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| {{Suggestion Navigation}}[[Category:Suggestions]] | | <noinclude>{{Developing Suggestions Intro}}</noinclude> |
| ==Developing Suggestions==
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| ''This section is for presenting and reviewing suggestions which '''have not yet been submitted''' and are still being worked on.''
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| ''Nothing on this page will be archived.''
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| ===Further Discussion=== | | ===Ignore based on Radio Broadcast=== |
| *Discussion concerning this page takes place [[Talk:Developing Suggestions|here]].
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| *Discussion concerning the suggestions system in general, including policies about it, takes place [[:Category_talk:Suggestions#Suggestion_Discussion|here]].
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| ==Please Read Before Posting==
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| *'''Be sure to check <big>[[Frequently Suggested#The List|The Frequently Suggested List]]</big> and the [[Suggestions Dos and Do Nots]] before you post your idea.''' You can read about many ideas that have been suggested already, which users should be aware of before posting what could be a '''dupe''': a duplicate of an existing suggestion. '''These include [[Suggestions/RejectedNovember2005#SMG.2FMachine_Pistol|Machine Guns]] and [[Suggestions/19th-Nov-2005#Sniper_Rifle|Sniper Rifles]].'''
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| *Users should be aware that page is discussion oriented. Other users are free to express their own point of view and are not required to be neutral.
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| *If you decide not to take your suggestion to voting, please remove it from this page to avoid clutter.
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| *It is recommended that users spend some time familiarizing themselves with this page before posting their own suggestions.
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| *''After new game updates, users are requested to allow time for the game and community to adjust to these changes '''before''' suggesting alterations.''
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| ==How To Make a Suggestion==
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| ===Adding a New Suggestion===
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| *Copy the code in the box below.
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| *<span class="stealthexternallink">[http://wiki.urbandead.com/index.php?title=Developing_Suggestions&action=edit§ion=7 Click here to begin editing.]</span> This is the same as clicking the [edit] link to the right of the [[Developing Suggestions#Suggestions|Suggestions]] header.
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| *Paste the copied text '''above''' the other suggestions, right under the heading.
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| *Substitute the text in <font color="red">RED CAPITALS</font> with the details of your suggestion.
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| <nowiki>{{subst:DevelopingSuggestion
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| |time=~~~~
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| |name=</nowiki><font color="red">SUGGESTION NAME</font><nowiki>
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| |type=</nowiki><font color="red">TYPE HERE</font><nowiki>
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| |scope=</nowiki><font color="red">SCOPE HERE</font><nowiki>
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| |description=</nowiki><font color="red">DESCRIPTION HERE</font><nowiki>
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| }}</nowiki>
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| *'''Name''' - Give the suggestion a short but descriptive name.
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| *'''Type''' is the nature of the suggestion, such as a ''new class'', ''skill change'', ''balance change'', etc. Basically: '''What is it?''' and '''Is it new, or a change?'''
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| *'''Scope''' is who or what the suggestion affects. Typically ''survivors'' or ''zombies'' (or both), but occasionally ''Malton'', the game ''interface'' or something else.
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| *'''Description''' should be a full explanation of your suggestion. Include information like flavor text, search odds, hit percentages, etc, as appropriate. Unless you are as yet unsure of the exact details behind the suggestion, try not to leave out anything important. Check your spelling and grammar.
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| ===Cycling Suggestions===
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| *Suggestions with no new discussion in the past two days should be given a warning notice. This can be done by adding {{CodeInline|1='''<nowiki>{{SDW|</nowiki><font color="darkred">date</font><nowiki>}}</nowiki>'''}} at the top of the discussion section, where <font color="darkred">date</font> is the day the suggestion will be removed.
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| *Suggestions with no new discussion in the past week may be removed.
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| *If you are adding a comment to a suggestion that has the warning template please remove the {{CodeInline|1='''<nowiki>{{SDW|</nowiki><font color="darkred">date</font><nowiki>}}</nowiki>'''}} at the top of the discussion section to show that there is still ongoing discussion.
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| This page is prone to breaking when the page gets too long, so sometimes suggestions still under discussion will be moved to the [[Developing Suggestions/Overflow1|Overflow page]], so the discussion can continue.
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| __TOC__
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| <span style="font-size:1.75em; color:red">'''Please add new suggestions to the top of the list'''</span>
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| ----
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| ==Suggestions==
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| ===Fire===
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| {| | | {| |
| |'''Timestamp:''' {{User:Brainguard/Sig}} 15:57, 11 October 2009 (BST) | | |'''Timestamp:''' [[User:Khwud|Khwud]] ([[User talk:Khwud|talk]]) 17:27, 8 July 2024 (UTC) |
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| |'''Type:''' Building Change | | |'''Type:''' UI enhancement |
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| |'''Scope:''' Malton | | |'''Scope:''' Interface |
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| |'''Description:''' ==Fire== | | |'''Description:''' Allow 'ignore' from radio broadcasts; users are hiding behind their anonymity to allow them to broadcast things that would broadly trigger them to be ignored, if their user ID was visible. Adding their name, or an auto-generated call-sign (it is for a radio, after all) or something so that they could be blocked based on their broadcasts would help user experience. In addition, and broadcasts that get more than a threshold number could get tagged for review, and the user potentially having their (in-game) ham-license revoked. |
| When a generator is destroyed, a "Level 1" fire starts. The levels of fire go from 1 to 5:
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| #small fire
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| #medium fire
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| #large fire
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| #blazing fire
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| #inferno
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| When there is a fire in a building, there is a 10% chance (plus another 10% for each level, and -20% with the skill, Fire Safety) that you take damage during any given action (for both zombies and humans). There would be a fire reset every 30 minutes. Each fire reset, fires would have a 50% chance of going up by a level. When fires go past level 5, the building is ruined. When a fire starts, everyone within 10 blocks sees, "You see smoke rising x blocks to the north/south and x blocks to the east/west."
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| A new item, Fire Extinguiser, would be found at Fire Departments, Mall Hardware Stores, and Fort Storehouses. Fire Extinguisers can be used only once, and each use has a 40% chance of reducing fire by one level (60% with the skill, Firefighting).
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| The fire skill tree (Civilian class) would be:
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| *Fire Safety - reduces chance of taking fire damage by 20%, starting skill for [[firefighters]].
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| **Firefighting - increases fire extinguisher accuracy to 60%.
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| The effects for each side of the game:
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| *Wouldn't it be awesome for zombies to cause plumes of smoke all over Malton?
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| *GKers are more powerful and groups like [[Genny's Revenge]] get more of a reason to hunt them down.
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| *Fires add a new dimension to seige warfare.
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| *Adds to the role-playing aspect of firefighters.
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| |} | | |} |
| ====Discussion (Fire)==== | | ====Discussion (Ignore based on Radio Broadcast)==== |
| Not digging it. Far too involved and complex, especially for a single suggestion. Would also raise questions as to why Firefighters don't begin with these new skills. {{User:Misanthropy/Sig}} 16:04, 11 October 2009 (BST)
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| Congratulations. You've failed to say how fires start.--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 16:09, 11 October 2009 (BST)
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| :What do you mean? He stated at the top that they start with generator destruction.. - [[User:Whitehouse]] 16:24, 11 October 2009 (BST)
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| ::Yeah, but why?--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 16:25, 11 October 2009 (BST)
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| :::Ah, I thought you simply meant he had given no game mechanic for it, my apologies. - [[User:Whitehouse]] 16:27, 11 October 2009 (BST)
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| ---- | | ---- |
| | | ===Shrink the map=== |
| ===Hunger & Thirst Redone=== | |
| {| | | {| |
| |'''Timestamp:''' {{User:Brainguard/Sig}} 20:59, 10 October 2009 (BST) | | |'''Timestamp:''' --[[User:Uroguy|Uroguy]]<sup>[[Zookeepers|TMZ]]</sup> 16:28, 14 February 2023 (UTC) |
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| |'''Type:''' Condition, new items, new mall store | | |'''Type:''' Map change |
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| |'''Scope:''' Survivors | | |'''Scope:''' Everyone |
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| |'''Description:''' Surivors have a "Hunger" level from 0 to 5. Hunger starts at 0, and goes up 1 level for every 100 AP spent. Survivors have a certain chance of Free Runs failing, equal to (Hunger*2)%. Hunger is cured by eating (see below). | | |'''Description:''' There are just over 3000 active characters in the game currently likely counting a significant percentage of alts and zergs. Shrinking the map by eliminating the outer first two rings of suburbs would increase the amount of interactions between the remaining characters. This shrink could be increased or decreased depending on future changes to the playerbase. |
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| There is also a Thirst level from 0 to 5. It rises every 75 AP. For every additional level of thirst, 2 HP is taken off your max HP. Thirst is cured completely by drinking water (see below). | |
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| There is a new Mall store called a Food Court.
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| These are the items related to Hunger and Thirst:
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| *Water Heater - ''Factories, Power Stations, Mall Hardware Stores, and Fort Storehouses.'' Can be installed in buildings, only works in powered buildings. In a watered building, survivors have the options to "Drink Water" (cures Thrist conpletely), "Fill Canteen" (fills 1 of the user's Canteens) and "Wash Clothes" (removes blood and fuel from clothes). Can be attacked, and has these damage levels: 'dented', 'battered', 'damaged', 'leaking', and destroyed.
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| *Canteen - ''Fire Departments, Warehouses, Mall Sports Stores, Fort Storehouses.'' Appears as either "Canteen (Full)" or "Canteen (Empty)". If you use a full Canteen, it cures thirst completely but empties the Canteen (can be filled fo 1 AP in powered buildings with Water Heater).
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| *Canned Food - ''Mall Food Courts, Fort Storehouses, Pubs, Hotels, Hospitals.'' Cures 2 Hunger levels.
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| *Fast Food - ''Cinemas, Pubs, Mall Food Courts, Hotels, Fort Barracks.'' Cures 1 Hunger level, but, due to the grease, has a 50% chance of causing Thirst.
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| *Soda - ''Cinemas, Pubs, Mall Food Courts, Hotels, Fort Barracks.'' Cures 1 Thirst level.
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| *Spring Water - ''Cinemas, Pubs, Mall Food Courts, Hotels, Fort Barracks.'' Heals 1 HP and cures Thirst.
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| |} | | |} |
| ====Discussion (Hunger & Thirst Redone)==== | | ====Discussion (Shrink the map)==== |
| Why? --{{User:OrangeGaf/Sig}} 21:33, 10 October 2009 (BST)
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| That "why" comment really nails the main issue. No justification is provided for why this is a good idea. Is it to fix balance? Change the dynamic? Introduce realism? Make things more fun? As for other issues, here are some questions I'd pose. Why does grease exist? How is the extra burden to encumbrance and AP justified for survivors? Why do foods cure only one level of hunger? Why can't canteens hold more than one drink of water? Why are only those buildings the ones with sources of water/food (e.g. why not schools with their cafeterias)? How much encumbrance would these items cost? How would the levels be displayed to the player? Again though, we need a justification, since otherwise this is just an extra burden on survivors that makes the game more of a grind and less fun, which is not a good thing. {{User:Aichon/Signature}} 21:54, 10 October 2009 (BST)
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| :My intentions are to add another level to seige warfare. Survivors having to stock up on food and water is much more realistic. --{{User:Brainguard/Sig}} 15:45, 11 October 2009 (BST)
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| No thank you. Just go play Shintolin. {{User:Misanthropy/Sig}} 21:55, 10 October 2009 (BST)
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| This idea still sucks.{{User:Lelouch/sig}} 23:38, 10 October 2009 (BST)
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| Random survivor nerf. --'''[[User:BobBoberton|<span style="color: #FF4500">Bob Boberton</span>]] <sup>[[The_Fortress|<span style="color: #6B8E23">TF</span>]] / [[The_Fortress/Dark_Watch|<span style="color: #778899 ">DW</span>]]</sup>''' [[Image:Littlemudkipsig.gif]] 00:18, 11 October 2009 (BST)
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| You forgot the other stuff associated with eating. Zombies could attack you when your incapacitated taking a shit. Then you have to add toilet paper as an item. And trying to flee with your pants around your ankles causing you to move for 3 AP (and no free running, of course).--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 04:22, 11 October 2009 (BST)
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| ===Builder's Eye=== | | ===Action Points=== |
| {| | | {| |
| |'''Timestamp:''' [[User:KainYusanagi|KainYusanagi]] 13:29, 8 October 2009 (BST) | | |'''Timestamp:''' [[User:Wolldog1]] 10:07, 26 July 26, 2022 |
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| |'''Type:''' New Skill | | |'''Type:''' Action Points Increase Regeneration Rate |
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| |'''Scope:''' Everyone | | |'''Scope:''' Everyone |
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| |'''Description:''' A skill off of Construction that allows you to see the relative barricaded state of any -lit- building, so you can scan in a 3x3 section rather than a 1x1 section as it is currently for checking barricade status. This ability would be functional for zombies as well, letting them see where entry points to the Free Running Network are more easily as well. How to impliment I thought that a italicized and bracketed ''(VHB)'' for Very Heavily Barricaded, etc. would be the appropriate format (often used in buildings when stating what the barricading policy is anyways). | | |'''Description:''' Due to the passage of time with mobile games and other real time action games without restriction, I think that we should address the action points system of the game. This game can only realistically be played for 5 minutes a day. So it's not really a seller for new blood. If we want to see this game survive it needs to evolve into something more exciting than 5 minutes. My suggestion is double the regeneration rate to improve activity. I love this game. I want to play it more. And the die hard fans I'm sure feel the same. More will go on in a day, sure. But that's for both sides. We're ready for it. Let's get this game moving again. We need this. |
| |} | | |} |
| ====Discussion (Builder's Eye)==== | | ====Discussion (Action Points)==== |
| Overpowered for strafe-cading.--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 16:06, 8 October 2009 (BST)
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| Seems a bit over powered... especially with a 9x9 grid, it also extends your viewing range beyond that of binoculars, you should change it so you can only see the status of buildings in the current 3x3 grid. Definitely keep the lit status requirement, currently that's the best thing about it. --[[User:Kamikazie-Bunny|Kamikazie-Bunny]] 16:11, 8 October 2009 (BST)
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| Just a bad idea. You could add a skill that shows where all survivors and zombies inside and out are for a 9x9 block, it would probably have a similar effect to this. ''In case you can't tell, that was sarcasm; this is a bad idea that doesn't need to get any more overpowered.''{{User:Lelouch/sig}} 22:37, 8 October 2009 (BST)
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| Sorry! It was a bit late when I posted this, so I wasn't thinking when i wrote 9x9. I meant 3x3, the same view that we get normally in the minimap, which is -9- squares in area. I usually get them mixed up but catch myself... Apparently I didn't here. I'm modifying the description to reflect what I had actually meant. The entire reason I thought of this idea was because of the issues I have had as a relatively new player in being able to find reasonable shelter even with Free Running, because I don't have the maps of Malton memorized off the top of my head as some of the older players seem to. >.>;-[[User:KainYusanagi|KainYusanagi]] 05:11, 9 October 2009 (BST)
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| You lazy? If you want intel on buildings, spend AP to get it by going there. Oh, and incorporating a way to see exact cade levels is touchy (vsb vs. vsb+2 is pretty big, overcading prevention, etc.). --'''[[User:BobBoberton|<span style="color: #FF4500">Bob Boberton</span>]] <sup>[[The_Fortress|<span style="color: #6B8E23">TF</span>]] / [[The_Fortress/Dark_Watch|<span style="color: #778899 ">DW</span>]]</sup>''' [[Image:Littlemudkipsig.gif]] 05:37, 9 October 2009 (BST)
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| :Not to mention that this would help mainly overcaders.--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 07:16, 9 October 2009 (BST)
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| I like some of it. I think the biggest problem with the issue is as [[User:BobBoberton|BobBoberton]] pointed out--showing specific barricade levels makes the skill '''far''' too overpowered. Take that out, and keep it limited to lit buildings in a 3x3 area and I think you have a more solid, non-broken idea. --{{User:Maverick Farrant/sig}} 07:55, 9 October 2009 (BST)
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| Simple enough, and done, Maverick. Bob: It's nothing about being lazy. I've spent several day's worth of 50 AP blocks just trying to find a safehaven because most of the buildings have no openings nearby, which is really a downside for any non-Military/Firefighter type class that's starting out; Lack of a decent weapon and skill to open a hole in a barricade (scientists, here's looking at you) means either you get lucky and get ignored/no zombies close enough, or you get lunched... Sorry for not wanting to be frustrated with the game trying to look about for refuge without being able to actively tell if a building is barricaded. Regarding overcading- Honestly, everywhere is already at VHB or greater except for very few squares which are either being actively maintained by survivor groups or where the barricades have been torn down/ruined by zombies. I've taken the time to travel across most of Malton, and sadly that's the state it's in already. This may help people who are overzealous about overcading, but it'll help people who are trying to find refuge even more. If giving an exact level is too much, then just a general sense might work? LB++ and down is ''(Open)'' VSB++ to LB++ is just ''(Barricaded)'' and VHB and higher is ''(Blocked)''? -[[User:KainYusanagi|KainYusanagi]] 13:59, 9 October 2009 (BST)
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| :If you have Entry Point, issues, why not check the suburb's page on the wiki? It has the UBP and a list of entry points clear for all to see, and most people generally abide by those guidelines.{{User:Lelouch/sig}} 18:17, 9 October 2009 (BST)
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| :How will this suggestion help starting off scientists? It's a sub-skill of construction. It's easier for a scientist to find a crowbar than to gain 200XP.--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 20:00, 9 October 2009 (BST)
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| ::Good luck actually hitting the barricade and dealing damage at it. I thought that at first myself and ended up spending more AP doing that then it took to find a safehouse, most times. And the reasoning for Scientists: Because they don't have a decent starting weapon/weapon skill and as such are a bit hindered in their ability to pry/attack/defend. To those calling it over-powered still- Perhaps add in the need to have binoculars to make it require a "reagent" of sorts?-[[User:KainYusanagi|KainYusanagi]] 22:51, 9 October 2009 (BST)
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| :::Or, you could just do the crowbar thing. Because, you know, that works with all classes, and doesn't take 200XP (and binoculars) to use.--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 08:06, 10 October 2009 (BST)
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| At best, you might do ok if you could focus the binoculars on a nearby building to see the level. But something overly general like this? It IS overpowered.--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 05:26, 10 October 2009 (BST)
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| ::::The problem with that, though, Pesatyel, is that that still spends the AP you'd have spent to move to that location anyways. The idea of this skill is to negate the AP cost to investigate the barricade state of nearby buildings so you don't have to run around willy-nilly trying to find a place to crash. You're saying it's still too general an idea... Maybe restrict it the same as Binoculars to high buildings; Thus it acts as a direct buff to binoculars, and still remains relatively limited in usability. If so, it could be divorced from Construction and renamed Eagle Eye. As for the "Crowbar thing"... Maybe it's just RNGH8, but that 20% chance to actually hit the barricades? Hasn't worked very well for any of my characters at all.-[[User:KainYusanagi|KainYusanagi]] 08:13, 10 October 2009 (BST)
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| :::::Of course, but your missing the point. Your idea is OVERPOWERED. When you first "use it" your saving 8 AP by automatically knowing. Then, moving on the diagonal to maximize, you save 5 AP for EVERY move. And my binocular idea WAS restricted to tall buildings as that is the only place you can use them.--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 20:01, 10 October 2009 (BST)
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| You know what might be a better solution? This [[Suggestion:20070620 Foreman]] --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 10:21, 10 October 2009 (BST)
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| :And that one is already in peer review.--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 20:04, 10 October 2009 (BST)
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| How about this idea. Pressing a button marked [scan] (or something), you spend an AP to scan a nearby location's barricade then your given the option of moving to that location for 0 AP as part of the same action.--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 20:18, 10 October 2009 (BST)
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| ===Remember last item dropped=== | | ===Drone=== |
| {| | | {| |
| |'''Timestamp:''' {{User:MoonShine/Sig}} 22:10, 3 October 2009 (BST) | | |'''Timestamp:''' [[User:Rosslessness|<span style="color: MidnightBlue ">R</span><span style="color: Navy">o</span><span style="color: DarkBlue">s</span><span style="color: MediumBlue">s</span><span style="color: RoyalBlue"></span>]][[User_Talk:Rosslessness|<span style="color: RoyalBlue">l</span><span style="color: CornflowerBlue">e</span><span style="color: SkyBlue">s</span><span style="color: LightskyBlue">s</span>]][[User_Talk:Rosslessness/Quiz|<span style="color: LightBlue">n</span><span style="color: PowderBlue">e</span>]][[Monroeville Many|<span style="color: PaleTurquoise">s</span>]][[The Great Suburb Group Massacre|<span style="color: PaleTurquoise">s</span>]]<sup>[[Location Page Building Toolkit|<span style="color: DarkRed">Want a Location Image?]] </span> </sup> 19:10, 23 July 2022 (UTC) |
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| |'''Type:''' Interface | | |'''Type:''' Survivor Item |
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| |'''Scope:''' Everyone | | |'''Scope:''' Survivors |
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| |'''Description:''' When dropping an item you have multiple of instead of the drop menu drop down box defaulting back to ------ nothing on page load it keeps the same item you just dropped in focus (like attacking). e.g. you drop a pistol (0) then upon the next page load where it says you have dropped your pistol pistol(0) is selected in the drop down drop menu. May be a dupe i didn't bother checking. | | |'''Description:''' Portable drone, found in mall tech stores, which are pointless as we all know. Encumbrance is 10%. When activated for 15ap they provide an image of a 10x10 grid centred on the survivor, showing the current outside status of all blocks including zombies, survivors and dead bodies. Like DNA scanners, Drones are multi use. |
| |} | | |} |
| ====Discussion (Remember last item dropped)==== | | ====Discussion (Drone)==== |
| I... think I followed what you were trying to get at. Seems rather unnecessary. --{{User:Maverick Farrant/sig}} 22:55, 3 October 2009 (BST)
| | Would there be a message displayed to the players to the effect of "there's a drone buzzing overhead", similar to a flare? --{{User:A Helpful Little Gnome/Sig}} 02:19, 24 July 2022 (UTC) |
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| I'm trying to make sure I have this right. You mean, if you want to drop multiple items of the same type, after dropping the first, the next one of the same type is automatically pre-selected in the drop-down menu when the page loads to show you've dropped the item? If so, it seems nice in theory, but with differently-loaded pistols I can see it being a mess - unless it's accompanied by a function which sorts your guns in the menu from lowest-load to highest-load. {{User:Misanthropy/Sig}} 23:02, 3 October 2009 (BST)
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| There are some edge cases that could use addressing, as Misanthropy pointed out, but on the whole, I really like the idea. If you overstocked on syringes or FAKs (not sure why/how you would, but let's just say) it'd be a pain to remove them individually. This would make it that much easier. As for guns, my suggestion would be to select the one with the least remaining ammo, given the choice of multiple guns to choose from. {{User:Aichon/Signature}} 01:19, 4 October 2009 (BST)
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| That is, basically, how it used to be BEFORE Kevan added the null item (the ------). People complained about accidentally dropping something they didn't want to drop. So, yeah, this suggestion isn't going to make it as the point is to improve the game, not return it to a worse state.--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 20:05, 4 October 2009 (BST)
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| This is a dupe, got suggested after Kevan put item codes in. -- {{User:Iscariot/Signature}} 07:40, 5 October 2009 (BST)
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| ===Flak Jacket Nerf=== | | ===Backpack=== |
| {| | | {| |
| |'''Timestamp:''' [[User:Kamikazie-Bunny|Kamikazie-Bunny]] 18:06, 3 October 2009 (BST) | | |'''Timestamp:''' [[User:Wild Crazy|Wild Crazy]] ([[User talk:Wild Crazy|talk]]) 20:55, 20 September 2021 (UTC) |
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| |'''Type:''' Balance/Flavour | | |'''Type:''' New item |
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| |'''Scope:''' All Players | | |'''Scope:''' Survivors |
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| |'''Description:''' ''Inspired by the suggestion discussion below, anthropometrics, mechwarrior and probability and statistics.'' | | |'''Description:''' This will be a new item found in schools with a 2% find rate and sports stores with a 4% find rate. The low numbers are because, like a flak jacket, once you find it you have it forever. It increases you encumbrance by 30%. However, you can't use an item that is in your backpack until you remove it from the backpack. It costs one AP to add an item to your backpack and one AP to remove an item. An item affects your regular encumbrance until added to the backpack. Items such as GPS, radios, cell phones, and flak jacket do not work when in your backpack. Items in your backpack will not be shown in your inventory, but the backpack itself will be shown in your inventory. There will be a drop box next to the word backpack that shows all the items inside. When you click on an item in that drop box, it removes it from your backpack (1 AP). |
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| :'''Currently:'''<BR>
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| ''Flak Jacket''<BR>
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| Grants a 20 percent damage reduction against attacks that deal 5 damage or more.
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| :'''Proposed Change:'''<BR>
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| ''Body Armour''<BR>
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| Has an 80% chance to grants a 20 percent damage reduction against attacks that deal 5 damage or more.<BR>
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| If a kill shot occurs (even when the body armour has an effect) the effects of body armour are automatically ignored.
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| :'''Effects:'''<BR>
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| No more players wearing body armour on their heads.<BR>
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| You can still cause maximum damage to a player by hitting an extremity/ weak point e.g. arm, leg or head.<BR>
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| Although body armour increases survivability flesh rot is now more appealing to zombies (and more effective).<BR>
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| Body armour covers a range of defences including flak jackets/bullet-proof jackets/plate mail...
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| Considered increasing the % to 90 but looking for input first.
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| |}
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| ====Discussion (Flak Jacket Nerf)====
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| Oh dear. *runs away from flame war [[User:John Ibans|John Ibans]] 18:16, 3 October 2009 (BST)
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| I'm going to raise two obvious points here:
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| # Nerfs Flack Jackets
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| # Why?
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| {{User:Lelouch/sig}} 18:23, 3 October 2009 (BST)
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| :Actually it doesn't nerf anything. It doesn't DO anything.--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 18:28, 3 October 2009 (BST)
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| ::Yes it does, it basically makes FJs only have a 60% chance to work.{{User:Lelouch/sig}} 18:41, 3 October 2009 (BST)
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| :::Oops, my bad. CNR. I was looking at his kill shot thing not the fact he reduced it from 80 to 60. I'm just curious what makes him thing ANYONE would go for this.--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 18:51, 3 October 2009 (BST)
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| ::::From 100 to 60.--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 18:55, 3 October 2009 (BST)
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| You DO realize what your suggesting is pointless, right? Think about it. You said KILL SHOT. Let's say you have 8 HP and a flak jacket. If I hit you with a shotgun, you die and I earn 20 XP. First, the remaining 2 HP "lost" to the flak jacket are irrelevant as you are STILL DEAD and you can't be at "negative HP" as, when you stand up you will be at full. Second, I earn XP on the damage of the weapon, NOT the damage sustained by the target.--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 18:28, 3 October 2009 (BST)
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| :That part of the suggestion is to clear this up "''You fire at the zombie for 10 damage. Their flak jacket absorbs 2 points of damage. They take a Headshot and die.''" --[[User:Kamikazie-Bunny|Kamikazie-Bunny]] 15:08, 7 October 2009 (BST)
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| ::So you did all this to, basically, change the wording for when a zombie takes a headshot?--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 04:24, 11 October 2009 (BST)
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| Everybody is going to vote kill on this. It completely kills the flak jacket, for no real reason. Suggestion:20081105_Flak_Jacket_Update - 18:35 3 October 2009 (BST)
| | Q: Wouldn't this buff survivors, since they can carry more bullets and kill more zombies? |
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| [[Suggestion:20070902 Flak Jacket Change]] Raises similar issues, and with [[Flesh Rot]] becoming more common, the people this most hurts are dual natured players and those trying to avoid PK'ing. --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 18:40, 3 October 2009 (BST)
| | A: Since it costs an AP to add and remove an item, it wastes a lot of AP to put bullet clips in your backpack if you are planning on using them right away. |
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| So, if I'm to understand the "issue" correctly, some flavor text suggests that people wear Flak Jackets on their heads, so we should change the mechanics of Flak Jackets to make Flesh Rot more appealing to zombies? Sounds like a logical fallacy to me. I don't have a problem with making Flesh Rot more appealing, but this isn't the proper way to do it, and no other valid reason is proposed here for nerfing Flak Jackets. {{User:Aichon/Signature}} 18:47, 3 October 2009 (BST)
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| :See [[Suggestion:20081105_Flak_Jacket_Update|My Previous Flak Jacket Update ]] for what I would consider a better way of doing that. Most zombies don't want the Flak Jacket to be nerfed because it means that the have to buy Flesh Rot for better protection and then they feel forced to play as a zombie, survivors feel they are more likely to become victims of PKers (even though it works against PKers as well); in 90% of fights it's a case of who attacked first regardless of having a jacket, with the FJ it just means they need to use more AP. --[[User:Kamikazie-Bunny|Kamikazie-Bunny]] 15:08, 7 October 2009 (BST)
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| Yeah, I'd be opposed to this. It's an unnecessary change that won't make a big enough difference to be worth the hassle, the coding and the added random factor. {{User:Misanthropy/Sig}} 18:59, 3 October 2009 (BST)
| | Q: If it wastes AP, what is the point? |
| :Ditto what Misanthropy and Aichon said. --{{User:Maverick Farrant/sig}} 19:13, 3 October 2009 (BST)
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| I like this, for the simple reason that people seem to think that flak jackets are worthwhile in the first place. -- {{User:Iscariot/Signature}} 07:42, 5 October 2009 (BST)
| | A: It will be useful if you want to carry around an extra stash of items, such as FAKs and Revivification Syringes, or if you are going far away from any resource buildings and need some extra supplies. |
| :It's actually not a bad idea and it would make flesh rot more interesting. But I'd say the flak jacket would have to work more like 90% of the time. 1 in 10 shots getting through for full damage would be enough of a boost. The percentages could always be changed in the future, assuming this change was implemented, which it wouldn't =( --{{User:Giles Sednik/sig}} 12:53, 5 October 2009 (BST) | |
| ::In retrospec a higher inital % would of been better when putting this here. I've upped it to 80% but will probably raise it higher again assuming people consider the PKer threat substantial enough (it actually works against PKers as well; zombies... if your not happy with 80% but Flesh Rot). --[[User:Kamikazie-Bunny|Kamikazie-Bunny]] 14:47, 7 October 2009 (BST)
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| :::Let's take a quick poll. All those in favor of Flack Jacket nerf with 90% chance to absorb damage say '''90'''. Those who favor 80% say '''80'''. And if you think it's a dumb idea altogether say '''dumb'''. I'll start: 90.--{{User:Giles Sednik/sig}} 16:55, 7 October 2009 (BST)
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| ::::'''70''' but introduce helmets to the armoury for a flat bonus of 25% (enc about 5?)--[[User:Honestmistake|Honestmistake]] 17:20, 7 October 2009 (BST)
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| ::::* '''Dumb as nuts''', as his next one probably will be.{{User:Lelouch/sig}} 18:11, 7 October 2009 (BST)
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| :::::Giles I raised it to 80% because the FJ blocks 20% of damage, Body building adds 20% damage and FAKs heal 20% of HP on avg. so I followed the trend, I'll Happily raise it to 90% if more people agree but currently you're the only one. Lelouch - Don't worry I'm trying to work on some unique "Pants on head retarded" suggestions to do with flak jackets. They're not for you though, they're for Kevan, if he sees lots of suggestions on Flak jackets he's more likely to look through them and implement one... and it's likely to be a nerf. --[[User:Kamikazie-Bunny|Kamikazie-Bunny]] 16:05, 8 October 2009 (BST)
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| If it was to have a % chance of working I would like to see damage for flak coming into the game too. Say, let it drop in effectiveness on a 1% for 1 damage stopped. --[[User:Honestmistake|Honestmistake]] 17:20, 7 October 2009 (BST)
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| Flaks are fine the way that they currently work, don't fuck with them. --[[User:Johnny Bass|Papa Johnny]] 17:40, 7 October 2009 (BST)
| | Please give your thoughts. |
| :Second. --'''[[User:BobBoberton|<span style="color: #FF4500">Bob Boberton</span>]] <sup>[[The_Fortress|<span style="color: #6B8E23">TF</span>]] / [[The_Fortress/Dark_Watch|<span style="color: #778899 ">DW</span>]]</sup>''' [[Image:Littlemudkipsig.gif]] 19:18, 7 October 2009 (BST)
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| ----
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|
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|
| ===More details===
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| {|
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| |'''Timestamp:''' [[User:John Ibans|John Ibans]] 21:39, 1 October 2009 (BST)
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| |-
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| |'''Type:''' Flavour, greater detail
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| |-
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| |'''Scope:''' Available to all
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| |-
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| |'''Description:''' It seems that zombies wandering the town have two attacks, "crush shoulder", and "bite shoulder". While I sure don't mind that, I would like more detail, such as "You flail at USERNAME's chest, causing 3 damage" or "You bite USERNAME's back, causing 4 damage, they become infected". The simple statement is that I would like more zombie attacks (randomly selected) that all do the same amount of damage, but attack different body locations (even striking the head would be cool)
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| In addition, I think this can also be expanded to survivours, wuch as "you strike a zombine in the chest with your fire axe, causing 3 damage" or "you fire at a zombie's leg, causing 10 damage. Their rotten flesh absorbs 2 damage".
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| '''Mechanics:'''
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| Well, randomness. I don't know exactly what language Urban Dead is written in, but I imagine that broadening the extent of described attacks would take a bit of monotinay away from constant crushing and biting shoulders. This proposal would not change damage or anything else, just the text.
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| |} | | |} |
| ====Discussion (More details)==== | | ====Discussion (Backpack)==== |
| So, basically adding some additional, random flavor text for zombie attacks? I like the idea. Seems simple to implement and adds a bit of variety to an assault on a survivor. {{User:Aichon/Signature}} 22:13, 1 October 2009 (BST)
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| Why does putting a pistol round in a zombie's face do the same damage and level of injury as shooting his foot?{{User:Lelouch/sig}} 22:35, 1 October 2009 (BST)
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| :Why does every firearm ever fired automatically hit a flak jacket? Urban dead is a game of such questions. I enjoy the flavour, as long as its zombie only. --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 22:46, 1 October 2009 (BST)
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| ::Classist.{{User:Lelouch/sig}} 22:54, 1 October 2009 (BST)
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| :::Entirely. Surely all you survivors are aiming at the head anyway? --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 08:43, 2 October 2009 (BST)
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| ::::You shoot Bob the Zombie for 5 damage. Their flak jacket absorbs 1 point of that damage. They take a Headshot and die.
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| ::::Obviously, flak jackets cover every part of your body. ?:I --'''[[User:BobBoberton|<span style="color: #FF4500">Bob Boberton</span>]] <sup>[[The_Fortress|<span style="color: #6B8E23">TF</span>]] / [[The_Fortress/Dark_Watch|<span style="color: #778899 ">DW</span>]]</sup>''' [[Image:Littlemudkipsig.gif]] 19:30, 2 October 2009 (BST)
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| :::::Somewhere on the wiki theres a long page about how zombies wrap flak jackets around their heads. Anyone? --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 19:33, 2 October 2009 (BST)
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| I see only one issue, and it's kind of minor. If this is giving random body parts, it'll be using the same mechanic as the hit rate %. If you know about [[Groove Theory]], that might be a problem. If people see that Head hits are more successful that leg hits, then they may find out what the current interval is. --{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 07:06, 2 October 2009 (BST)
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| :The other issue I see is that while some of us like the added flavour, how many people pay that much attention to the damage messages beyond confirming whether or not you actually hit your target? Don't get me wrong--I'd vote '''Keep''' if this goes to voting--but I feel that it would be wasted programming for all the appreciation it would get from the average UD user. --{{User:Maverick Farrant/sig}} 07:19, 2 October 2009 (BST)
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| :You mean that, for instance, if the current interval is 8 seconds with a window of 1 second, there's the possibility that "head" hits would occur during the first .5 seconds of the window and "leg" shots would occur in the second .5 seconds, clueing the player in to where they are landing within the window? Seems kinda unlikely to me, and is certainly a minor edge case, as you said. More likely is that people who try to use Groove Theory would only see the same flavor text over and over again while they're in that groove, which isn't really an issue since using grooves is not supported gameplay practice. {{User:Aichon/Signature}} 08:25, 2 October 2009 (BST)
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| ::According to kevin, it's patched anyway.{{User:Lelouch/sig}} 18:28, 2 October 2009 (BST)
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| :::Kevan just changed the system by which it works. He didn't completely erase the potential for abuse. if you read to the bottom of the talk, there's conjecture about a new groove.--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 19:11, 2 October 2009 (BST)
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| ::::Yeah, it's not fixed at all. In truth, I can confirm that it's working and is fairly simple to abuse. Since I became aware of the concept last week, I've already figured out the interval for FAK searches and for zombies using Claw (e.g. I went about 19/20 and 22/24 in successfully finding FAKs in my last two restocking runs), and am hoping I can come up with some reproducible results that I could pass along to Bug Reports or Kevan at some point soon. I'd love to see the RNG fixed, to be frank, since I know that there are others who have doubtless researched this at length and are capable of abusing it to the extreme. In the meantime though, and speaking from a small bit of experience, I don't think that the flavor messages would have much impact on people abusing Groove Theory, though I could very well be wrong. {{User:Aichon/Signature}} 23:28, 2 October 2009 (BST)
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| :::::Last time I checked it the groove was well and truly obvious and working. -- {{User:Iscariot/Signature}} 07:43, 5 October 2009 (BST)
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| Well, the simple thing would be to just NOT include "head" in the random target flavor text. "Head" already has a special mechanic (headshot) which would supercede this flavor text (unless the headshot mechanic changes). The main problem with the idea is that it isn't JUST "flavor text". If I attack you and hit your hand, it could (and probably would) be argued that it should have some "effect" beyond just doing standard damage.--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 01:59, 3 October 2009 (BST)
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| :And along the same lines, "foot" and "hand" just wouldn't be included in the random text. [[User:John Ibans|John Ibans]] 15:01, 3 October 2009 (BST)
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| ::Your missing the point then. "Hand" was just an example. If I injure you ANYWHERE on the arm or leg it would have essentially the same effect. People would argue that a leg wound would slow you down. WHERE on the leg wouldn't matter.--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 18:16, 3 October 2009 (BST)
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| :::I think a better system would be to ignore body parts. '''You gouge...''' or '''You tear''', Claw, Swipe, rend, scratch grab. --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 18:36, 3 October 2009 (BST)
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| ::::Agreed. It just looked like the discussion was headed in the direction of specific locations.--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 05:34, 5 October 2009 (BST)
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| Extra flavor to make things a little more interesting? Sounds good. --[[User:Johnny Bass|Papa Johnny]] 17:41, 7 October 2009 (BST)
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| ---- | | ---- |
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| ==Suggestions up for voting==
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| ====Bikers Store====
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| Moved to [[Suggestion:20091009 Bikers Store]]{{User:Lelouch/sig}} 23:09, 9 October 2009 (BST)
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|
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| ====Dim Lights====
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| Moved to [[Suggestion talk:20091008 Dim Lights]] <small>-- [[User:Boxy|<span style="color: Red">boxy</span>]] <sup>[[User talk:Boxy|<span style="color: Red">talk</span>]] • [[The Rules|teh rulz]]</sup> 09:13 8 October 2009 (BST)</small>
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