Suggestion:20081008 Wear and Tear

20081008 Wear and Tear

Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 18:37, 8 October 2008 (BST)

Suggestion type
Ruin change.

Suggestion scope
Malls.

Suggestion description
Large buildings with multiple floors and shops have more systems and areas that are likely to be destroyed or damaged by zombies, and become harder to repair, especially as malls are a major battleground in Malton. However because of their size they require more effort to ransack.

In Game Terms

Mall squares take 8 ransack attempts to ruin, but once ruined deteriorate at twice the rate of smaller buildings (repair costs = 2ap a day).

Note This Doesn't fix anything really. Its a tweak, if it was implemented i think it would be interesting to see whether it encouraged zombies to salt the land more, or encourage survivors to retake quickly, or move away from malls to other trp's (the horror!), i just feel its slightly more realistic (which in itself is no valid reason). But hey. Vote.

Voting Section

Voting Rules

Votes must be numbered, justified, signed, and timestamped. # justification ~~~~ Votes that do not conform to the above may be struck by any user.

The only valid votes are Keep, Kill, Spam or Dupe. If you wish to abstain from voting, do not vote.

Keep Votes

1. Keep - The doubled ruin-rate more than compensates for the increased cost to ruin. However, due to the relatively short time malls usually remain in ruins, I doubt this would be a severe blow to survivors. --Midianian^{|T|T:S|C:RCS|} 20:33, 8 October 2008 (BST)
2. Keep Its been 3 hours, and it hasn't yet been spammed to hell, so yeah, I'm like, the Author. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 21:56, 8 October 2008 (BST)
3. Keep - The only way to determine the effects of this tweak will be to implement it, and I'm willing to give it a shot. It can be easily changed back if it proves game-breaking, as no players will invest anything in the change. -- Galaxy125 00:42, 9 October 2008 (BST)
4. Keep - As above. Besides, this could mean a greater use of the "Salt the Land" tactic, or means that survivors will now be desperate to retake malls after a seige. Oh, and Noob question, but could you also clarify how much AP the first day ruin will cost. Like, if survivors immediatly retake a mall, will it cost them 1 or 2 AP to repair? Linkthewindow 03:51, 9 October 2008 (BST)
5. Keep - Let's see what happens. My guess is that there'll be a Third Big Bash (or whatever number we're up to right now) immediately after it is implemented. --Blake Firedancer ^{T E RNL? P.I.S.I.T.} 03:55, 9 October 2008 (BST)
6. keep ok--Airborne88^T|Z.Quiz|PSS 00:01, 12 October 2008 (BST)
7. Keep - Yeah, I like. D^ANCED^ANCER^EVOLUTION (TALK | CONTRIBS) 00:56, 12 October 2008 (BST)
8. Keep Malls are extremely important buildings to survivors. They should have to pay a little more ap to repair them once they've been ruined and zombies should get that little extra help after they've taken a mall. Malls are so important that once a mall is ransacked it's just a matter of time before the survivors retake it. When has anyone ever heard of survivors saying "ahh, Lumber mall's repair cost is too high, let's just abandon it" Silisquish 02:43, 13 October 2008 (BST)
9. Keep- i don't think it'll ever pass but i think it would be interesting if it did- keep. --Irounds 00:10, 18 October 2008 (BST)

Kill Votes

1. Kill - Size is not represented by a block of game space, just as AP is not a time measurement. Increasing the amount of ransack successes, and therefore further nerfing ruin earns this a kill. -- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 20:02, 8 October 2008 (BST)

   Disussion moved to talk page per author's instructions. Linkthewindow 03:52, 9 October 2008 (BST)

2. Kill - Obviously this would motivate survivors to retake fallen malls as soon as possible, intensifying the game's focus on them. Malls really don't need to be focused on more than they already are. Unnecessary game change.--Jiangyingzi 22:01, 9 October 2008 (BST)
3. Kill/Change - The ruin damage rate is already high. Twice that amount is just rediculous! Now on account of malls being a larger area, I would be more inclined to agree with a higher INITIAL repair cost at the normal rate...--Kolechovski 16:43, 11 October 2008 (BST)
4. Weak Kill - I really don't like the fact that it'd make the already crumbling survivor base even weaker, but I do like the fact that it makes it harder. Quiet honestly I'm sick of nukes for Zombies. --• LtZurSee slapped your nose with a newspaper for a heal from CORAM (0 seconds ago) 04:32, 13 October 2008 (BST)

   RE Whaaaat? --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 19:36, 13 October 2008 (BST)

5. Kill - I can't really see the point in this. What you're suggesting already exists, by virture of the fact that each square of the mall can be barricaded or ruined seperate of the others, and must be reparied in the same way. In other words, in order to completely revive a mall, you need to unruin all of the squares. It would be unbalancing to make the ruin rate even higher. ...--Villard 15:38 (GMT +3) 13 October 2008
6. kill i don't get the point --A Big F'ing Dog 18:18, 15 October 2008 (BST)

   RE Le sigh. There seems a lot of that at the moment. I believe its a suggestion that aims to make malls harder to ruin and harder to repair. Better? For an alternative explanation see Silisquish's keep vote above.--Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 20:05, 15 October 2008 (BST)

7. Kill - to harsh Sanpedro 23:46, 15 October 2008 (BST)

   REFair enough. But too harsh to who exactly? --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 09:58, 16 October 2008 (BST)

8. Kill - It will take just few more AP too ruin (3) but it could take a lot more AP to rebuild. The ratio isn't fair. - ~~

   RE Until this is struck for being unsigned I have some points. It takes zombies 5ap to do something it takes survivors 1ap to repair. After 5 days it takes survivors 5ap. So it is unfair (as you put it) before this time for zombies and unfair after this time to survivors. This suggestion would change this ratio so after 4 days it would then be unfair to survivors. After 1 day, it would make the ratio much worse for zombies. (Wow. Im almost annoyed about this. Another suggestion crashes and burns. I might submit a flak degradation suggestion now that the main reason it cant be implemented is gone. )--Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 18:27, 16 October 2008 (BST)

9. Kill - I dont think malls should decay faster than any other building, nor do i think we should discourage people from going to the mall.--Tjayh913 01:02, 18 October 2008 (BST)

Spam/Dupe Votes

1. Spam - I just don't follow the reasoning. You say you want to move survivors away from malls and to other TRPs. There's a problem with that, though: things are easier to find in malls. That's why survivors congregate there and attempt to hold onto malls: it's tactically a wise thing to do, even if just for the high FAK find rates (never mind the ammo). On the other hand, creating more reasons to be precious about malls (as this suggestion does) will make them even more of a focal point of conflict. Therefore, in trying to move survivors away, this suggestion would actually do the opposite. Also, it's a shot in the foot for river tactics, as it would promote the holding of a mall over letting it go until the horde has passed. (And that last point reinforces the previous one.) --Funt Solo ^QT 20:47, 8 October 2008 (BST)

   RE To quote myself "i think it would be interesting to see whether it encouraged zombies to salt the land more, or encourage survivors to retake quickly, or move away from malls to other trp's (the horror!)" I don't want players to do anything, im just curious what they will do. But yes, a lot of what you say above could, and would happen. (I maintain that funt should spend more time on talk:suggestions as he does explain things without imploding.) --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 21:03, 8 October 2008 (BST)

   Re - FUCKING GRAAAAGHHH! *POP* (Just noting that I only put this in the Spam section because I don't see myself ever voting Keep on it, not because I think it's ridiculous. Also - too busy with other projects to take part in talk:suggestions except in passing.) --Funt Solo ^QT 23:12, 8 October 2008 (BST)

---

Voting Rules

Current Suggestions Advice to Suggesters Adding options to your suggestion is not good practice. Others will not vote on the options, only the main body; please don't ask them to do so. Once you have posted your suggestion, it is considered complete. Altering the suggestion mechanics after voting has begun nullifies existing votes, and is considered an abuse of the suggestions system. Doing so will result in your suggestion being removed from the voting system to removed suggestions, where you can work out the details and resubmit later if you desire. It is preferred that you remove your own suggestion and resubmit a new version with changes, if changes are needed. "Notes" added for clarification purposes, and correcting spelling/typos are permitted. When considering adding a clarification note, it is often better for all parties involved, for the author to remove the suggestion and resubmit it with the clarification included for the voters who have already placed their votes. Advice to Voters You are voting on Suggestions, not Users. The text of your vote should not personally attack or denigrate the user who has submitted it... no matter how ridiculous the idea. Flaming and/or Trolling will not be tolerated. Before voting please read the Suggestions Dos and Do Nots and Frequently Suggested Ideas Page to read about concepts that have been generally considered unworkable in the past. You do not need to follow the guidelines on these pages but they are worth consideration before casting a vote. One vote per user. No exceptions. You cannot use multiple wiki accounts to vote on a suggestion. To Vote, use the [edit] button at the top of the voting section, then enter your vote in the the proper format to the end of the relevant section (keep/kill/spam). It is strongly recommended that voters (especially in the kill/spam sections) justify their vote to help others understand the reason they disagree. Feedback helps new suggesters get a feel for what the community does and does not want included in Urban Dead, and a deeper understanding of the balance needed for a workable suggestion. Votes must include a signature in order to be considered valid votes. To sign a vote, use --~~~~. Please remember to sign your votes! Unsigned votes will be deleted after 30 minutes or when found. Each Suggestion will be open to voting for two (2) weeks, measured from the suggestion's Timestamp, unless it is a Dupe or Spam. If, at the end of that time, there are two thirds (2/3) more Keep votes than Kill votes, the Suggestion will be moved to the Peer Reviewed Suggestions page. Otherwise, the Suggestion will be moved to the Peer Rejected Suggestions page.

Rules for Discussions Votes are NOT the place to discuss Suggestions. This page and archived suggestion pages only to be used for the Suggesting and subsequent Voting of these suggestions. If you wish to discuss the suggestion or vote here, please use this page's Talk page (Suggestion talk:20081008 Wear and Tear). Suggestions do not have to be submitted in order to discuss them. Developing Suggestions can be used to workshop possible suggestions before they are submitted.

Valid Votes Keep, for Suggestions that you believe have merit. Kill, for Suggestions that you believe do not have merit. If you need to discuss a rule fix, use the discussion page. Spam, for the most ridiculous suggestions. Suggestions can be removed with Spam votes as described on the cycling suggestions page. If the criterion described there are not fulfilled, the suggestion must remain for the whole two weeks. Spam votes are not a "strong kill", they are simply here to prevent the utterly ridiculous from clogging up the system. If you do not like the idea, and it's not some crazy uber power or something else ridiculous, VOTE KILL, NOT SPAM. Spam votes will be counted as Kill when votes are tallied. Dupe, for Suggestions that are exact or very close duplicates of previous suggestions. For a Dupe vote to be valid, a link must be provided to the original suggestion. Dupe votes can be used to remove suggestions as described on the cycling suggestions page. Dupe votes will not be counted when votes are tallied. Humourous, for suggestions that are obviously intended to be satirical, or of comedic value only.}} Suggestions can be removed with Humourous votes as described on the cycling suggestions page. If the criterion described there are not fulfilled, the suggestion must remain for the whole two weeks.

Invalid Votes Server Load and Programming Complexity are NOT very good Kill reasons. You are voting on the merit of the suggestion and whether or not you think it belongs in the game. Server load/complexity issues are up to Kevan to decide. X should be implemented first is not a valid reason for a vote. You are voting on the merit of THIS suggestion, not how it compares to others. Votes that do not have reasoning behind them are invalid. You MUST justify your vote.

Comments Re may be used to comment on a vote. Only the original author and the person being REd can comment. Comments are restricted to a single comment per vote, and it is expected that Re comments be as short as possible. Reing every kill vote is considered abuse of the Re comment. A Re does not count as a vote, and any subsequent discussion not part of the Re comment should be held on the discussion page if there is any extended commenting. Note is used by System Operators to invalidate trolling-based votes. Only Sysops may remove troll-based votes and they do so with a strikeout <s></s> in order to preserve the trolling removal for posterity. The voter may contest the strikeout with the Sysop that struck their vote out on the discussion page. Only a System Operator may remove a strikeout.

All Caps Try to avoid YELLING, writing in bold, or using italics, except when emphasizing a point which has escaped other voters.

VOTING EXAMPLES Keep Votes Keep - I am the author and I am allowed to vote once on my own suggestions. --MrSuggester 05:01, 11 Nov 2005 (GMT) Keep - Best. Suggestion. Evar. --Bob_Zombie 04:01, 11 Nov 2005 (GMT) Keep - Good sugestion. no signature --FakeSuggester 07:39, 15 Nov 2005 (GMT) Kill Votes Kill - This is a terrible idea, but you can totally fix it up. --NegativeGal 06:01, 12 Nov 2005 (GMT) Re - Please be more specific about how to fix it on the discussion page. --MrSuggester 14:01, 12 Nov 2005 (GMT) Re - Sure, I have detailed my proposed fixes here. --NegativeGal 23:38, 12 Nov 2005 (GMT) Kill - You will eat my poopie and love it! --PooEater 11:12, 13 Nov 2005 (GMT) Note - Inane vote removed. Defend in discussion. --DaModerator 11:13, 13 Nov 2005 (GMT) Spam/Dupe Votes Spam - Kung Fu CB Mama on Wheels is an inappropriate Survivor Class. --NoFunAtAll 09:01, 12 Nov 2005 (GMT) Dupe - Duplicate Suggestion --AnotherSuggester 05:01, 14 Nov 2005 (GMT)