Suggestion talk:20080304 Change Transmitter to Transceiver
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Discussion by Airborne88
Keep I have worked in communications and he is correct. However, good luck finding a transmitter anywhere that is not accompanied by a receiver. These terms are generally used to describe 2 parts of a whole "radio" (EX: the transmitter is broken but it receives just fine)One of the only places you would find a stand alone transmitter would be in say an FM Radio Broadcast Station. So, way to nit pick! Victory to the technicalities!(Want to get really deep: If it is "full duplex" we have to receive on one freq and transmit on another freq. Wouldn't that be fun)--Airborne88T Zom MIS 01:54, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- Suggestion- Could we institute tac sat hubs? Then we would have to multiplex and demultiplex data packages, and I'd like to watch everyone's heads explode in frustration!--Airborne88T Zom MIS 02:02, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- Another Suggestion It is physically impossible for an FM radio to transmit anymore than 30 miles due to LOS (Line of Sight)-The curvature of the earth deflect it off into space.. So, technically we need to set up "radio-relay-stations" (retransmitters) all over the city!! I can set 'em up for a small fee.--Airborne88T Zom MIS 02:09, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- Another Suggestion -Well, are you sure Malton is really that huge? How many miles wide is it? If you can do the calculations to verify that, then you could actually run with a suggestion like that. As for your first suggestion, only if you do all the work! I guess what I'm trying to get at isn't like suggesting all kinds of fancy guns with all kinds of fancy ammo, rather think of my suggestion as stopping someone from calling a pistol a shotgun, just because both use ammo. And sure, most transmitters would have receivers anyhow, but as this is all one unit, I still feel this isn't a HUGE nitpick. ; ) --Kolechovski 03:16, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- I doubt anything was meant by this but, Monroeville is, in real life, roughly 19.8 square miles (51.3 km²) and as it's slightly smaller than Malton in UD(maybe 2% smaller?) it could be assumed that Malton is a little over 20 square miles. Ignoring that though why not, instead of making a pointless flavor buff, just make it so that the Radio Transmitters are a little less all around useful and suggest they can't recieve. That seems to be more common sense but less play to the wiki survivor voter-base that only cares about survivors never getting weakened.--Karekmaps?!03:38, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- Not really picking on you. I have thought the term "transmitter" to be a bit broad and misleading. Something like "Walkie Talkie" may be more appropriate. As for LOS, approx.30 miles is absolute extreme distance. This means flat, with no obstacles, and good weather (cold W/ no humidity). Also assuming you have a maxed out transmitter with a power amplifier (usually vehicle mounted at a min.) So if your city spans roughly 20-30 miles with differing elevations and obstructions (Tall buildings) a repeater system would be necessary to ensure full city wide coverage with no dead spots (You want clear and reliable communication). Every North American town, county, and city runs on a repeater system for police/fire/ems FM communications. Maybe it is not such a bad idea for Maton to adopt one.--Airborne88T Zom MIS 05:21, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- I know all about what you mean, I live in a valley(go far enough out no radio stations reach, and it's not far at all). I was just pointing out the size of the city based on what information we've been giving from other sources, I can't even be sure how much of Monroeville is covered by the Monroeville ingame so even 20 Miles might be a bit on the high end.--Karekmaps?! 05:33, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- What is actually a more valid point than what we call "transmitters", is the actual hand-held "radios" in urban dead. They are actually scanners in that they receive but cannot transmit. What would be interesting is if you could transmit on them but only for a limited range. Say roughly 2 suburbs. We assume that any broadcast from a "transmitter site" can still be received on them because you are with in LOS and they have more power. I dunno, I don't really carry "scanners" anymore because there just isn't much interesting on them. Now, if they could be used as short distance communications...--Airborne88T Zom MIS 05:44, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- I know all about what you mean, I live in a valley(go far enough out no radio stations reach, and it's not far at all). I was just pointing out the size of the city based on what information we've been giving from other sources, I can't even be sure how much of Monroeville is covered by the Monroeville ingame so even 20 Miles might be a bit on the high end.--Karekmaps?! 05:33, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- "the wiki survivor voter-base that only cares about survivors never getting weakened". Unlike the zombie voter-base that is always suggesting that it gets weakened. Uh-huh. Yup. Sure. --Funt Solo QT
09:30, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- Lol k, let me know when you're no longer one of the loudest of the nerf everything about zombies voters.--Karekmaps?! 10:22, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- Confusion You are worried we are going to "communicate the zombies to death"? If anything it would be a waste of AP jabbering into a radio. A radio that takes up space that could be used to carry ammo/FAKs/ &Needles. I have always thought that Malton's communication network was a bit substandard, technically misleading in some part, and just incorrect/impossible in others. Take "walkie talkies" for example, realistically these short range (hand held) 2 way radios would be readily available and easy to find. They are used by fire/ems/police/civilians(CB) every day. Yet, in Malton all that can be found are pointless all band scanners. --Airborne88
T Zom MIS 17:20, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- I was under the impression that you could deflect radio signals off the Heaviside layer [1]. As far as I can remember the heaviside layer rises during the night, due to the effects of the sun, allowing for radio broadcasts to travel further. Maybe that's how radios in Malton work without relay stations?--SeventythreeTalk 11:06, 6 March 2008 (UTC)
- Oh boy, you are opening a can of worms here..The repeater system in Malton could be simply explained by saying that there are multiple transmitters on the same Frequency(they auto retransmit). Ok, the ionosphere is a weird animal when it comes to communications. It is possible for low powered FM signals to hit the ionosphere and reflect back to earth. There are stories of soldiers training in the USA picking up FM transmissions from soldiers under fire in Vietnam. This are more weird flukes than something you would want to base a network off. In the days before satalites, the military used what is called [2] Tactical Tropospheric Scatter Systems to extend beyond LOS. However, they involve beaming massive amounts of energy into the troposphere. The signals are sent from massive transmission sites and require tons of power (less than 3% of the transmission returns to earth- the rest is monitored be aliens). An extension of this theory is the High Frequency Active Auroral Research Program (HAARP) [3]. It is a pretty interesting bugger. However, I think I have gone way beyond the scope of "transmitters to transceivers"--Airborne88
T Zom MIS 22:26, 6 March 2008 (UTC)
- I know that historicaly it's only realy been any use for morse code signals. Also, signals get trapped between ionosphere layers, bouncing back to earth days, even weeks later. Used by spies a lot apparently, and other times when a system of radio relays wouldn't work.... Now I don't know about you but I reckon a zombie infested city covers that... maybe build in a random chance of fluke or failure into the radios, with random, distorted signals appearing sometimes? It'd add atmosphere.....--SeventythreeTalk 22:37, 6 March 2008 (UTC)
- Oh boy, you are opening a can of worms here..The repeater system in Malton could be simply explained by saying that there are multiple transmitters on the same Frequency(they auto retransmit). Ok, the ionosphere is a weird animal when it comes to communications. It is possible for low powered FM signals to hit the ionosphere and reflect back to earth. There are stories of soldiers training in the USA picking up FM transmissions from soldiers under fire in Vietnam. This are more weird flukes than something you would want to base a network off. In the days before satalites, the military used what is called [2] Tactical Tropospheric Scatter Systems to extend beyond LOS. However, they involve beaming massive amounts of energy into the troposphere. The signals are sent from massive transmission sites and require tons of power (less than 3% of the transmission returns to earth- the rest is monitored be aliens). An extension of this theory is the High Frequency Active Auroral Research Program (HAARP) [3]. It is a pretty interesting bugger. However, I think I have gone way beyond the scope of "transmitters to transceivers"--Airborne88
- I was under the impression that you could deflect radio signals off the Heaviside layer [1]. As far as I can remember the heaviside layer rises during the night, due to the effects of the sun, allowing for radio broadcasts to travel further. Maybe that's how radios in Malton work without relay stations?--SeventythreeTalk 11:06, 6 March 2008 (UTC)
- Confusion You are worried we are going to "communicate the zombies to death"? If anything it would be a waste of AP jabbering into a radio. A radio that takes up space that could be used to carry ammo/FAKs/ &Needles. I have always thought that Malton's communication network was a bit substandard, technically misleading in some part, and just incorrect/impossible in others. Take "walkie talkies" for example, realistically these short range (hand held) 2 way radios would be readily available and easy to find. They are used by fire/ems/police/civilians(CB) every day. Yet, in Malton all that can be found are pointless all band scanners. --Airborne88
- Lol k, let me know when you're no longer one of the loudest of the nerf everything about zombies voters.--Karekmaps?! 10:22, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- Not really picking on you. I have thought the term "transmitter" to be a bit broad and misleading. Something like "Walkie Talkie" may be more appropriate. As for LOS, approx.30 miles is absolute extreme distance. This means flat, with no obstacles, and good weather (cold W/ no humidity). Also assuming you have a maxed out transmitter with a power amplifier (usually vehicle mounted at a min.) So if your city spans roughly 20-30 miles with differing elevations and obstructions (Tall buildings) a repeater system would be necessary to ensure full city wide coverage with no dead spots (You want clear and reliable communication). Every North American town, county, and city runs on a repeater system for police/fire/ems FM communications. Maybe it is not such a bad idea for Maton to adopt one.--Airborne88T Zom MIS 05:21, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- I doubt anything was meant by this but, Monroeville is, in real life, roughly 19.8 square miles (51.3 km²) and as it's slightly smaller than Malton in UD(maybe 2% smaller?) it could be assumed that Malton is a little over 20 square miles. Ignoring that though why not, instead of making a pointless flavor buff, just make it so that the Radio Transmitters are a little less all around useful and suggest they can't recieve. That seems to be more common sense but less play to the wiki survivor voter-base that only cares about survivors never getting weakened.--Karekmaps?!03:38, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- Another Suggestion -Well, are you sure Malton is really that huge? How many miles wide is it? If you can do the calculations to verify that, then you could actually run with a suggestion like that. As for your first suggestion, only if you do all the work! I guess what I'm trying to get at isn't like suggesting all kinds of fancy guns with all kinds of fancy ammo, rather think of my suggestion as stopping someone from calling a pistol a shotgun, just because both use ammo. And sure, most transmitters would have receivers anyhow, but as this is all one unit, I still feel this isn't a HUGE nitpick. ; ) --Kolechovski 03:16, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- Another Suggestion It is physically impossible for an FM radio to transmit anymore than 30 miles due to LOS (Line of Sight)-The curvature of the earth deflect it off into space.. So, technically we need to set up "radio-relay-stations" (retransmitters) all over the city!! I can set 'em up for a small fee.--Airborne88T Zom MIS 02:09, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- Suggestion- Could we institute tac sat hubs? Then we would have to multiplex and demultiplex data packages, and I'd like to watch everyone's heads explode in frustration!--Airborne88T Zom MIS 02:02, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
- For sure! That was sort of my point. Low powered FM signals are just "sketchy", they never act quite right and are a constant head ache. Someone could be standing right next you and not able to receive your transmission- meanwhile, some dude half a world away is randomly picking you up days later. I'd vote for a "flavor" change randomizing communications in Malton (bleed overs, dead spots, and static. The only thing is, I don't think anyone else is really interested in communications that much..--Airborne88T Zom MIS 02:34, 7 March 2008 (UTC)
