Suggestion talk:20071127 Dodge

Paranoia

Timestamp:	ShadowScope 00:44, 22 November 2007 (UTC)
Type:	Skill.
Scope:	Surviors
Description:	In all zombie movies, your worst enemy is always your fellow human. At least the zombies don't stab you in the back. This skill "Paranoia" is a Zombie Hunter skill, represent a ZHer's main goal of surivial first in a zombie apoc. This skill represents players getting afraid of your fellow human being and taking precautions against him. (The actual benieft...uh...it will defend a person from being PKed. Possibl ideas: A person who is paranoid will have a 5% chance of dodging any attacks against him/her...a 40% reduction in damage...a free Flak Jacket like effect...etc.). However, if you buy Paranoia, you will unbuy Headshot. You are afraid of mankind, and your struggle against man makes you forget your struggles against Zombies, and you lose your ability to do more damage to them. When you re-buy Headshot, Paranoia will be unbought. A tactical desicion is hereby made, of wheter you should be on the offense (attacking Zeds) or on the defense (being afraid).

Discussion (Paranoia)

Doesn't sound too-too bad, although it does nerf pking a bit, might not be liked by some.--Zach016 01:58, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

That's not really too much of a problem as long as it doesn't nerf PKing too much (exactly how much is of course up to interpretation...). Also, this benefits PKers as well because it protects them against bounty hunters (or people out for revenge). I'm not so sure I like the idea of unbuying headshot and then rebuying it. High level characters could easily do that pretty much at will until their stock of extra XP ran out, giving them an (unfair?) advantage over mid level characters. Overall I would favor a skill like this. You might want to check out some earlier versions of anti-PK skills that have gone up in the past to get an idea of what things were and weren't liked. There was a point when we got at least one a day. Some were really bad, others had merit. --Uncle Bill 03:13, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

If... big if... if this were a good idea, and you were to impliment this, un-buying Headshot would be PERMENANT. Now the problem with this is that it actually BUFFS Pkers and Bounty Hunters (they are the same thing, functionally) vs. regular survivors, not the other way around. A lot. Every PKer will get this skill to make themselves immune to survivors who wish to sell them the farm. No way. PKers if organised can already instill fear and paranoia into their victims, by means of their actions. And PKers are a legit way of playing, but they are still a sub-class of survivors, not a class unto themselves. Adding this game mechanic is both out of genre -- which is survivors vs. zombies with a dash of infighting amongst the former -- and a very unbalancing PKer buff. --WanYao 06:43, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

You know, even if this was a general nerf to PKing, I like it. You would need to set the XP cost higher/ limit changing, otherwise people could happily shoot zombies and then buy this before they log off. With massive stocks of XP you could pull that off for quite some time. --Karloth Vois ^RR 11:01, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps I am wrong here, but I really think that in the long run this would benefit PKers... PKers specialise in PKing -- they do little else but attack people, scrounge and and hide, am I wrong? -- so the increased difficulty of killing a few people who have this skill would be a minor annoyance at best. But since PKers rarely fight zombies, they would not care about losing Headshot, and they would all buy this skill -- as a powerful DEFENSE against retaliation. Meanwhile, the average survivor who splits his AP between scrounging, cading, reviving and killing zombies, etc. -- and who usually retaliates against PKers only on opportunistic basis, if he has AP to spare -- will be quite nerfed by this. Thus it is actually a PKer BUFF, not a nerf. Cunning therefore that Karloth would support it :) --WanYao 11:22, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

I don't think the "Headshot" trade-off is realistic. If you are paranoid, you can stil be a good shot and know a zombies weak points. If your paranoia keeps you from sleeping well, you'd get worse at EVERYTHING, not just shooting zombies in the skull.
How about as an alternative, anybody at 75% encumbrance or less is 10% harder to hit with a gun, because they can quickly run for cover? This would mean PKers can't generally use it as a defense (they load up on guns), nor could zombie hunters (also loaded with guns). However, most "support characters" can run quite effectively with only a 75% load, only going over that when they are very well stocked. It also seems logical that if you were having little luck scrounging for gear, you might be paranoid, while people who are living high on the hog in mall, loaded down with gear, might let their gaurd slip. (And no, I would NOT have this affect melee combat, because HtH attacks are by far the minority for PKers, and also the only thing zombies can typically use. By the time somebody is at HtH range, you can drop your extra baggage to fight.)  Swiers 17:16, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

I like this idea. It would force PKers, bounty hunters, and everyone who wants the bonus to think smart in the terms of ammo vs guns (I mean carrying guns instead of ammo. Might want to lower the encumbrance level though (seems a bit easy to achieve), though not by too much. - Whitehouse 18:46, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

This might sound a bit complicated, but how about two sides to it? -5% accuracy with guns if your target is at less than 75% encumbrance, and -5% accuracy with guns if you are over 75% encumbrance. This way you are rewarded if your target packs heavy and you pack light in terms of attacking too. I don't know, just a thought. - Whitehouse 18:51, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

I really like swiers' idea, thanks.--ShadowScope 19:40, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

Keep, because the "get rid of headshot" explanation was so good, and it helps zeds. BoboTalkClown 02:55, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

WanYao does make a point, i was thinking from a perspective of the current system, this would be quite a buff to pking, which really isn't required as it's effective as is, so it comes down on the general pro-survivor population at the same time as uping the zombie side a bit through a survivor bought skill (wierd way to work anyone?).--Zach016 03:25, 23 November 2007 (UTC)

I'd vote keep just because it's a choice skill. - Pardus 15:37, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

Get rid of the damage reduction, and I'm for it (unrealistic - if a bullet hits you, a bullet hits you; dodging for less damage is a ninja skill). 5% for dodging alone is not a significant PK buff, and I like the endless trading between Headshot and Paranoia. Finally, make the 5% dodging vs. survivors alone - Paranoia shouldn't help against zombies, you already KNOW they're out to get you!--Actingupagain 15:06, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

First of all, I don't like the headshot trade off (I like Sweir's idea). Also, what are we exactly discussing? Possibilities? Come up with some concrete ideas.--Pesatyel 19:09, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

concrete ideas are for a final suggestion, this whole page is possiblities and open to change.--Zach016 03:42, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

True, but I don't like when the author doesn't really have anything and expect us to do that work. Instead it should be the author coming up with his ideas and we discuss them, not come up with the ideas for him. I have no problem with discussion. But this is more like circular discussion without context in a way. I dunno. I'd just like to know what the author's idea is for us to discuss.--Pesatyel 09:59, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

seemed solid enough for disscusion to me, the idea was there, it just wasen't the best.--Zach016 23:21, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

---