User:HighGenGrue/Why The Suggestion System Sucks: A rant by HighGenGrue and Asema
The current suggestions system is very flawed, which is why most suggestions are show down the crapper.
There are several reasons for this issue, all of which combine to form an insane clusterfuck of rules lawyering, system gaming, and antipathic nerdrage.
BIAS LOL
Yeah, we're biased. We're going to use names. We're not lying. We really don't like people. But our points still stand.
On the Subject of Spam as a Strong Kill
The system advocates the use of spam for ridiculous suggestions; the greatest and most monumental issue is the subjectivity of ridiculous suggestions. What one man may find a reasonable, but unworthy idea the other will find a waste of time and energy.
And the subject of Dupe.
Once a person has voted dupe, with a link, YOU DIE. Seriously. Even if a suggestion is simillar to the old one, people can and WILL dupe it if it has the same basic idea. A tweak of numbers, maybe a difference in the way sometihng happens, it's always considered "not significant" and the suggestion is tossed out. What could fix this is the idea of the Undupe vote. (here). This would have been a great way to combat a mass duperoll of sheeping.
As well, once someone pastes a dupe, and someone feels it isn't a dupe, it always seems to be a dupe. As well, I felt a suggestion was NOT a dupe. I used Undupe as I had felt that it wasn't a dupe...
- Undupe I'm not SURE if this is where UNdupe goes, but correct me if I'm wrong, admins. This is NOT, I repeat, NOT a dupe of that suggestion. This suggestion allows you to repair for 30 AP if it's above 31 AP to repair, while Hagnat's suggestion gives you 1 AP/1 Repair. EDIT: And 20 AP/20 Repair. --High Gen. Grue Talk 18:07, 29 July 2008 (BST)
- Dupe: There is no such vote as "Undupe", HighGenGrue. If you think it's not a dupe, then just vote for it in another section, either Keep or Kill, or even Spam. As for the acutal suggestion, I don't really see the need to change it until later on. I'm not going to call harmans overpowered, because they aren't. The game balance is alright for now, though, and I don't want any tinkering with it. So it would have been a Kill, except for the fact that this new suggestion is likely a duplicate of the previous suggestion. Differnet mechanics, but same basic idea=Dupe.--ShadowScope'the true enemy' 18:17, 29 July 2008 (BST)
On the matter, it WAS in Spam. Either way, I find the dupe vote VERY broken [ed: yeah, it does 50 HP of damage to the suggestion, after all].
Also, dupes have been used because they have the same NAME as a previous suggestion, even though they're competley different from the past suggestion (Flashlights anyone?)
Also, dupes are used on suggestions two years old, even if the suggestion actually adresses a new problem. (Dark Buildings)
Why the people are flawed and making the system suck
Take, for example, this suggestions talk idea. A simple request to fix what may or may not have been an intended aftereffect of the ruin system. And yet, people flipped out, began seething with steaming nerdrage not unlike that of a thousand hot melting Stygian coals, and directly flaming (oh, wait, harshly criticizing) the idea.
And I quote:
No one is "angry". But your suggestion sucks b/c it screws over zombies and death cultists and shows a real lack of forethought and knowledge of the game. Such lack of forethought, combined with the fact that we have to address this spammy suggestion and waste our time and enery on it = kind of rude and inconsiderate on your part. Like, if you expect us to treat you seriously and be "nice", then put in the effort for your idea not to be ridiculous and sucky. Then we actually don't get "angry"... Anyway, its suckiness deserves harsh criticism. Period. Now, deal. --WanYao 01:06, 5 August 2008 (BST)
Nobody's angry. Fine, I think we can deal with that. Oh, my suggestion sucks.. hrm. Constructive. Thanks for the tip-off. How's about an idea on how to BLOODY FIX IT? Jeez. It screws over zombies and death cultists... so does every other suggestion that doesn't buff you twits (that means you too, survivors). Lack of forethought... sure. I'll spend a few days meditating on an idea for a simplistic online game with two sides and few dynamics. That you have-- wait, what the...? You don't have to. Go take a fucking breather, dude. And you're not spending any time nor energy (save the gushing burst you release when you see a new suggestion posted to the page; how dare anybody suggest change to MY precious game!), Kind of rude and inconsiderate... no. It's not. See above point. If anything, you're being rude and inconsiderate of the fact some people might not spend three thirds of their life on this wiki. Treat you seriously... that's something you might want people to do for you. I wonder why nice is in quotation marks, by the way. I would think effort was put in. At least, as much effort as your inflammatory remarks. I thought you didn't get angry. Harsh criticism. Oh, that's what it is. I thought it was unabashed flaming and trolling.
And that, gentlemen, is not just WanYao, but it's nearly every user who regularly visits the wiki's suggestions page.
Addendum: The Scare Factor
Flaming like the above prevents a user from improving. Why, exactly? There's no constructive feedback; there's only particularly well aimed, seething anger that prevents a newbie from growing in expertise and quite possibly making the Implemented Suggestions category less of a spit in the ocean. Sometimes, I think that's the intent.
Common Excuses
Spam/Kill (Basically the same ATM anyways)
- Nerfs X - No, it nerfs YOUR X, and that's all you really care about.
- Gameplay > Realism - No. While this is a game, you're not doing jack shit to fit the flavor of such an idea. In a real apocalypse, I'd be able to lock the doors. They'd also be destroyable. I'd be able to use an assault rifle. I'd also get one-shotted. If I didn't have n other projects on my plate at the moment, I would make a game with these credentials just to spite you all. If you say this, I'll probably come to your house and shank your goldfish. YES, YOUR GOLDFISH. YOU HEARD ME RIGHT.
- Genre inappropriate - So's your complete lack of sensibilities as to what should go into this game. O HAI CONTRADICTIONS, I'M AD HOMINEMS
- SURVIVORS DON'T NEED ANOTHER ___________ Actually, I'd say they DO. Some more flavor items would be nice, a rifle that has the same stats as a Shotgun with a clip is nice for flavors, the Trenchcoat that can hold KATANAS would be nice. I feel that a game cannot have enough items that could provide the ser with a more flvaor scenario, and why the fuck DON'T survivors need this assault rifle/comb/crossbow/whatever?
- This suggestion sucks and is the stupidest suggestion I've ever seen. Notably from some sysops, this vote is often used as a spam/kill. REASONING KTHXBAI.
- Read the fucking Suggestion Dos and Don'ts you fucktard (because this is one of those suggestions that come up so often Actually, these are duped/spammed regardless of the actual suggestion because it involves anything on the list of DEAD IN THE WATER stuff.
Fun Facts
- Five articles in Implemented Suggestions.
- Two-hundred eighty four (284) in Peer Rejected Suggestions.
- You all suck.
On the subject of banning us
Go right ahead. I don't think we've said much worse than most of you, though.
