Suggestion:20070925 Ruined and Powered equals Orange

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20070925 Ruined and Powered equals Orange

'arm. 16:47, 25 September 2007 (BST)

Suggestion type
Improvement

Suggestion scope
Ruined Buildings

Suggestion description
It's possible to see Ruined buildings and Powered buildings from the street. It's also possible to set up a generator in a Ruined building, and power it. However when you do so, from street level the building still appears Ruined.

This is counter-intuitive.

If a normal building can be seen as "lit" from the street, how could a ruined building NOT be seen as "lit" from the street?

This suggestion would make a building which was Powered and Ruined coloured orange. This allows both the powered status and ruined status to be detected.

Some information/assumptions

• Despite popular belief, it has always been possible to search ruined and ransacked buildings.
  • Search rates in these buildings are not reduced to zero, but are a reduced version of the normal rates.
• It is believed that a "lit" ruined or ransacked building raises the search rates to those of a normal building.

Voting Section

Voting Rules

Votes must be numbered, justified, signed, and timestamped. # justification ~~~~ Votes that do not conform to the above may be struck by any user.

The only valid votes are Keep, Kill, Spam or Dupe. If you wish to abstain from voting, do not vote.

Keep Votes

1. Keep - Ruin is mostly only good for 'zombie-territory' anyway (due to the high AP cost), and allowing survivors to take advantage of that nerfs even that minor advantage. Being able to hide powered generators inside ruined buildings gives too much advantage to survivors for my taste. 'arm. 16:50, 25 September 2007 (BST)
2. Keep - I concur. --Pavluk ^{A! E!} 16:51, 25 September 2007 (BST)
3. keep - I pay no attention anyway but it sounds more than sensible!--Honestmistake 16:59, 25 September 2007 (BST)
4. Keep - Sounds reasonable. --People's Commissar Hagnat ^{[cloned] [mod]} 17:08, 25 September 2007 (BST)
5. keep - Makes sense.--Seventythree 17:13, 25 September 2007 (BST)
6. Keep - Orange.--  AHLGTG THE END IS NIGH! 18:12, 25 September 2007 (BST)
7. Keep - Orange x2. --Hhal 18:50, 25 September 2007 (BST)
8. Keep - Yup good idea!--Acoustic Pie 18:53, 25September 2007 (BST)
9. Keep What they said. --Jon Pyre 18:55, 25 September 2007 (BST)
10. Keep - "Unprotected survivors here! All-you-can-eat buffet!", I like it. --Midianian|T|T:S|C:RCS| 19:00, 25 September 2007 (BST)
11. Keep - Makes sense - if I can see both attributes separately, let me see both of them together. Grim's objection is out-of-character for a zombie game anyhow - zombies are generally only about as intelligent as, say, a wolf or feral cat. Their retained ability to understand English is meant more as an amusement than an input for tactical decisions, I think. --Pgunn 19:52, 25 September 2007 (BST)
12. Keep - Sure, why the hell not. --Druuuuu 20:11, 25 September 2007 (BST)
13. Keep - Best idea I heard in a long time. Sockem 20:35, 25 September 2007 (BST)
14. Keep - Many people don't even realize that ruined buildings are still usable by survivors, from what I've seen - this will probably make it more obvious to all. I see Grimch's point, but like any change in this game (such as the addition of "Ruin" a few weeks back), everyone's just going to have to get smarter and find new tactics. As for the color choice, I think it's appropriate - I think of it as ruined buildings don't have as many lights working, thus the dimmer color.--Actingupagain 21:24, 25 September 2007 (BST)
15. Sometimes, tactics have to take a backseat to plausbility.--ShadowScope 22:09, 25 September 2007 (BST)
16. Keep - I can dig that. --Themanwhocares4 22:25, 25 September 2007 (BST)
17. Keep -Mn, I love orange juice. :)  Nalikill  ^{TALK  E!  W!  M!  USAI}  22:27, 25 September 2007 (BST)
18. Keep - I like powered ruined buildings the way they are, but the current system makes no sense. Maaaaaaaybe the power can only be visible from directly outside? But that doesn't make sense either.--Wooty 23:56, 25 September 2007 (BST)
19. Keep- Because dark yellow is orange. Duh. --Vkkhamul 01:51, 26 September 2007 (BST)

    KEEP -There are holes in the walls. There are lights on inside. Yet, by some mystical force, I cannot see that the lights are on... Oh, wait. My sun-glasses are on... Nope, still can't see it... ~A`Blue`Jelly^TME*V*I*L*_? 03:30, 26 September 2007 (BST)

    After reading some of the votes in kill, I think I'm just going to stay out of this one... ~A`Blue`Jelly^TME*V*I*L*_? 18:16, 29 September 2007 (BST)

20. Keep - Sure, makes sense. --Sonofagun18 05:53, 26 September 2007 (BST)
21. Keep - Grim argument is sound but lets be realist: there are probably 10 or so zombies using these tactics at any given time in Malton and they're all alts from group leaders that don't know what else to do. --Matthew Fahrenheit ^YRC☺T☺+1 05:57, 26 September 2007 (BST)
22. Keep – If a powered building is obvious without holes in the walls letting light out, sparks coming from damaged wires, etc., then it should be even more obvious with them. It also makes sense that you'd be able to tell the difference between the two. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 07:59, 26 September 2007 (BST)
23. Keep - Orange is nice. I love oranges! -- John Rubin^{T! ZG} 08:59, 26 September 2007 (BST)
24. Keep - If Kevan isn't going to see sense and make it impossible to power ruined buildings then this is essential. --The Hierophant 09:22, 26 September 2007 (BST)
25. Keep It's a good idea. --DrBowman 10:07, 26 September 2007 (BST)
26. Keep - Nice. :P--  Savant  Chit-Chat  12:29, 26 September 2007 (BST)
27. Keep - I prefer realism over maintaining some perceived zombie/survivor advantage due to an in-game quirk. --Shazzelim 15:53, 26 September 2007 (BST)
28. Keep - always a vote for realism from me--Liam Degen 16:44, 26 September 2007 (BST)
29. Keep - Nice one. --Kikashie ^ELT 21:18, 26 September 2007 (BST)
30. Keep - Makes complete sense. --Steakfish 00:36, 27 September 2007 (BST)
31. Keep - Bugger the rot clinics, this here's a keeper.--Jiangyingzi 05:22, 27 September 2007 (BST)
32. Keep - Same as everyone above me. Hooray! --Abi79 ^AB 15:43, 27 September 2007 (BST)
33. Keep - Wow, 33 keep votes. Nice. BoboTalkClown 20:43, 27 September 2007 (BST)
34. Keep - Although I enjoyed the ability to hide gens that way, this is more realistic, so I'll agree with this change.--Kolechovski 14:09, 9 October 2007 (BST)

Kill Votes

1. Kill - As i said before. Currently an enterprising zombie can kill a building, ruin it, and then listen in on harman radio reports in peace (leading to further feeding, or even information for the rest of a horde), which adds a really cool tactical dimension to the game, as does the whole humans hiding generators in ruined buildings things. With this suggestion, you undermine those two tactical considerations completely, with humans searching those buildings losing their generators to prowling zombies, and zombies losing their access to survivor strategic radio chatter because of clueless prowling ferals. These would make the game less deep. I actually like it the way it is. Besides, as is, unless it is a totally ruined suburb, hiding in a ruined building is fucking stupid. --The Grimch ^{U! E!} 19:07, 25 September 2007 (BST)

   damn you grim, now i dont know how to vote :P --People's Commissar Hagnat ^{[cloned] [mod]} 19:38, 25 September 2007 (BST) - Non-author RE struck. 'arm. 20:31, 25 September 2007 (BST)

   Zombie listening to local radio chatters - I'm not convinced this would be useful enough due to the prevalence of meta-gaming. Although it does nicely get around the 'problem' that zombies cannot change the radio frequency of any radios they possess. Survivors hiding generators in ruined buildings is the very thing this suggestion intends to remove. This replaces it with the "Unprotected survivors here! All-you-can-eat buffet!" signal that Midianian refers. This is this correct balance of the Ruin update, IMO. 'arm. 20:30, 25 September 2007 (BST)

2. Kill - I think if I were a human in a zombie-infested area that I probably wouldn't turn the lights on and attract attention unless the place were pretty well barricaded. Seems more strategic to leave it the way it is. --Ballz 20:05, 25 September 2007 (BST)
3. Kill - I would enjoy having it but the way it is encourages survivors to search ruined buildings and even gives entrepreneurial groups the choice of keeping buildings ruined for strategic purposes. If such play starts to see frequent use I think it could be an interesting addition for both sides.--Karek^maps?! 20:33, 25 September 2007 (BST)

   The current situation means that zombies should NEVER EVER ruin a building.

   • Scenario A: Ridleybank completely ransacked
   • Scenario B: Ridleybank completely ruined

   In scenario A, you must check everyone open building to confirm that it is ransacked, and contains no survivors. In scenario B, you still have to check each building, only this time to look for a powered generator. The survivors in scenario B have just as much protection as they do in scenario A, but without having to put up with ransacked search rates. And they get this benefit by zombies spending additional AP! This makes no sense. 'arm. 00:09, 26 September 2007 (BST)

   You still have to search the buildings, having a generator doesn't change much of anything, especially considering that more often then not the zombies will be in the resource buildings if they are anywhere.--Karek^maps?! 00:13, 26 September 2007 (BST)

   Continued on talk page.

4. Kill - Grim and Karek's logic is so out of the box that there is no box. Or no inside/outside? Perhaps no subject/object(box) dichotomy in the first place? Well, in any event, I vote as per Grim and Karek. --WanYao 00:22, 26 September 2007 (BST)
5. Kill Nerfs rot clinics - Pardus 02:11, 26 September 2007 (BST)

   How? 'arm. 02:53, 26 September 2007 (BST)

   Because then fewer zombies know it's a rot clinic. The entire purpose of a rot clinic is to try and hide that fact and revive as few zombies as possible. DUH!--Wooty 05:36, 26 September 2007 (BST) Non Author RE.--Karek^maps?! 21:21, 26 September 2007 (BST)

6. Kill - Realistically, rot clinics are the only place where you would ever put a generator inside a ruined building. Making them orange will make it painfully obvious that a rot clinic is there (more so than before ruin was added) specifically because they will be the ONLY orange buildings around. --Uncle Bill 06:27, 26 September 2007 (BST)
7. Kill - Uncle Bill, you're wrong. I've put generator in a ruined PD and reloaded all guns in a day search. Anyway, i like it this way, as i wrote in previous revision. --~~~~ [talk] 07:35, 26 September 2007 (BST)
8. Kill - All sorts of weird, interesting tactics from both sides are going to be ruined (no pun intended) by this if it gets implemented. Plus, secret brainrot clinics, come on, think about the secret brainrot clinics. --Howard Bentley 01:37, 27 September 2007 (BST)

   Are not all Brain Rot clinics signposted by graffiti? This just means the zombies can't tell if there is a working genny inside or not before they get inside. And that's beneficial how? 'arm. 19:00, 27 September 2007 (BST)

9. Kill - The ruining thing has allowed us to keep a genny running in Rotter's Relief Central longer than ever before. Some zeds just like trashing an easy genny for the tiny XP they can get. Its a real pain for us and much better if they can't obviously see what's there --Buda Hilton 21:50, 27 September 2007 (BST)
10. Above. --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 23:14, 27 September 2007 (BST)
11. Kill - I guess because the kill side needs more votes. :).-- dǝǝɥs oʇ ɯɐds: sʎɐʍ1ɐ! 17:31, 30 September 2007 (BST)
12. Kill - As those above. Had no idea you could power a ruined building, either.--Private Mark 04:44, 1 October 2007 (BST)

Spam/Dupe Votes

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