Talk:Suggestions/8th-Dec-2006

Gravedigger

Timestamp:	Matt Scott 9 19:38, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
Type:	Class, Item, & Skill
Scope:	All players
Description:	This starts with a new civilian character class, but also introduces a new item and skill. New Civilian Class: Gravedigger The character class would be a Gravedigger. The Gravedigger would start out at a cemetery with a shovel (see below) and a -- I don't know -- a beer? Because if you were on a graveyard nightshift when the zombie outbreak in Malton occurred, wouldn't you be boozing it up? New Item: Shovel A shovel has been suggested before, but it was way overpowered. I'm suggesting a weapon that would fall somewhere between a fireaxe and a knife in accuracy and damage. Let's say 15% accuracy (better than an ax, because really who could miss with the broad end of a shovel, but less than a knife because it's still less precise), and 3 damage. I'm rounding up the damage, because you wouldn't be able to gain any proficiency in it, so you could never have more than 30% accuracy (with hand-to-hand combat). No special "bury dead" abilities or other nonsense. Find 'em at mall hardware stores, cemeteries, etc. New Skill: Drag body (Player is able to move a dead body 1 square away) A gravedigger would start out with this skill, and other survivors would be able to buy this skill. Works much like Dump Body in a building, but only works for bodies outside. When you are outside a building with a body, a Drag Body button appears. By clicking the Drag Body button, you are basically carrying the body, and the Drag Body button becomes a Drop Body button (so you can't pick up more than one body). Players can perform other actions without penalty, with one condition: You may move only one square with the body before dropping it (dead bodies are heavy, don't you know). This means, every square moved with a body requires 3 actions: Pick it up, move one, and drop it, pick it up, move one, and drop it. If someone attempts to move an additional square while carrying the body, then they move to that square but leave the body behind. This way the body could only be dragged a maximum of 16 squares away in 50AP. Flavor text for the body could recap who dragged them and which direction. The "dragger" gets 1XP for dragging a body (just like dumping), again this would be limited to 16XP max in a 50AP cycle. This would only work outside to prevent free-running with bodies, but a player could drag a body indoors if they wanted.

Discussion

Keep

1. Author Keep - Because. --Matt Scott ⁹ 19:38, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
2. Keep - People voting kill just want forts to stay in zombie hands.--Labine50 ^MH|^ME|^P 20:19, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
3. keep There's 300 bodies in 1 square right outside giddings mall right now, and you KNOW they are going to all stand up at once. I'd like to spread them out a bit. Plus, a griefer could drag a body INTO a safehouse -- there's a game variant for you! Asheets 21:25, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
4. Keep- I could just imagine DEM personal carting away their friends who died in the assualt. I like it.-Axe27 20:19, 18 December 2006 (PST)

Kill

1. Foreboding - This isn't going to be pretty--Gene Splicer 19:50, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
   • RE: - Hey, tear me a new one, I can handle it. I haven't seen anything like it before, so I figured I'd give it a go. --Matt Scott ⁹ 20:04, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Spam

1. Ding Dong - don't move my character - sing it with me now! --Funt Solo 19:51, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
   • RE: - Dump Body is already in the game, this just takes it to its logical next step. --Matt Scott ⁹ 20:08, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

   • Re - there's a key difference between moving someone's character into or out of a building (in the same square) and moving them between squares. In my opinion, this goes too far. --Funt Solo 21:47, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

2. spam shit man you guys beat me to it by seconds! I like the shovel bit though if its any comfort to you Matt?--Honestmistake 19:54, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
   • RE: - Actually, it is. I was hoping at least one thing would stick. --Matt Scott ⁹ 20:04, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
3. Spam - *joins in Funt's singing* Seriously though, the drag body thing has been suggested time and time again and has failed. Its dead in the water, and dupey, at the same time.--Mr yawn 19:55, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
   • RE: - I searched and surprisingly couldn't find anything that didn't have to do with carting bodies as if they were newspapers. I was trying to come up with something that's balanced. And I see nothing resembling this on the Dead in the Water list. --Matt Scott ⁹ 20:06, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
     • Re - Pied Piper Skills --Lord of the Pies 20:25, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
     • Okay - Thanks Lord of the Pies, I see your meaning, but we are encouraged to come up with workable variants of items on the list, so I guess this is mine. --Matt Scott ⁹ 20:36, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
4. The 'pied piper' skills are often suggested, and usually spaminated out of existence. They're just too easy to abuse, and I've only seen one (nursing) that was actually viable. As for a new character, firstly I think there are enough survivor characters already without making the choice more complicated, and secondly, it'd be a bit bizarre to have thousands of occupational Gravediggers. --ExplodingFerret 21:38, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Spaminate/Nuke from orbit Some things aren't done. Dragging bodies bodes bad. I know your typing this up against zombies, so I'll use it against you so you get the picture. Your in a revive que, and just got syringed. Your now a reviving corpse, but to the untrained eye (a harman eye) your a corpse, with the potential to be a zombie to eat the mall. So he and his friends TEAM UP and drag you to the RRF's headquarters. Your screwed. Or worse, zombie players use human alts to do this. And they take you to the lower left hand corner of town where nothing happens. Nasty, isn't it? - Terra 12:07, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

Just noticed this is your second suggestion and so probably shouldn't be here... its dead anyway but you want to be carefull some people will remove it straight away if they notice and next time it might be a better idea.--Honestmistake 23:35, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Told you...--Honestmistake 23:52, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

• Honest mistake - Thanks for moving this. I surely don't want to draw the wrath of the mods. New to Wiki communities -- I know that's a lame excuse, but cut me some slack, K? Perhaps I'll start my suggestions from now on here on the discussion page (which I didn't really know much about before now, when I noticed this had been moved to "Discussion" I couldn't find it anywhere!) --Matt Scott ⁹ 00:24, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

RE I couldn't find the page at 1st either, it needs a link from the main page. As for moving it, that wasn't me I wouldn't even know how! You can thank Funt Solo for that. Don't be discouraged though as at least your suggestion showed that you had put in some thought. Just cos this was never going to fly doesn't mean that the next one won't... do put them on this page first though, at least until you start getting positive feedback. The people here can be harsh but most are fair and if it sinks here it will probably sink elsewhere.--Honestmistake 20:30, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

I like the idea of the shovel being a limited weapon, but the game does NOT need more weapons nobody uses (like the bat, pipe and crowbar). Survivors do NOT need another source of XP, especially one this relatively easy to get. Your view of "balanced" is off. All it does is require a person spend 3 AP to move a body. Imagine your character died and gets moved clear across the city. Zergers would LOVE this.--Pesatyel 02:40, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

I've just been trying to come up with some real "down-side" to dying as a zombie. People think AP-zapping is griefing, but honestly it makes sense because zombies are supposed to be slow. Anyway, this was kind of a round-about way to slow zombies down as well as protect our safehouses. Honestly, we need more skills similar to headshot, but they just can't be introduced here because everyone will call it spam. Eh, whatever. --Matt Scott ⁹ 03:02, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

What makes you think we need more skills similar to headshot? Do you honestly think it would be FUN for zombie players to log in and not have any AP to play with?--Pesatyel 04:16, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Dead and Buried - As the author I'm putting this one out of it's misery. I'm convinced that this one wouldn't pass in a vote, although I still like the idea. --Matt Scott ⁹ 04:25, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Too bad I got here late... this one looks interesting. It would have been even better if you could bury the body in a graveyard. (Costs a little extra AP to "come up out of the ground" but it would look completely bad ass!) But I agree with everyone else; this will never happen. --Uncle Bill 05:28, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

That's been suggested and rejected, not once but twice.--Pesatyel 07:18, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

I hate it when people comment before reading the whole post. Like I said, "A shovel has been suggested before, but it was way overpowered." The suggestion of the shovel was the one thing in this post that was not controversial. Remember, crying "Dupe" should be reserved for "exact or very close duplicates," not for those suggestions an author takes pains to hunt down similar variations and remove their more ridiculous attributes (especially when the author points this out to begin with). --Matt Scott ⁹ 13:58, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

I hate it when people comment before reading the discussion. I was COMMENTING on Uncle Bill's idea (about burying bodies) NOT your suggestion. I was hoping it would disuade him from suggsting his "completely bad ass" idea (but I appear to have been talking to the wrong person. I already had all I had to say about YOUR suggestion above.--Pesatyel 04:32, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

Touche. I read the discussion, but got a little flame-happy with your comment. Consider me put in my place! ;) --Matt Scott ⁹ 13:23, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

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New 'Steal' skill

Timestamp:	Darkvengance 20:10, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
Type:	Skill
Scope:	Humans
Description:	This would give the game an interesting twist knowing that some guy in the corner might steal one of your prized items while you sleep. Heres how it would work: You can only use the skill twice a day, when you use it you choose a Human player to use it on and there is a certain percentage that it may work (for example 20%) if it does work then you steal a random object from the player you used it on.

Discussion Don't touch my items! No matter what the risk is, I do not want to wake up missing a first aid kit or my shotgun. Don't touch other people's items! Kaylee Hans 22:56, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

...Its always bugged me that items are indestructable and unstealable but that is the way it is and you have less chance of changing that than you do of getting a nice comment from Xoid on this one (sorry Xoid!)--Honestmistake 23:38, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

I'd Spam this. It would be really bloody annoying. And anyway - items aren't transferable in this game. --Funt Solo 23:57, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

As solo. It could also be griefing. Now they could pick you clean and then dump you. -Mark 00:22, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Did you read the suggestion? You can only use it twice a day AND only against survivors. That having been said, while it would suck to lose items you guys forget that items are infinite (which kinda goes against even bothering stealing, but it appears to be more of an "RP" thing). The main problem is that while people bitch and whine about PKers and GKers, I doubt people would wanna have to start "thieves lists."--Pesatyel 02:43, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

• I read it. I'm talking about PKer groups. With enough people, they could rob someone clean, kill them, and dump them. Clarification enough? -Mark 02:14, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

It would make everyone live in a Mall, as well. Currently, I can go shopping at a mall, then go off on an extended expedition into the mall-lite areas of Malton. If people could steal all my kit, it'd be shite. --Funt Solo 11:31, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

I just think people aren't reading the suggestion. Take a look at nosimplehiway's comments. The stealing is random and is limited to twice per day to cut down on griefing. Of all the "trade" suggestions I've read, this is probably the best we can expect (short of full blown trading which would NEVER get accepted by the wiki, whether Kevan implements it or not). Even given that, this is STILL not going to work. There are just too many problems that would be unfixable (the zerg problem Mr. Yawn mentioned).--Pesatyel 20:54, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

This is a backdoor item exchange ability. "Steal my gennie if I can steal four of your FAKs." If you want item exchange, have the guts to call it item exchange. Just because items aren't currently transferable doesn't mean they shouldn't be, but this is a way of doing item exchange that encourages a new and more annoying form of griefing. (Not that griefing is necessarily forbidden in this game. GKers spring to mind.) What's your reasoning behind only being able to steal from survivors? Seems to me it should be as easy or easier to steal from a zombie or a dead body. In the genre, neither is generally known for their speed and alertness. Also, why, in game, would a thief be limited to twice a day?--Nosimplehiway 14:27, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

• Spam - This could be used by zergers for some mega-griefing fun. So no. And it would be ridiculously annoying to wake and and find zombies in my safehouse, and learn that some punk stole my pistol.--Mr yawn 16:27, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

We shouldn't turn survivors against each other. --Jon Pyre 19:46, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

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