Suggestions/26th-Mar-2006

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Infectious blood (V3.0 reworked with simpler math and clarifications)

Timestamp: 07:05, 15 march 2006 (GMT)
Type: Zombie Skill
Scope: Zombies
Description: *Prerequisites: Brain rot (infectious bite could be added as an additional prerequisite if you know how we could set it up on the skill tree)
  • Story element:

Whether the zombies initially became infected due to disease, radiation, viruses or an act of God(s) or Demon(s), it is unknown. It is known that now the older, the most decomposed, the most diseased of the zombies have become so putrid that their very blood is filled with death and filth. Leaving those unfortunate souls who get too enraptured in the carnage of death tainted.

  • Theme:

I can’t count the numerous grade B zombie flicks where zombies have managed to infect individuals just by getting a drop of blood into their victims system. The infections are usually introduced through openings in the victim’s body such as their eyes, mouth or open wounds. I.e. 28 days later, dawn of the dead.

  • What it does: It expands on infectious bite and gives an actual reason to get brain rot. A zombie with infectious blood has a small chance of infecting any wounded player that kills it in the same way as infectious bite. It goes with the theme in zombie movies where someone kills a lot of zombies and has a small drop of blood get into an open wound and infects them. See percentage below.
  • Possible flavor text:
  • potential flavor text for both gun and melee attacks.

“As the zombie makes one final lunge for you, you just barely make a killing blow to its head. Unfortunately some of its blood splatters onto you covering your face and makes it into an opening on your body, you are now infected!"

  • For the zombie
“The last thing your rotting eyes see before all goes dark,
Is your blood spraying from your rancid corpse."
  • other stuff

What this is intended to do is to add a small element of danger, fear, and best of all paranoia. It will have little effect on players but instead cause players to be a little more cautious and prepared. FAX packs are readily available to any player that searches for them. Most Survivors will have a pack on themselves anyway either to cure themselves or others. And since brain rot is a prerequisite you should never have to worry about one out five zombies infecting you. See percentage below.

  • The percentage

The chance of a wounded player becoming infected by killing a IB infected zombie is 20%. A non wounded player is half that or 10%. The lower chance of infection for being at full hit points reflects the fewer entry points of infection. The percentages of course can be adjusted as the population of zombies with the skill IB increases and it should ideally be set at a percentage where the average number of zombie kills before infection is 20, see below.

The percentage is based on this. Given that a percent of the zombie population has Infectious blood then there is a statiscal chance of you attacking a zombie with IB. So lets say 25% of the zombie population had IB. Now given that each IB infected zombie has a 20% chance of infecting you, then your chance of infection is as follows 25%*20%=5% or your total likely chance of being infected with a zombie kill or a statisticall chance of being infected once for every 20 zombie kills.

So given that the zombie population with infections blood(IB) is like this 50%IB or 25%IB or 10%IB, then the chance of being infected would be 10%, 20%, 50% respectfully so the chance of infection would be 50%*10%=5%, 25%*20%=5% , and 10%*50%=5%

so after the math the total chance of getting infected should be about 5% or after about 1 in 20 zombie kills and then ideally 2.5% chance for non wounded players.

  • clarifications

Bitten survivors become infected and lose 1HP per action until cured. Speaking does not cause survivors to lose health. Just like with infectious bite no XP is given to the zombie, only satisfaction at having bled on someone.


If you truly feel that getting infected once for every twentieth statistical zombie kill or so is punishment please vote kill, but I would love to hear comments on ways to get this to work better, thanks.

Votes

  1. Kill I predict Mr. Aushvitz wrote this. It isn't fair for survivors to have a penalty they cannot avoid simply for proving victorious in combat, without the zombie having to do anything at all. --Jon Pyre 09:19, 26 March 2006 (BST)
    • Re - actualy no its from me. and this is a slightly modfied version of one that lamost made it to accepted. The main difference is that several poeple wanted changes in the chance of infection for non wounded players and i also altered some of the flaovr text to better suit ranged attacks.--User:ericblinsley 13:43, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  2. Kill - Not a bad idea, per se. I'm just from the Kill & Bite School of Zombification. --Gene 10:00, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  3. Kill This gets a kill vote from me for providing an automatic defence of sorts and for punishing humans for what they're supposed to do; attacking zombies.--Guardian of Nekops 10:01, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  4. Kill I always hated the fact that people wanted to give brainrotted zombies extra benefits over regualar zombies, I don't feel you'd have to close down an entire avenue of play to become the most effective zombie you can be. Brain rot is a choice that is hard and it should be. This game is set up in a way that everybody can get every skill and play in every way that takes his fancy. I always thought that was one of its strenghts. Taking that away and substitute it with the fact that non-brainrot zombies whould be second-class whould be a turn for the worse. But my main problem is and was through all the previous incarnations that it is both a free action and an autodefence. Both are game mechanics I don't like. The fact now you've toned the skill down to be near-useless doesn't change that the mechanics are bad in itself for this game IMO. Now, I'm not the final authoraty on the game, But why should people be incovinianced for doing what they have to do? This is game, it follows different mechanics then movies, not every thing in the movies should be in the game.--Vista W! 15:16, 26 March 2006 (BST)
    • Re - i realy feel that brainrot is a useless skill, life is just a minor inconveince quickly solved by jumping out a window or letting your zed breathen feed on you. Now as for me i currently have no hardocre zombie characters becuase as i said earlier the skill sucks. Now as i may have said earlier infectious bite is also a pretty useless skill, all this skill does is add a slight chance of danger. Its not realy an auto defence since it only happens at death and a small chance at that. Given that it only effects players with the skill you dont have to worry about every zombie possibly getting you infected. As to why should playters be inconvienced for doing what they are supposed to do? well zombies have 2 goals, to eat and to increase the zed population. In movies you often see humans get infected from bites and from wounds taht have been infected, this skill reflects that. It is purposefully not that powerful but it does add a slight chance of being infected. Also, this skill in noway gives the zed any real benefit. It does not give them xp, all it does is help spread the infection as it would likely be done in movies.--User:ericblinsley 9:40, 27 March 2006 (BST)
  5. Keep Nope, wasn't me, I always sign my work, votes, ignorant comments, etc. I support this because it is very accurate that you are at a higher risk of infection (any, and all infections) while you are wounded (lacerations on the skin are one of the worst.) Bottom line: your living character may be one tough SOB, but they're still only human, stitch those wounds shut and take your antibiotics.. you are flesh and blood and they aren't. Also necrotization of the flesh makes it very dangerous for infection, yourself and other people, so yes, the most rotted zombies are something you don't want touching you, at all! Vista makes several valid points, however, Brain rot is a choice zombie players make to avoid revivification ("griefing" as they prefer it.) True this would make BR zombies better than regular ones BUT it doesn't make them better at getting XP, defening themselves, faster, etc. it makes them better at spreading infection! Spreading infection is a zombie's "job" and dedicated zombies should be able to be better at it, if they so choose. Remember, brain rot is an available choice, you can't prevent zombie players from making it, even if you don't agree. --MrAushvitz 11:19, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  6. Kill - Seems like something for nothing to me. -Banana Bear4 19:09, 26 March 2006 (BST)
    • Re - just out of curiosity why did you vote kill this time and keep last time? .-

this is your exact vote for my previous version. Keep - I don't think this is awful. I think it would be fine for everyone except for new players who kill their first zombie, get infected by it, and die not knowing how to get fixed. However I imagine this would be a fairly rare twist of the RNG of fate. Just keep the percentage fairly low and I think this could add some danger and excitement. maybe. -Banana Bear4 07:43, 27 February 2006 (GMT) this was from my previous version http://wiki.urbandead.com/index.php/Suggestions/27th-Feb-2006#Infectious_blood_.28reworked_with_better_math.29 -User:ericblinsley 12:40, 28 March 2006 (BST)

    • Re - I think that while it might be fun, It seems like it in a way, makes the infecting zombie, a non played character, it opens a door for too much in the way of auto defense, and NPC's, although it is a very interesting idea, and I agree that more excitement is nice. -Banana Bear4 02:29, 3 April 2006 (BST)
  1. Kill - What Banana Bear said --Toast Boy 20:56, 26 March 2006 (BST)
    • Re - this gives nothing, so something for nothing doesnt fit. No xp is given to the zombie, all the skill does is add a small element of danegr to the game, which currently doesnt exist to any degree.-User:ericblinsley 5:17, 29 March 2006 (BST)
  1. Kill - Don't penalize players for behaving the way they were intended to behave. In other words, don't penalize survivors for killing zombies. Dickus Maximus 01:35, 27 March 2006 (BST)
  2. Keep - Honestly, I really like it. I play two survivors and a brain-rotted zombie, and I think it's a great idea.--Wifey 23:16, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  3. Keep - It would add a bit of relism, as far as realism in a Zombie game gets... And zombies need some balancing.--William Raker 10:44, 8 April 2006 (BST)
  4. Kill - This smells of an autodefence: therefore it deserves to DIE!!! --Cyberbob240 CDF 11:15, 8 April 2006 (BST)
    • Tally - 3 Keep, 8 Kill, 0 Spam 04:16, 9 April 2006 (BST)

Greedy Metabolism

Timestamp: 10:58, 26 March 2006 (BST)
Type: Zombie Skill
Scope: Brainrotted Zombies
Description: Brain Rot is a prerequisite.

This skill is basically a variant of "Body Building" for zombies. Immediately upon purchasing this skill, the zombie's maximum hit points are unchanged. Thereafter, it's max hit points go up by one for each survivor it kills, up to an ultimate maximum of 65.

So a zombie without Body Building who has Greedy Metabolism and deals the killing blow to eight survivors will have a maximum of 58 hit points. A zombie who already had Body Building and kills three survivors will have a maximum of 63 hit points.

This skill only stacks upon Body Building up to 5 points, so a zombie who has both Body Building and Greedy Metabolism and kills fifteen survivors will have a maxminum of 65 hit points, not 75. Survivors killed before the skill is aquired are not counted retroactively. Fratricidal zombie kills aren't counted either, only humans.

Maximum hit points gained this way carry over to the Other Side, although the ability to raise one's max hit points doesn't. A zombie who is revived will still retain their elevated maximum hit points even as a human, they just won't be able to increase their max hit points by killing anybody until they become a zombie again. If they become undead once again, kills racked up while they were human (even PKs) don't count: only the killing of humans while a zombie. A rehumanized character who'd raised their max hit points through Greedy Metabolism and then purchases Body Building will still have their max hit points go up by 10, up to a maximum of 65.

  • Considerations

Although revived humans can benefit from this skill, it favors the undead. Since both Brain Rot and the slaughter of at least five other survivors are required for the maximum gains to be actualized, it isn't very attractive to humans. On the other hand, quite a few high level zombies will be able to raise their max hit points to 65 this way. If retaining the current game balance is desired, this skill could be introduced at the same time as a new survivor skill, presumably one that allows survivors to deal slightly more damage to zombies.

The reasoning for this skill is to give dedicated zombie characters another way to raise their max hit points without becoming temporarily human, and to give our outnumbered zombies a slight edge. And it adds a little flavor. I'm not too attached to the name "Greedy Metabolism", so I'm cool with other suggestions.

Votes

  1. Kill: As suggested here, it's just a souped-up body building, with a one-off condition to its activation. I'd change my vote if the extra hit points disappeared upon death, making this skill reward Zeds for staying alive longer and having digestion. (As well, that way Bodybuilding would still have a use: It'd raise he minimum max HP of a zombie.) But as written, it's just a very complicated way to get a few extra HP. Ignatius Newcastle 13:12, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  2. Kill The hitpoints are permanent? Killing 15 survivors is not that big of a deal. Killing 5 is less of a deal. This wouldn't really be a gameplay mechanic it'd be giving zombies a small easy to fufill one-time quest to have +5 hp. --Jon Pyre 18:29, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  3. Keep This is a continuation of many skill ideas that are aimed at making sure zombies will have a slight "Hp advantage" to counter the human "AP advantage" (humans and zombies have same max AP but humans save more AP for walking, free running, etc. without having to buy too many skills to do it, unlike zombies). Bottom line, what the hell zombies max HP goes up by up to 5 (or more if they don't have bodybuilding yet.) It's not the end of the world, just a reward for zombies who kill humans! I suggest if you re-enter this suggestion later choose the name "Cannibal Feast" (zombie eats dead humans raising their max. HP and it ties in with "digestion" very well for getting those HP to begin with. Booyah. --MrAushvitz 11:19, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  4. Kill - as dicey as temporary buff's are, I think I might like that idea more than this, permanent buff that requires five to fifteen kills, or maybe try a skill that just boosts you to 65 hp, or was that done already? -Banana Bear4 19:16, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  5. Kill - Zombies would do well with a hit point advantage, but at 65 HP an axe-using survivor simply could not expect to kill a zombie in 50 AP. One of the finest points of Urban Dead is that even a maxed character can be killed by a level 1. Nice try though. --Snikers 22:17, 26 March 2006 (BST)
    • Re Yeah, I completely understand this concern. My reasoning is that in the current system, characters "top out" and there's nowhere more to go. That's why I hinted it might be a good idea to introduce this skill along with one that would allow survivors to deal slightly more damage ("Axe Expertise" or something). Anyway, thanks to everyone who took time to consider the suggestion and vote on it. --Nickaubert 08:07, 27 March 2006 (BST)
  6. Kill I agree with Snickers, this makes it impossible for a axe-using survivor to kill a zombie with full health. --Swmono 19:33, 26 March 2006 (EST)
  7. Kill - How on earth could this work without killing the server? --Gene W! - Talk 05:17, 28 March 2006 (BST)
  8. Kill - It's basically a permanent 5 hp boost to zombies, and 65 hp is way too much for the melee crowd to overcome. Agreeing with the others here.--Theblackgecko 07:21, 28 March 2006 (BST)
  9. Kill - What Theblackgecko said. --Cyberbob240CDF 15:34, 8 April 2006
    • Tally - 1 Keep, 8 Kill, 0 Spam 04:16, 9 April 2006 (BST)

Brain Feast

-Removed by Author, who feels really embarrassed now. Ach, weel. Serves me right for going with the "well, the only way that idea could come close to being good is if..." school of suggestions. Ignatius Newcastle 09:50, 27 March 2006 (BST)

Night "Eyes"

Timestamp: 12:33, 26 March 2006 (BST)
Type: New Zombie Skill
Scope: Zombie "darkness" combat advantage, no longer needs eyes!
Description: Night "Eyes"

Appears on zombie skill tree just under "Scent Trail", to reflect the growing accuracy of your zombie's highly developed "other" senses.

  • Your zombie does not need eyes to see, nor to find their prey. All attacks you make (against the living) indoors, at a location that does not have "The lights are on inside" are at +5% to hit!
  • This bonus turns "off" or "on" every time someone turns a generator "off" or "on".

Rationale

As zombies "evolve" they become more and more... something other than human. They rely on their sense of smell and hearing, and lose interest in what they can see.. (only what they can taste!) Zombies who have a heightened sense of smell have absolutely no problems hitting hard and fast in the dark, unfortunately for human survivors inside, it often takes them a few prescious seconds to know where the zombies are coming from.. a few seconds too late!

This skill will make it a priority for ALL safehouses to have running, fueled generators... if they don't have one. They are going to have some serious problems when the zombies get in.

Mind you, smaller safehouses without power may go unnoticed by zombies entirely.. you never know.

It adds an element to the game which we all have considered, a need for all buildings which are "used" by survivors to have power if and when they can, or life will be "harsh" to say the least.

This gives a much more measurable benefit to zombies who make it inside and "put out the lights" as a prelude to a major attack.

"Why, did the lights just go out... oh SH*T!!!"

Votes

  1. Keep Author vote. Zombies could definately have fun with this one. Doesn't do a damn thing for or against barricades, but once you're in you have "work" to do! It also creates a much more "time" intensive element of a zombie attack. Not just: 5 zombies made it in and we killed them all after putting up our barricades, no big deal. More like: 5 zombies made it in, some of us had to put up the barricades, then the lights went out, we lost a man or two before it was all over and got the generators up and running again.. those bastards!--MrAushvitz 12:19, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  2. Kill Zombie hit percentages are high enough already. Zombies don't need more combat buffs, they need skills to make the game more interesting. --Cinnibar 19:40, 26 March 2006 (BST)
    • Re Oh.. I don't know.. taking out the lights will certainly make things very interesting! :) Humans get to the highest hit %'s of all: Shotgun, Pistol (and do it much quicker than a zombie, humans find XP faster, beacause they find zombies faster.) --MrAushvitz 12:19, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  3. Kill Zombies do not get an automatic +5% just because there isn't a generator present. Most buildings don't have generators, all you're doing is raising the base attack of zombies. --Jon Pyre 19:47, 26 March 2006 (BST)
    • Re All important buildings have fueled generators (if they can), not just hospitals. Zombies have to buy this skill (after buying the 3 above it) just to get this benefit, it's hardly automatic. --MrAushvitz 12:19, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  4. Kill - Zeds will only smash the generator before attacking the harmanz OR leave it where it is, since this doesnt cause no penality for a zombie with or without it. --hagnat talk 20:59, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  5. Spam - This will only help out maxed zeds if its at the end of the scenting skill tree, as that is one low priority skill tree, so it would needlessly boost the maxed out zeds, and not make them any more interesting to play. -Banana Bear4 21:11, 26 March 2006 (BST)
    • Re It is a low priority skill tree, you are 100% correct there. That's why I think it makes sense for there to be a "Good" skill at the end of it. A zombie doesn't have to be "maxed" to get this skill, around halfway.. can't have brand new zombies with +5% to all attacks either. Can't have it overpowered, or do nothing. It's a "dark light at the end of the tunnel" for a zombie who is on his way to a successful career in taking out safehouses! --MrAushvitz 12:19, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  6. Kill -So if sight has no influence for zombies their attacks shouldn't change with the addiction or removal of it now, should it. in fact light from generator is an addition to the basis, according to you light has no effect on zombies but has on survivors. light is an adition to the norm, so survivors should have a bonus upon their basis to hit percantage according to your rationale. This suggestion is tantamount to a blanket 5% increase in to hit percantages and an enourmous AP drain for survivor to get generators everywhere that are GK'ed regularly and are gone with 3 swipes of a zombie anyway. Why is it that everybody thinks that the zombie/survivor problem is solved by giving the zombies again a HP/AP boost. It didn't do that before, so why should it now? Differsity of play is what is needed.--Vista W! 23:24, 26 March 2006 (BST)
    • Re "How hard is it to punch a blind man in the head?" That is the human's weakness against zombies with this skill. There is a defense against this, keep the lights on, or else. This suggestion adds diversity, zombie tactics against safehouses will be more varied. Do I smash the generator giving my brother Z's a better chance? --MrAushvitz 18:19, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  7. Kill - I dont even understand what the suggestion is about, so im voting kill. Also, Re'ing almost every vote is considered an abuse of the RE function. This is not the first time you have been told. --Grim s 01:57, 27 March 2006 (BST)
  8. Spam - What Banana said. Timid Dan 15:51, 27 March 2006 (BST)
    • Tally - 1 Keep, 5 Kill, 2 Spam 04:17, 9 April 2006 (BST)

Alteration to "Night Eyes"

Timestamp: Dickus Maximus 21:36, 26 March 2006 (BST)
Type: New Zombie Skill
Scope: Buildings with running generators
Description: Right now, generators in buildings other than hospitals and NT's are useful for another level of barriccading. In other words, for using a generator and a fuel can (or maybe just a fuel can), you get another free level.

Therefore, I suggest that any building with a running generator gives a zombie with this skill (a subset of "Memories of Life") a 5% chance to cause a barriccade to collapse. At first glance this doesn't look like a lot, but it changes the percentage to hit from 20% to 25%, therefore lowering the disparity to 1 to 4, which is a bit more fair in my opinion.

Votes

  1. Keep - Author Vote Dickus Maximus 21:36, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  2. Spam - I do not see how this will help playing zombies more fun which is what zombies need.Edit: The templet needs to be fixed?Nevermind. I got it - --ramby T--W! - SGP 21:40, 26 March 2006 (BST)
    • Re - So pounding at a barricade for 50 turns that's been made one more level stronger by a generator is more fun? Last time I checked, being able to get into a building is fun. This isn't a major change to balance or barricades, think about it. Dickus Maximus 21:49, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  3. Kill- I don't understand what you're getting at, how do generators give a level of barricade? would this just make barricades worse for powered building? -Banana Bear4 21:56, 26 March 2006 (BST)
    • Re - Excuse me, I misread the generator information. I took "as sturdy as one object barricades" to mean that they were part of the barricade, not similar to their independent strength. Whatever... What I'm getting at is that the zombie recognizes that lights on and remembers that lights = people inside, so it has a greater chance to destroy barricades because it's more motivated now. Dickus Maximus 22:04, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  4. Spam - I would have voted kill, but you're suggesting a change to a suggestion that isn't in the game. Also tests indicate the percentage is closer to half the zombie's hit chance with claws (re: 25%). Velkrin 22:37, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  5. Spam -When you make a suggestion it's usually nice to understand the mechanics you're changing or even have a vague idea what they are.--Vista W! 22:46, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  6. Spam Generators make it more likely that zombies will attack a building, just like in movies. It's silly for people to have to search in order to weaken their barricades. And as for the confusion, generators are thought to be as strong as 1 level of barricades however they are inside the building and entirely seperate from barricade strength. --Jon Pyre 23:19, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  7. Spam - "Hey, Bill, where's the generator? We've got some people here who could do with some surgery." "Well, Frank, that thing was damn noisy, so I threw it out the window. But hey, on the bright side, that's one more thing for the zombies to tear down! Right, Frank? Frank?" --Undeadinator 00:06, 27 March 2006 (BST)
    • RE: - Now that was worth a <chuckle>! --Gene W! - Talk 05:31, 28 March 2006 (BST)
  8. Kill I didn't understand the wording of your suggestion until I'd read your re's to the votes "ahhhh" so you wanted a skill that was a subset of memories of life, that gets a zombie excited and makes them better at attacking barricades in lit buildings, I see. Not a bad idea, BUT, I think that it should be a different idea with a different name.. might I suggest "Memories of Home".. that would be cool (after "memories of life", then the memories of home.) Ah just think it over and repost the idea later (as version 2.0) these guys get picky but if you keep at it they sometimes vote keep, even several times. All good! --MrAushvitz 12:19, 26 March 2006 (BST)
  9. Re - I must destroy you. --Undeadinator 04:18, 27 March 2006 (BST)
  10. Spam Spamallamma. Won't someone please think of the llamas? And this suggestion is spam. Timid Dan 15:54, 27 March 2006 (BST)
  11. Spam - This, and all other changes to barricades, must DIE. --Cyberbob240CDF 15:38, 8 April 2006
    • Tally - 1 Keep, 2 Kill, 7 Spam 04:18, 9 April 2006 (BST)
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