' or the whole word 'everywhere'?

Because looking at the dictionary, the combination of the separate words seems to be the case, in addition of adding a 'z' for multiples of an item.

Would zombies use abbreviated words? We use 'don't' instead of 'do not', to state just one example, but would a zombie have the facility of this as the apostrophe is not present in death rattle.

Just an observation, but when a zombie refers to itself, it does so in the 3rd person (usually).

And one last thing, would a zombie word be able to refer to more than one english meaning? as 'hra' means 'a' but has also been used as 'to' in some instances.

In the dictionary, there doesn't appear to be much if any overlaps of different meanings for the same word.

Just wondered if anyone could enlighten me, as I'm trying to translate the most common used english words into Zamgrh.

Portalcore 15:51, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Using your example, Portalcore, I would say "arr-braazzaz" literally, all-places. My feel of Zamgrh is that we use alternate words, alternate ways of saying the same thing.
I don't know that zombies have that many abbreviations, given the state of the 'language'. You can try it, in your own speech, but unless you're seeing people do it in game, methinks it's not something that's all that common.
As a zombie and hearing other zombies, you're right, it's most often "Mah Zambah" but sometimes "Ahm" (I'm).
There are overlaps, and that's common with any language. In French "de" means both of and from, "à" means to and at. Which is why your word list above seems to be a good fit in some ways.
That's my take on the subject. Nome Chompsgi 17:43, 6 February 2009 (UTC)

Possible additions

Rather than directly adding these, I figured I'd drop them here for others to evaluate first, though I like them. I added a section to the article on Zamgrh describing the already-extant use of kennings within the language, and I think it's an avenue worth exploring.

  • Barnbazh: Siege. (House-bash).
  • Zgaghbahgz: Radio (Squawk box).
  • Ganzar-man: Saboteur, griefer, hated foe. (From the character of the Cancer Man in the TV series The X-Files)
  • Marh-zmazhbazh: Tactics, strategy. (More smash-bash).
  • Harhar-bahgz: Piñata (Haha box, joke box)

For hate's sake I spit my last breath at thee 00:25, 28 October 2010 (BST)

  • Bah-hab: To steal (p.t. bah-haz)(bad have)
  • Bazgh: Unusual, odd, foreign. (Basque, an ethnic group in Western Europe entirely unrelated genetically, culturaly or linguistically to their surrounding ethnic neighbours)
  • Nanabah: To cheat. Also Nanabarh, cheater. Both meant in a broad sense and not just as a synonym for 'zarg'. (Not good)
  • Mazagamb: Lateral thought, top-down analysis, any kind of 'beyond the basic' thought or approach. (Metagame)

For hate's sake I spit my last breath at thee 00:02, 29 October 2010 (BST)

  • Barnbazh: Maybe.
  • Zgaghbahgz: No. Gabbahgz or Gab-bahgz would be better.
  • Ganzar-man: No. Much to obscure.
  • Marh-zmazhbazh: No.
  • Harharh-bahgz: Maybe.
  • Bah-hab: No. Nab would be better, or we could add it on to Grab.
  • Bazgh: Bazgh would be fine for the Basque people, but B!zarrh would be more clear for general strangeness.
  • Nanabah: Maybe.
  • Mazagamb: Very Yes. But it must fit in with the previous Gamm, so I'm adding it as Mazagaam.

--VVV RPGMBCWS 01:11, 29 October 2010 (BST)

Dictionary entries starting in !

I know that typically a dash is added before these words. Where do we add them on the dictionary? I want to add -!gnarang (ignorant) but not sure where it goes. ~Vsig.png 17:36, 29 October 2010 (BST)

! can never begin or end a word, nor can it follow an R. -!zanbah is the only exception to this rule. --VVV RPGMBCWS 00:38, 30 October 2010 (BST)
Wrong! Just as an example, "-!n" is in pretty standard usage among the zambahz I talk to. This dictionary is supposed to be descriptive, not prescriptive, so in they go. ᚱᛖᚢᛖᚾᚨᚾ 04:37, 30 October 2010 (BST)
-! is common among certain minority circles. But we're not interested in such fringe (and visually befuddling) branches, we're interested in the core of the language. --VVV RPGMBCWS 05:51, 30 October 2010 (BST)

Buildings

I'm hoping to finish with all building names and add a table to the lexicon (showing the word, the translation, and the root word), but I'm stuck on two:

  • Public House - Armzbarn? Babbarn? Baazhbarn?
  • Tower - We can't use b!gbarn, since that's easily large buildings. Drawing a blank on what else could describe it. Abargmangbarn seems a bit of a stretch.

--VVV RPGMBCWS 07:20, 30 October 2010 (BST)

Public house - abzabarn?
Tower - H!ghbarn.
For hate's sake I spit my last breath at thee 16:52, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
H!ghbarn is excellent. Not sure where you're going with abzabarn. --VVV RPGMBCWS 22:27, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
Abzarb is listed as a verb meaning "to drink" (through kenning from "absorb"). Drink-house. For hate's sake I spit my last breath at thee 23:42, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
I can unlive with that. --VVV RPGMBCWS 23:49, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Looking at Borehamwood and Monroeville, there's a rake of unique location types there without names. Since it's buildings you're after, here's suggestions:

  • Petrol station could either be done more transliteratively with Bazrarbarn, or the figurative Bahrnzaarz-barn ("burn sauce" being a more evocative way to convey "petrol")
  • Boathouse: Zhabzbarn
  • Abbey: Abbah, Abb!h
  • Supermarket: Zabarmargaz
  • Big Brother House: B!g Brazzah Barn
  • Country Club: Ganzrah Gab
  • Barn: Barn?
  • Dormitory: Zzzzbarn, Garm!zarah
  • Garage: Already listed as Garagz. I'd suggest amending to Garagzh to imply softer Z sound and singular form.
  • Farmhouse: Struggling with this one. I really want to use Barnbarn.
  • Stables: Nagbarn (why "nag" is used in place of "haarz" I'm unsure of but it still works)
  • Swimming Pool: No clue. :(

For hate's sake I spit my last breath at thee 00:15, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

  • Petrol station: Gazbarn - Gas-building. Also, Gaz-bag is an easy fuel can.
  • Boathouse: Zhabzbarn - I agree that it should be ship-building, but I'm not sure zhabz is the best way to say ship. I'm thinking more along the lines of Zh!b.
  • Abbey: Abbahbarn - Must end in barn.
  • Supermarket: Zabarmargazbarn - Must end in barn
  • Big Brother House: B!g-Brazzah-Barn - Added.
  • Country Club: Ganzrah Zahnzbarn - Zahnzbarn is the standard for club.
  • Barn: Barn - Added.
  • Dormitory: Zzzzbarn - Added.
  • Garage: Garagz(h)barn - Must end in barn. I'm not sure about the H. makes it look like it would make an sh sound. Perhaps Garahzbarn?
  • Farmhouse: Barnbarn - Added
  • Stables: Nagbarn - See here. Added.
  • Swimming Pool: Braagbarn?
--VVV RPGMBCWS 05:08, 4 November 2010 (UTC)
I'm aware of the term "nag" but it seems a bit round-the-world-for-a-shortcut-y. And Zhabz as ship is extant, but I agree it's not great. For hate's sake I spit my last breath at thee 15:39, 4 November 2010 (UTC)
After living in a Mexican/US border city for years, I heard the word "garash" quite a bit. So Garazhbarn sounds natural to me. Could be just me, though ~Vsig.png 15:42, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

Alphabetical listing

I noticed the recent change to the dictionary. I like the change except that now entries need to be added in two places. I tried messing around with inclusions so that the alphabetical pages are automatically updated when the main page is updated. Didn't have much luck. Any suggestions? ~Vsig.png 16:55, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

The easiest way to do that would be to template the individual letter pages onto the main one, but I'm not for that at all. I don't mind adding new additions to the subpages on a regular basis, it's not a big hassle really. For hate's sake I spit my last breath at thee 00:08, 4 November 2010 (UTC)
I don't see any reason to put it in subpages at all; They're only significant in that you can't use ctrl-f. The only possible benefit I can see would be shrinking the page length so that the intro can be edited without browser problems, but that would mean templating in the subpages, which you appose. I'm completely lost as to why you want them. Please elaborate. --VVV RPGMBCWS 02:22, 4 November 2010 (UTC)
Given the increasing length I just felt it would be useful to duplicate the material in smaller sections as well as in one collected page, especially for quick reference. For hate's sake I spit my last breath at thee 15:36, 4 November 2010 (UTC)
Templating the individual sections onto the main page would just be ass backward I think. If we could figure out a way to do the inclusions, I'd say it's a nice addition. I was hoping that pages in the Guides namespace worked like User or Template pages, but it doesn't appear they do. ~Vsig.png 05:35, 4 November 2010 (UTC)