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| ===06:59, 23 April 2006 (BST)=== | | ===06:59, 23 April 2006 (BST)=== |
| Straight up vandalism, deleting a community announcement that was supported by some kind folks who thought it was important [http://wiki.urbandead.com/index.php?title=Template%3AComannounce&diff=212367&oldid=212341 here]. A slap on the wrist might be necissary just to let Grim s know he's not the judge of what's "garbage" and what's a useful community announcement. Last I checked this was a Wiki and unless there are rules written otherwise, any user may add community announcements if they are worth adding. Also guilty is [http://wiki.urbandead.com/index.php?title=Template:Comannounce&diff=prev&oldid=211453 another party], though the Moderator should be held to higher standards. If someone wants to make a vandal report on the other user, I think it's best if they do it as opposed to me. -- [[User:Amazing|Amazing]] 06:59, 23 April 2006 (BST)
| | '''[[UDWiki:Administration/Misconduct/Archive/Grim s/200604]]''' |
| *Except you aren't the judge of what's worth putting up there either, and that announcment was purely to feed your ego. Also that announcment was clearly written with a bias. This Case phails--[[User:Mpaturet|Mpaturet]] 07:03, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| **Please refrain from trolling on this page. If there was any bias, it could be edited out. Deletion was not appropriate. -- [[User:Amazing|Amazing]] 07:05, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| ***As much as I loathe to admit it, he's right about editing it to be appropriate. Funny...this sounds farmiliar. --{{User:Mia Kristos/sig}} 07:07, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| ****Chalk it up to "live and learn". -- [[User:Amazing|Amazing]] 07:09, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| **However, it could be said that the page-creator would have some say, and they apparently [http://wiki.urbandead.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Mia_Kristos/Amazing&diff=212301&oldid=212294 thought that it should be allowed to stay]... but hey, I don't think Grim S is actually in the wrong- I think the petition should be whiped anyway. --[[User:Karlsbad|Karlsbad]] 07:08, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| ***Yeah, I agree it should be deleted - BUT - if it's allowed to stay, we certainly need as many people voting as possible since it sets a VERY big precedent. -- [[User:Amazing|Amazing]] 07:10, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| ****I think you are wrong Amazing; it only sets a precident if it was in the Policy Discussion section. Otherwise its useless drek. -- [[User:Karlsbad|Karlsbad]] 07:11, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| *****Don't get me wrong, I agree on the last part - But if a Mod takes action based on the drek, then future cases of a similar nature will ''probably'' be filed since all you need is one person who dislikes the behavior of another person - and by then it'll be proven that, yes, you can be banned for being 'aggrivating.' But that's my own opinion, I'm not saying it's the only right one. I just think that if anything comes of this stuff, it'll be cited like crazy because people will see an opportinity to 'save the wiki' from whoever is the dramabomb of the moment. -- [[User:Amazing|Amazing]] 07:16, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| ***As soon as that whole proposition thing pulls through, I'm removing the petition from my User space. --{{User:Mia Kristos/sig}} 07:12, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| *You and Mia wanted to keep it. Not surprisingly it was a petition ''by'' Mia ''about'' you. Its not a policy vote yet so it can't reasonably be said to effect all users. If it passed in its current form ''nothing would happen''. Not to mention misconduct only applies to moderator powers and not percieved vandalism, and that it was a good faith edit. You can't just submit everybody to moderation the second you disagree with something they did. --[[User:Zaruthustra|Zaruthustra]]-<font size=-3>[[Moderation|Mod]]</font> 07:13, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| **This is a Wiki and folks are allowed to post info. What's not allowed according to letter and spirit of the rules is deleting it without cause. He's officially a successful Moderator candidate, so the Misconduct page applies. Also, please keep your personal feelings out of this. (Also, does the "you can't submit everyone when you disagree with what they did" thing sound a little silly to anyone else? Just curious if it's only me.) As a mere side-note, what tells us if the vandalism was an edit or a roll-back, if anything? -- [[User:Amazing|Amazing]] 07:16, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| ***<p>Err, I'm not sure how that follows. Moderator Abilities, by their virtue, are abilities that Moderators have and regular users don't. If he had deleted the entire Template, or even if the Template was protected and Grim edited it (ie performed an action that no regular user could perform) then I'd be satisfied that he had used a Moderator ability. The removal of the notice, while technically a "deletion" in the widest sense of the term, was more technically an "edit", and more precisely an edit of a page that was not protected.</p><p>For future reference, the following are Moderator Abilities (ie things that Moderators can do that Regular Users cannot):</p>
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| ****Deletion (ie complete removal, as opposed to blanking) of pages (including Images and any other page-like construct on this wiki), through the delete tab on the top of any deletable construct
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| ****Undeletion (ie returning a page, complete with page history) of pages (including any other page-like construct on this wiki (Images are not included as deletion of an image is not undoable), through the undelete tab on the top of any undeletable construct
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| ****Protection of pages (ie removing the ability of regular users to edit or move a particular page), through the protect tab on the top of any protectable construct
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| ****Banning of Users (ie removing the ability of a specific user to edit the wiki), through the Block User page.
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| ****Editing of Protected pages by any means.
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| ****(Bureaucrats Only) Promotion (providing the above abilites) of User to Sysop/Bureaucrat status.
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| ***These are not "just created" by myself, but are technical limits set forth by the wiki software. Moderators do not, by dint of their Moderator status, have every action of theirs suddenly accountable to new systems, and this page is specifically set up to deal with abuses of these five specific abilities (and the related issue of attempting to use the threat of these abilities as a stick to enforce a Moderator's will on the wiki). In this case, I do not believe that Grim has used any of these five technical abilities, nor has he threatened the use of any of these five technical abilities to enforce his will on the wiki. -- [[User:Odd Starter|Odd Starter]] <sup> [[User talk:Odd Starter|talk]] • [[Moderation|Mod]] • [[Project Welcome|W!]]</sup> 09:04, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| ****Answer the roll-back question. -- [[User:Amazing|Amazing]] 19:15, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| *****The rollback button leaves very distinct text in the description of the edit, specifically: "(Reverted edit of <name>, changed back to last version by <name2>). My edit clearly was described as: (Removing garbage). Even if i had used the rollback button, you are seriously stretching the definition of mod abuse, and in any case you would have to prove that the edit was made in bad faith, and thus vandalism in the first place. --[[User:Grim s|Grim s]]-<sup>[[Moderation|Mod]]</sup> 19:22, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| Ok, ill bite. Which one of my moderator abilities did i abuse? --[[User:Grim s|Grim s]]-<sup>[[Moderation|Mod]]</sup> 07:34, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| :After some careful investigation i can conclude that i used NONE of my moderator abilities in deleting the nonsense about a trivial petition that isnt binding from a community announcements template (Because it isnt announcement worthy. If it were in Policy Discussion, sure, then it could be up there, if suitably NPOVised). Hell, i didnt even use the rollback button (As evidenced by the fact i made a comment in my deletion of the thing), so absiolutely none of my moderator powers were used. I wish to make the claim that bringing this here is an '''abuse''' of the misconduct page. If you really wanted to push for it you should have tried Vandal banning. --[[User:Grim s|Grim s]]-<sup>[[Moderation|Mod]]</sup> 07:53, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| :On a lighter note, it seems that i no longer need this on my userpage:
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| {| style="margin: 0 2em 0 2em;border:solid blue 2px;" width=250 align="center"
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| | rowspan=2 | [[Image:Amazing_666sm.gif]] || style="background:yellow; color:blue; " align="center" | '''zOMG! MOD ABUSE! '''
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| | align="center" style="font-size: 90%;" | This User is waiting for [[User:Amazing|Amazing]] to accuse him of Mod abuse.
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| |}
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| :And i only put it up 13 hours ago... --[[User:Grim s|Grim s]]-<sup>[[Moderation|Mod]]</sup> 07:56, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| ::What don't you get about the bullying stipulation '''in the guidelines for this page'''? Are you actually trying to instigate another report for whatever reason? You're a complete joke of a Moderator, and that trickles down to everyone who supported you. -- [[User:Amazing|Amazing]] 19:15, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| :::Where did i bully you? --[[User:Grim s|Grim s]]-<sup>[[Moderation|Mod]]</sup> 19:29, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| ::::The Urban Dead Wiki. ;) Dude, you walked into that. -- [[User:Amazing|Amazing]] 19:38, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| :::::Once again Amazing demonstrates he doesnt have a leg to stand on. That seems to be par for the course on this page. --[[User:Grim s|Grim s]]-<sup>[[Moderation|Mod]]</sup> 20:03, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| I'm not convinced that a misconduct has occured here, for reasons that I have listed above. -- [[User:Odd Starter|Odd Starter]] <sup> [[User talk:Odd Starter|talk]] • [[Moderation|Mod]] • [[Project Welcome|W!]]</sup> 09:04, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| :As I say, answer the roll-back question. -- [[User:Amazing|Amazing]] 19:15, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| ::The rollback button leaves very distinct text in the description of the edit, specifically: "(Reverted edit of <name>, changed back to last version by <name2>). My edit clearly was described as: (Removing garbage). Even if i had used the rollback button, you are seriously stretching the definition of mod abuse, and in any case you would have to prove that the edit was made in bad faith, and thus vandalism in the first place. --[[User:Grim s|Grim s]]-<sup>[[Moderation|Mod]]</sup> 19:22, 23 April 2006 (BST) (Copied from above)
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| :::You proved the 'bad faith' nature in your commanty with the edit. -- [[User:Amazing|Amazing]] 19:38, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| ::::Um... no. I felt that what was there was garbage and did not belong on the page, my comment reflected that. --[[User:Grim s|Grim s]]-<sup>[[Moderation|Mod]]</sup> 19:42, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| :::::Just FYI - I don't really think anyone believes that. That's not to say anything will be said/done about it, but that's pretty obvious baloney. -- [[User:Amazing|Amazing]] 19:48, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| ::::::So now your entire case boils down to, essentially, "I think you are a liar". Well, consider this: I am the most qualified to know what im thinking. Personally, im wondering why you didnt go after [[User:Nubis|Nubis]] for deleting the exact same thing earlier, or [[User:Odd Starter|Odd Starter]] for deleting it yet again. After all, you have singled me out for doing something others have already done. I feel confident in stating, unequivocally, that you are the bully in this case, for singling me out with this ''ludicrous'' claim of misconduct when two other people have done the same thing with not even a peep out of you. --[[User:Grim s|Grim s]]-<sup>[[Moderation|Mod]]</sup> 19:59, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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| Grim did nothing that a user couldnt have done. He simply deleted Mia's petition from the community announcements, something that any user could have done the sam. Even if he had used the rollback button (which he clearly didnt), it still wouldnt be a great deal, since that button is simply a shortcut button, that only mods can use, to revert pages. --{{User:Hagnat/sig}} 21:36, 23 April 2006 (BST)
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