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| {{Suggestion Navigation}}[[Category:Suggestions]] | | <noinclude>{{Developing Suggestions Intro}}</noinclude> |
| ==Developing Suggestions==
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| ''This section is for presenting and reviewing suggestions which '''have not yet been submitted''' and are still being worked on.''
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| ''Nothing on this page will be archived.''
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| ===Further Discussion=== | | ===Ignore based on Radio Broadcast=== |
| *Discussion concerning this page takes place [[Talk:Developing Suggestions|here]].
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| *Discussion concerning the suggestions system in general, including policies about it, takes place [[:Category_talk:Suggestions#Suggestion_Discussion|here]].
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| ==Please Read Before Posting==
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| *'''Be sure to check <big>[[Frequently Suggested#The List|The Frequently Suggested List]]</big> and the [[Suggestions Dos and Do Nots]] before you post your idea.''' You can read about many ideas that have been suggested already, which users should be aware of before posting what could be a '''dupe''': a duplicate of an existing suggestion. '''These include [[Suggestions/RejectedNovember2005#SMG.2FMachine_Pistol|Machine Guns]] and [[Suggestions/19th-Nov-2005#Sniper_Rifle|Sniper Rifles]].'''
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| *Users should be aware that page is discussion oriented. Other users are free to express their own point of view and are not required to be neutral.
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| *If you decide not to take your suggestion to voting, please remove it from this page to avoid clutter.
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| *It is recommended that users spend some time familiarizing themselves with this page before posting their own suggestions.
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| *''After new game updates, users are requested to allow time for the game and community to adjust to these changes '''before''' suggesting alterations.''
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| ==How To Make a Suggestion==
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| ===Adding a New Suggestion===
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| *Copy the code in the box below.
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| *<span class="stealthexternallink">[http://wiki.urbandead.com/index.php?title=Developing_Suggestions&action=edit§ion=7 Click here to begin editing.]</span> This is the same as clicking the [edit] link to the right of the [[Developing Suggestions#Suggestions|Suggestions]] header.
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| *Paste the copied text '''above''' the other suggestions, right under the heading.
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| *Substitute the text in <font color="red">RED CAPITALS</font> with the details of your suggestion.
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| <nowiki>{{subst:DevelopingSuggestion
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| |time=~~~~
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| |name=</nowiki><font color="red">SUGGESTION NAME</font><nowiki>
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| |type=</nowiki><font color="red">TYPE HERE</font><nowiki>
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| |scope=</nowiki><font color="red">SCOPE HERE</font><nowiki>
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| |description=</nowiki><font color="red">DESCRIPTION HERE</font><nowiki>
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| }}</nowiki>
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| *'''Name''' - Give the suggestion a short but descriptive name.
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| *'''Type''' is the nature of the suggestion, such as a ''new class'', ''skill change'', ''balance change'', etc. Basically: '''What is it?''' and '''Is it new, or a change?'''
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| *'''Scope''' is who or what the suggestion affects. Typically ''survivors'' or ''zombies'' (or both), but occasionally ''Malton'', the game ''interface'' or something else.
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| *'''Description''' should be a full explanation of your suggestion. Include information like flavor text, search odds, hit percentages, etc, as appropriate. Unless you are as yet unsure of the exact details behind the suggestion, try not to leave out anything important. Check your spelling and grammar.
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| ===Cycling Suggestions===
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| *Suggestions with no new discussion in the past two days should be given a warning notice. This can be done by adding {{CodeInline|1='''<nowiki>{{SDW|</nowiki><font color="darkred">date</font><nowiki>}}</nowiki>'''}} at the top of the discussion section, where <font color="darkred">date</font> is the day the suggestion will be removed.
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| *Suggestions with no new discussion in the past week may be removed.
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| *If you are adding a comment to a suggestion that has the warning template please remove the {{CodeInline|1='''<nowiki>{{SDW|</nowiki><font color="darkred">date</font><nowiki>}}</nowiki>'''}} at the top of the discussion section to show that there is still ongoing discussion.
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| This page is prone to breaking when the page gets too long, so sometimes suggestions still under discussion will be moved to the [[Developing Suggestions/Overflow1|Overflow page]], so the discussion can continue.
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| __TOC__
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| <span style="font-size:1.75em; color:red">'''Please add new suggestions to the top of the list'''</span>
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| ----
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| ==Suggestions==
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| ===IP Text Spam===
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| {|
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| |'''Timestamp:''' {{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 23:51, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| |'''Type:''' Minor technical change
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| |'''Scope:''' IP limit reachers
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| |'''Description:''' Right so, with the current system, when you have 10 or less hits remaining, you get the message: "You have XXX IP hits remaining. This could be because..... we recommend....." on your page with every action. (Or something similar). The point is, it takes up half a page of text.
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| My proposal would be to only show the explanation and recommendations on the first appearance (10 hits left). That way, everyone who needed the message would still get it, but people who don't need it don't need to put up with it every time they perform an action.
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| Thoughts?
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| |}
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| ====Discussion (IP Text Spam)====
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| '''Note:''' This would not change the system in any way, and the "You have XXX hits remaining line would still appear each time.--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 23:52, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| I'd say make it an option, to let you turn it off, or truncate it - one that can be turned on or off on the options page. {{User:Misanthropy/Sig}} 23:53, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :I personally agree, but people don't tend to be fond of adding things to the already cluttered settings page. Another opinion, anyone?--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 23:59, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| It's great for those of us who play from home, but the big warning is needed every time on shared IPs. Imagine if you just skimmed the notifications and stepped outside only to run out of IP hits because someone else was on your network. -- {{User:Iscariot/Signature}} 23:58, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :Good point. What would you say to Mis' toggle option then?--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 23:59, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::A waste of coding really dude, the option is only going to remove it from 9 screens at most per day. I play to the IP limit myself and I don't really see the need, or have any want, for this. -- {{User:Iscariot/Signature}} 00:07, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :::Alright then. I simply thought of it while ranting about having to scroll down a page to click the "attack barricades" button ten times. :P
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| :::Rescinded, unless anyone shows extreme interest in this.--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 00:09, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::::Don't get me wrong, it's not a ''bad'' idea, but if Kevan's going to spend 10 minutes coding I'd rather have him work on something else. -- {{User:Iscariot/Signature}} 00:32, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :::::You ''could'' amend it to just relocate the second through tenth instances of it ''under'' the relevant game-y bits instead of above them. {{User:Misanthropy/Sig}} 00:38, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::::::Well, that wasn't the real issue. As Iscariot said, it's not really a worthy use of coding time. I'd much rather he implemented pumpkin count or something. :P --{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 12:00, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::::That can be easily remedied by rearrangiing the page and making that warning be red letters below the mini-map instead of empty backgroun as of now[[User:Annoynimouse|Shambler for Shambala]] 01:30, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :::::An interesting idea but I don't have any strong opinions on it. If it went up for a vote I'd go with my mood.--{{User:Giles Sednik/sig}} 09:32, 15 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ===Fences are not solid walls, game mechanics there is to be different from buildings===
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| {| | | {| |
| |'''Timestamp:''' [[User:Annoynimouse|Shambler for Shambala]] 07:11, 13 March 2010 (UTC) | | |'''Timestamp:''' [[User:Khwud|Khwud]] ([[User talk:Khwud|talk]]) 17:27, 8 July 2024 (UTC) |
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| |'''Type:''' Change of isolation street/internals in some specific locations. | | |'''Type:''' UI enhancement |
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| |'''Scope:''' Both zombies and surviviors in soem specific locations with specific objects (like zoo cages) instead of buildings. | | |'''Scope:''' Interface |
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| |'''Description:''' Zoo enclosure, surrounded by wire fencing, is not solid building surround with concrete wall. Imagine a Lin cage surrounded by something like http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/49/Chain_Link_Fence_Black.jpg and keeping it in mind rethink of all the isolatin buildings' walls impose. It is not realistic. Lion cage was made to aow every visitor from street to see, hear and smell the Lion, not to walk around blind. Even for buildings, something is seen "through broken windows". I think that: | | |'''Description:''' Allow 'ignore' from radio broadcasts; users are hiding behind their anonymity to allow them to broadcast things that would broadly trigger them to be ignored, if their user ID was visible. Adding their name, or an auto-generated call-sign (it is for a radio, after all) or something so that they could be blocked based on their broadcasts would help user experience. In addition, and broadcasts that get more than a threshold number could get tagged for review, and the user potentially having their (in-game) ham-license revoked. |
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| 1) it should be visible who is inside even when you are outside. It was Zoo's goal that animals behind fences be visible. So now there are survivors(usually) inside and zombies(usually) on the street. They should see each other just like animals and visitors saw before.
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| 2) Just like the fencing alows to see through, it does not isolate sound as well. What insider say may be heard by outsiders and vice versa. For counting 50 listeners among the mob, then people at another side of fence should be considered far-standers. Say, if inside there are 60 men and outside 30 zombies, the speech of man would only be heard by some 50 of men, and the speech of zombie would be heard by all 29 zombies and some 21 men.
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| 3) BTW, if it is wire fence like photo above, then it probably disallows any melee weapons - knifes, axes, sticks, zombie hands and teeth... - just like the concrete wall does. Afterall it was designed to keep animal and visitors safe of each another. But spaces between the wires (remember photo above?) are to allow pistols and shotguns bursts. Consider this an optional addition to sight and sound corrections above. It is realistic but it (even if only locally) changes weapons balance and might be taboo for some just to think of. I do not want 1 and 2 sunk only because no one likes 3. However i'd still describe effect of wire fencing on the firearms. Shooting through the wires is possible. AP penalty probably would be added then - you need to aim carefully, to shoot between wires of fencing. Or the penalty to hit chance might be appied - you do not aim carefully, but chance is for bullet to be deflected by the fencing especially when target is not still.
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| How this probably would change game mechanics around zoo and other similar locations, if any?
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| Zombies would better saw which of cages (lion enclosure, bear pit, maybe to some extent girafe and eephant houses) is full of healthy protectors or is a weak stronghold, that would allow for better planning of attack (timing and location aim). Zombies would be allowed to groan from street (they do see survivors from street), hence easier gather together to attack. Surviviors would easier see how large is the sieging horde and if they better flee or repell. If shooting through wire fencing would be allowed, then surviviours would have better chance to protect the place, compensating bonuses for zombie organization there. Combined together, that would make new unusual chalenges there for both zombies and surviviors. That would probably also make easy to survivors to reclaim cages back from zombies, provoking them to flee instead of protecting the place. However since there can be offline players they would still have the reason to fight. Alas that might allow to PKers to shoot and run, at least when the daylight shines (no electric light expected in animal cage in daytime zoo).
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| How this probably would change game mechanics Malton-wise?
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| In large scale - no change. Those who don't like it just don't go there. Just like forts, mansions - special place, that you can easily avoid. And just like them - it would add to variety colour of Malton for those who want to look close and intentionally go there. There is a team that strives to make Zoo special, safe recreational park for anyone. I visited zoo to see that "special", beeing little bored of random street fights. And succumbed to that wiki pages about cultural place. My zombie tourist walked in naively - and instantly got shot and then revived. It appeared to be just yet again formless random fighting there (despite i really saw some persons trying to role-play there, but their efforts could not overcome other guys' "shoot 1st" attitude, fear and lust for XP. Just like in any other location in Malton, that i left behind. Same gray colour. Zoo was great idea, and it should be something special and unusual, for those who wants some new joy or sme new challenge. We have a lot of streets with no real difference between them. Zoo is to be special. And Malton would only benefit from added variety.
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| Also little discussion was at http://wiki.urbandead.com/index.php/Talk:The_Lion_Enclosure
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| PS: To some extent this might also be true for <s>wastelands or garbage dumps</s> junkyards (i can't remember exact description of those locations, but i remember barricading was displayed to be patching holes in fencing, so i think it is surrounded by fences too, so same idea applies for them)
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| PPS: i also think the graffiti is to be disallowed inside cages or to be rephrased. Thee is no walls, so there is nothing that can be "painted ... on the wall" - it might be on the floor, on some box, on some plackard hanging on the fence... Maybe even some solid door be there - though such doors are not typical for zoo. But not on the wall - no walls.
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| |} | | |} |
| ====Discussion (Fences are not solid walls, game mechanics there is to be different from buildings)==== | | ====Discussion (Ignore based on Radio Broadcast)==== |
| 1 could be workable, I don't know what people who are regularly in the zoos would say, 2 I personally don't like, 3 is x-ray vision and shouldn't really be allowed.--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 10:00, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| No. Just no. X-Ray vision is bad. Also, just because some of the 'building' has a wire fence through which the main entrance is, doesn't preclude walls or outbuildings for players to be in and spraypaint on. Also there's the problem of applying this same logic to other buildings, shops and malls have lots of glass and window displays, should I get to see how many people are in a mall from the outside? -- {{User:Iscariot/Signature}} 16:53, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :Mall is not enclosure. It consists of many different rooms, some are observable, some are not. One can easily find a place not observable through windows. Also, malls from z-movies are usually multi-floors and protection is going for higher floors, giving up ground floor to zombies (too many glass windows to effectively protect it - malls are designed for easy entrance). And standing on the ground you cannot look into higher floors window, if you are nor girafe zombie. Enclosure is another case. It was intentionally designed to be easily observable. Calling it zoo enclosure yet making impossible to look into is non-sense.[[User:Annoynimouse|Shambler for Shambala]] 01:23, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::Zoo displays often have little cubby-things for the animals, like a hollowed out cave tree thing in the tiger exhibit, or little treehouses in the chimp exhibit. If I were in any former animal exhibit, I would probably choose one of those to sleep in. And to spraypaint on, if needed. So that covers the Lion Enclosure and the Bear Pit. For the "houses" and the Aquarium, these are all (I assume) pavilions. These will often either have a big window showing the inside cage or a partway-indoor partway-outdoor animal enclosure, so people can see the animals from inside and outside, with information on the animal within. However, these aren't all-glass buildings, meaning one could easily find a place within either of the "houses" well away from the windows, and you wouldn't be able to hear them through the concrete without sonic ears. And as for the Aquarium, that is a completely normal building. The rest of the blocks in the Zoo are simply empty. *oh dear forgot to sign* --[[User:Enigma179|Enigma]]<sup>[[User talk:Enigma179|<span style="color:orange">talk</span>]] </sup> 10:58, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :::''For the "houses" and the Aquarium, these are all (I assume) pavilions'' - agree on that. Aquariums i saw are usually several glass aquariums encased into internal walls of single usual building with concrete walls. With some controversy in Girafe House description in game, other houses and Aquarium is surely out of scope of this suggestion. G.H. most probably is too (mere description-wise. It casts doubts but not enough to change) but if wished could be adjusted as well (to seek variety in gameplay we might prefer those doubts forementioned) [[User:Annoynimouse|Shambler for Shambala]] 08:02, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :::''And to spraypaint on, if needed'':: no problem. just don't call it "walls". Re-phrase it to be believable. [[User:Annoynimouse|Shambler for Shambala]] 08:34, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :::''cubby-things for the animals, like a hollowed out cave tree thing in the tiger exhibit'' Now try to imagine 65 humans inside the tree, beeing firting, joking, passing teacups one to another, etc. :-) Clearly, that is not THAT kind of internal container. Also think how you would barricade it from zombies. Either you would try to keep them outside fencing (then all my original arguing applies anyway), or you would surrender inside-fencing area to zeds and only barricade and protect the 'cubby-thing', which renders textual description of the place totally inadequate. And i think those cubbies are not strong enough to work against sieges, it should have been barricaded 360 degrees around.[[User:Annoynimouse|Shambler for Shambala]] 08:34, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :::''If I were in any former animal exhibit, I would probably choose one of those to sleep in.'' - Truly so. Reasons would be: psychological comfort of little enclosed space rather than open-air; hiding yourself from random eye-sight of random passing rogue/zombie; protection from weather and warm air of your own breathing. But you would not expect it to be stronghold of 60+ surviviours, would you ? If you were leading few dozens mates across such former exhibit, would you still want them to hide separately in cubbies or stick together in some larger thingie? Aso to speak of nights, it depends upon ambient light. Is it fool moon? Are nearby buildings litten? In megapolises we'd forgotten what the night is. In the vilage it woud be pitch-black, when you would not be able to see your own fingers, so it might still be invisible at night. Not because of fencing, but just because of pitch-black in ruined city. However that still leaves the sounds audible thrugh the fencing. [[User:Annoynimouse|Shambler for Shambala]] 08:34, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :::I actually think this would be a good add-on and a nice challenge. I would like there being a variety of buildings in the city, and having a change of scenery would make for a more interesting game. I understand the objection against x-ray vision, but challenge a person in real life to stare at me through a fence and not be able to see me. For the fact that it would be new and exciting(!), I would vouch ''for''. [[User:John Ibans|John Ibans]] 15:22, 15 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::::Wouldn't this also affect junkyards? [[User:Verance|Verance]] 00:25, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::::: There was a suggestion on that earlier, it was proven via pictographic evidence that the flavor reasoning (Junkyards are chain link fenced) was shit. I think that if junkyards were brought into this discussion it would be promptly and heavily face smashed. -[[User:Devorac|Devorac]] 05:01, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :::::: Link? Date ? interesting. I looked for fencing in prev. suggestions, but they were about *making* cut-wires in doorways, not about how already existing fencing affects gameplay. [[User:Annoynimouse|Shambler for Shambala]] 08:15, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::::: That is the word! thanks. i edited PS:section. That depends on how to imagine them. Something like http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Greener_Pastures_Disposal_Site ? However it is a separate question from the zoo. The zoo is compact location of multiple fenced containers, the junkyards are single locations spread-out over the whole Malton. The effect on gameplay would surely be different and is to be thought off on it's own merits. As for me, the junkyard should be something special, not just same again buildings just painted in brown on map. I am for more variety in Malton. But that is a sugegstion to examine separately, connected to this question but not part of it. [[User:Annoynimouse|Shambler for Shambala]] 06:56, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
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| | | ===Shrink the map=== |
| ===Change Freerunning to Misc. skills=== | |
| {| | | {| |
| |'''Timestamp:''' [[User:Enigma179|Enigma]]<sup>[[User talk:Enigma179|<span style="color:orange">talk</span>]] </sup> 04:23, 13 March 2010 (UTC) | | |'''Timestamp:''' --[[User:Uroguy|Uroguy]]<sup>[[Zookeepers|TMZ]]</sup> 16:28, 14 February 2023 (UTC) |
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| |'''Type:''' Skill change | | |'''Type:''' Map change |
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| |'''Scope:''' Survivors | | |'''Scope:''' Everyone |
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| |'''Description:''' Makes things a tad easier for scientists, and I never really associated vaults, long-jumps and wall-running etc. with soldiers, but with bored teenagers who like running and jumping over stuff. | | |'''Description:''' There are just over 3000 active characters in the game currently likely counting a significant percentage of alts and zergs. Shrinking the map by eliminating the outer first two rings of suburbs would increase the amount of interactions between the remaining characters. This shrink could be increased or decreased depending on future changes to the playerbase. |
| |} | | |} |
| ====Discussion (Change Freerunning to Misc. skills)==== | | ====Discussion (Shrink the map)==== |
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| I could support this. - [[User:Whitehouse]] 11:37, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| Yep --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 11:49, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| Would be a nerf to Military survivors, as free-running is the only really vital skill that is on the Military list. Scientists have at the same time another vital skill with Diagnosis, and IMHO overall the more useful skills. (Healing and reviving are more important in the big picture, and CRing can substitute killing zombies to a good amount. Combat skills are only really useful against rotters, death-cultists, other survivors and other instances where CRing isn't a (sensible) option.) --[[User:Spiderzed|Spiderzed]] 12:48, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :The trade off between military and science skills in combat is just that though. With the science skills, you can combat revive (safely) for 11 AP, at the risk of awakening a death cultist which could potentially do more damage then any zombie, or you could spend some more AP on killing the zed instead, or if it has rot (which I've noticed many zombies have in danger-zones), killing it at all. Also, keep in mind that once that death cultist wakes up, you can't combat revive it back to being a zombie, you have to pull out your trusty shotgun to put it back down. The military skills are far from vital, they are required against a good amount of rotters out there, and pretty important against the other death cultists who really really don't like being alive. And it's hardly a nerf, 25 XP isn't all that much, and imagine how doctors and NecroTech interns feel? --[[User:Enigma179|Enigma]]<sup>[[User talk:Enigma179|<span style="color:orange">talk</span>]] </sup> 15:22, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| Not keen. To me, free-running has always been poorly named - I've seen it more as representing urban warfare tactics like [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mouse-holing mouse-holing] and the like, rather than parkour. If anything, I'd like to see it renamed. Though I do agree that perhaps all the classes should have a greater balance to begin, I don't think this is quite the way to do it. {{User:Misanthropy/Sig}} 14:23, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| So, Nerf to military is 25xp. Boost to science class is 50xp. Civilians and revived zombies would be unaffected. So overall its a bonus. Surely? --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 15:29, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| Why, oh why, oh why, do survivors need anything making easier in this game? A retarded six year old with a crack habit could level a survivor easily enough. -- {{User:Iscariot/Signature}} 16:49, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :I'm willing to pay for that study. --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 16:53, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::I uh... I may live near a school and have some spare time. {{User:Misanthropy/Sig}} 00:18, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :::Crack habits are easy, getting a retarded six year old is the hard thing. Ring Angelina, she knows where to get kids from cheap. While you're on the phone, ask her why she isn't returning my calls. -- {{User:Iscariot/Signature}} 00:34, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::::I can answer your second question Iscariot. It's because she's at Rosslessness' house, taking his money for her crack. {{User:Sorakairi/sig}} 12:09, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
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| | | ===Action Points=== |
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| ===Memories of Life - Necrotech recognition=== | |
| {| | | {| |
| |'''Timestamp:''' {{User:Drawde/Sig}} 22:12, 5 March 2010 (UTC) | | |'''Timestamp:''' [[User:Wolldog1]] 10:07, 26 July 26, 2022 |
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| |'''Type:''' Skill Tweak | | |'''Type:''' Action Points Increase Regeneration Rate |
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| |'''Scope:''' Zombies with [[Memories of Life]]. | | |'''Scope:''' Everyone |
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| |'''Description:''' When a zombie purchases [[Memories of Life]], they will gain the ability to tell Necrotech buildings from ordinary buildings, as if they had purchased the [[Necrotech Employment]] skill. However, if revived, they still cannot use scanners, syringes, or any other Necrotech equipment until they have purchased the Scientist skills. | | |'''Description:''' Due to the passage of time with mobile games and other real time action games without restriction, I think that we should address the action points system of the game. This game can only realistically be played for 5 minutes a day. So it's not really a seller for new blood. If we want to see this game survive it needs to evolve into something more exciting than 5 minutes. My suggestion is double the regeneration rate to improve activity. I love this game. I want to play it more. And the die hard fans I'm sure feel the same. More will go on in a day, sure. But that's for both sides. We're ready for it. Let's get this game moving again. We need this. |
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| Basically, zombies can now tell NT buildings from the street, but nothing else.--{{User:Drawde/Sig}} 22:12, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
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| |} | | |} |
| | | ====Discussion (Action Points)==== |
| ====Discussion (Memories of Life - Necrotech recognition)==== | |
| I tried to get this through with the [[Suggestion:20090201_Scent_Enemy|scent tree]] once. -- {{User:Iscariot/Signature}} 22:18, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :The difference, from what I can see of the spam votes, is that it's not an entirely new skill.--{{User:Drawde/Sig}} 22:20, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
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| Interesting idea, though flavor-wise, it doesn't make sense, since it would imply that every zombie used to be able to identify NT buildings (i.e. they were all Scientists). If we dismiss the flavor concerns though, I tentatively like the idea. I believe in having the skill trees being largely self-contained, and this is one example where they're not. This suggestion would help that. {{User:Aichon/Signature}} 23:30, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :Flavour could be something such as your zombie gaining knowledge of certain buildings, such as in Iscariots suggestion.--{{User:Drawde/Sig}} 22:26, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::That doesn't work though, since MoL's flavor is that the zombie is ''remembering'' things from when they were human, not learning new things. That was my concern about flavor. {{User:Aichon/Signature}} 22:46, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
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| I'm with Aichon on this one, the flavor is messed up all to hell. (Why should reactivating a dead region of the Hippocampus give you access to memories you never had???) That aside I kind of like the idea... I just have this nagging feeling that there is a better way. -[[User:Devorac|Devorac]] 23:41, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
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| Maybe just make it a new skill off the MoL tree. As for flavor, you mean to tell me that, eventually, NecroTech is going to "higher/employ" everyone in the city?--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 19:18, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :That would make it a dupe, and a skill that ''only'' gives the ability to see NT's is retarded.--{{User:Drawde/Sig}} 22:26, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
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| Tie it to Memories by making it a vague description, not the precise marking of NT Employment. Something like "You are standing outside the Building Building. A chemical smell hangs in the air", or "You are standing outside the Building Building. A strange logo hangs over its doors". That way, the intelligence idea is preserved, but the concerns for flavour are addressed. The description, whatever is chosen for it, would only be added to NT buildings, so it does add a modicum of acumen to the zombie with Memories, but not as much as NT Employment would (the 3x3 map wouldn't be affected, for example). Kosher for everyone? {{User:Misanthropy/Sig}} 22:34, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :This idea works (especially the "chemical smell", I think). It's a bit worse than the human skill, but gives the zombies a new, relatively low-value, aspect to MoL while preserving flavor. I'd get behind this idea. {{User:Aichon/Signature}} 22:46, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :: The chemical smell ties into the flavor perfectly, with that change this a definite keeper for me. -[[User:Devorac|Devorac]] 01:13, 7 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::: Just one quick thing, the door one wouldn't work out because from a flavour point of view, any survivor would notice that too, with or without being employed.
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| :::: I'd keep with "Chemical smell" (seems quite plausible). But if that's the case, then this wouldn't go under Memories of Life. --[[User:Acidifiers|Acidifiers]] 06:24, 7 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :::::The flavour would be the newfound recognition of a smell that's always been there, perhaps. {{User:Misanthropy/Sig}} 17:50, 7 March 2010 (UTC)
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| We're now going over the same ground I did when I put this up. The argument boils down to:
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| *Those who want it to be in the Scent tree or the Memories tree
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| *Those that want to to be a free upgrade to an existing skill or an entirely new one
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| *Those who point out the flavour reasoning against either major standpoints
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| -- {{User:Iscariot/Signature}} 13:27, 7 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :Oxford union style?--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 11:52, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :I've always thought a zombie shouldn't have "access" to the "living skills" (like NecroTech Employment) until they have MoL. But in this suggestion, we are boiling it down to making a zombie version of NecroTech Employment. If THAT is a bad idea, then the rest, and the flavor, is moot. If it IS a good idea, what sounds the most reasonable?--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 05:46, 9 March 2010 (UTC)
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| Does this really change anything ? Zombie player can always open wiki-page and just read which buildings are NT. I do not say about possible Mozilla extension to do it.[[User:Annoynimouse|Shambler for Shambala]] 06:01, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :Some people don't meta-game.--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 10:01, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ---- | | ---- |
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|
| ===Consistent Nonsense=== | | ===Drone=== |
| {| | | {| |
| |'''Timestamp:''' {{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 11:34, 3 March 2010 (UTC) | | |'''Timestamp:''' [[User:Rosslessness|<span style="color: MidnightBlue ">R</span><span style="color: Navy">o</span><span style="color: DarkBlue">s</span><span style="color: MediumBlue">s</span><span style="color: RoyalBlue"></span>]][[User_Talk:Rosslessness|<span style="color: RoyalBlue">l</span><span style="color: CornflowerBlue">e</span><span style="color: SkyBlue">s</span><span style="color: LightskyBlue">s</span>]][[User_Talk:Rosslessness/Quiz|<span style="color: LightBlue">n</span><span style="color: PowderBlue">e</span>]][[Monroeville Many|<span style="color: PaleTurquoise">s</span>]][[The Great Suburb Group Massacre|<span style="color: PaleTurquoise">s</span>]]<sup>[[Location Page Building Toolkit|<span style="color: DarkRed">Want a Location Image?]] </span> </sup> 19:10, 23 July 2022 (UTC) |
| |- | | |- |
| |'''Type:''' skill tweak | | |'''Type:''' Survivor Item |
| |- | | |- |
| |'''Scope:''' Anyone with ears. | | |'''Scope:''' Survivors |
| |- | | |- |
| |'''Description:''' If I'm standing outside a building and someone inside emits a [[feeding groan]], I receive a message "You hear a groaning from somewhere nearby." If I'm inside a building and a zombie also inside groans I get a message that says "You hear a groaning from somewhere nearby". If I'm standing outside a building and a zombie that is also outside groans I get the message "You hear a groaning from somewhere nearby". | | |'''Description:''' Portable drone, found in mall tech stores, which are pointless as we all know. Encumbrance is 10%. When activated for 15ap they provide an image of a 10x10 grid centred on the survivor, showing the current outside status of all blocks including zombies, survivors and dead bodies. Like DNA scanners, Drones are multi use. |
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| Simply put. If I'm standing Inside a building and someone feeding groans directly '''outside''' I want to receive a message that says "You hear a groaning from somewhere nearby. --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 11:34, 3 March 2010 (UTC)
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| |} | | |} |
| ====Discussion (Consistent Nonsense)==== | | ====Discussion (Drone)==== |
| Errm... is this really an issue? --[[User:Honestmistake|Honestmistake]] 23:32, 3 March 2010 (UTC)
| | Would there be a message displayed to the players to the effect of "there's a drone buzzing overhead", similar to a flare? --{{User:A Helpful Little Gnome/Sig}} 02:19, 24 July 2022 (UTC) |
| :Not hugely game breaking, but simply a ''tweak''. --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 08:41, 4 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::I know its a simple tweak but is it really a worthwhile tweak? How often does someone groan outside while you are inside.... Don't get me wrong, I would probably vote keep but as is I just can't see it getting any actual usage. --[[User:Honestmistake|Honestmistake]] 13:52, 4 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :::Well, it's just for consistency I think. I mean, how often would a zombie scream street treats instead of eating it itself before it got away? And if you're both inside, then uh... thanks captain obvious. The only one of the three examples that probably could be useful would be hearing one inside from out. [[User:Enigma179|Enigma]]<sup>[[User talk:Enigma179|<span style="color:orange">talk</span>]] </sup> 14:11, 4 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::::I get the consistency argument, but I think this is a matter of it being unnecessary. If you're in a siege and zombies are dragging folks outside, you hearing the groans of the zombies outside is entirely unnecessary and completely distracting (especially in malls). Same goes for street treats: groaning for them is counter-productive to the zombie cause, since you'd be pulling zombies away from actual targets. I think it's a simple matter of practicality that we don't hear them already. {{User:Aichon/Signature}} 17:41, 4 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :::::True, but say Im inside a dark building and someone drags another survivor outside, they can groan to let me finish the job for them. --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 18:40, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::::::I'd see a situation like that and would identify it as the prime example of why this suggestion is unnecessary. At least with the MOB, when we drag a survivor outside, we generally don't finish them since it's a waste of AP for us to do so. Ferals or zealots (members of MOB not in strike teams) will finish them off in a matter of minutes anyway. If they groan, that's just irresponsible of them, since groaning is supposed to lead to a source of food, and a single, almost-dead survivor is not a good source of food for a group of zombies. {{User:Aichon/Signature}} 18:49, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :::::::No. But to a level one zombie a survivor on 12hp is XP gold. --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 19:17, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ::::::::Very true, but I just don't think it matters. Let's go through the scenarios.
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| ::::::::*If a zombie is in a strike team, either they're not a lowbie or they're gonna get fed by the team (most hordes have this policy). Getting fed is better XP than an injured street treat (sustained 100+XP/day at times).
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| ::::::::*If they're feral, then they're probably not inside the building anyway, but are instead following groans, so they'll kill the street treat on the way in.
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| ::::::::*If we assume they are in the building already, then they have no way to tell the indoor groans from the outdoor, since the message you propose is the same as what's used for indoors currently.
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| ::::::::**Also, even if they did, they'd have no way of knowing if the street treat is still alive, since zombie anonymity would keep them from being able to tell if the zombie that dragged is back indoors.
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| ::::::::**Complicating matters further, due to zombie anonymity, the other zombies outside wouldn't know if there was a lowbie inside anyway, so they'd have no reason to groan in the first place.
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| ::::::::I just don't see a scenario where a zombie would need it. All it would do is cause screen spam. Older zombies have no need for the XP, ferals kill these targets in mere minutes anyway, and lowbies can't be identified unless they're on your contacts list (i.e. in your group, basically), in which case they're already being tended to. {{User:Aichon/Signature}} 19:48, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
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| Why the hell not?{{User:Lelouch/sig}} 02:41, 4 March 2010 (UTC)
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| I don't see why not... [[User:Enigma179|Enigma]]<sup>[[User talk:Enigma179|<span style="color:orange">talk</span>]] </sup> 10:27, 4 March 2010 (UTC)
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| I'm not actually following your suggestion, I'm guessing you were tired when you wrote it. Why don't we just have it as "Groaning nearby" is the location you are in when you receive the message and add a new qualifier to messages in the same block but elsewhere as regards the doors, "You hear a low groaning outside/inside"? -- {{User:Iscariot/Signature}} 18:43, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :Fair. --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 19:17, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
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| That would allow building protecters to jump out on the street and help someone newb who got in trouble (if zombie calls for dinner - he probably is in trouble :-) ). Without need to spend APs and patrol around just for case.[[User:Annoynimouse|Shambler for Shambala]] 06:06, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| :Well all the survivor would do is shoot the zombie, out on the street, thus causing the zombie to stand back up and kill the survivor. There's no way anyone can really "save" another player.--{{User:Yonnua Koponen/signature}} 10:03, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ---- | | ---- |
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| ===Crack Heads=== | | ===Backpack=== |
| {| | | {| |
| |'''Timestamp:''' {{User:Sorakairi/sig}} 12:11, 25 February 2010 (UTC) | | |'''Timestamp:''' [[User:Wild Crazy|Wild Crazy]] ([[User talk:Wild Crazy|talk]]) 20:55, 20 September 2021 (UTC) |
| |- | | |- |
| |'''Type:''' Skill | | |'''Type:''' New item |
| |- | | |- |
| |'''Scope:''' Zombies | | |'''Scope:''' Survivors |
| |- | | |- |
| |'''Description:''' Skill gives Zombies 40% chance to do extra 1 damage while biting by cracking open the skull. Also heals 1HP if successful. Any bite attampt after this has a 10% higher chance of gaining the head bite. As usual, can be fixed with FAK, like everything else. | | |'''Description:''' This will be a new item found in schools with a 2% find rate and sports stores with a 4% find rate. The low numbers are because, like a flak jacket, once you find it you have it forever. It increases you encumbrance by 30%. However, you can't use an item that is in your backpack until you remove it from the backpack. It costs one AP to add an item to your backpack and one AP to remove an item. An item affects your regular encumbrance until added to the backpack. Items such as GPS, radios, cell phones, and flak jacket do not work when in your backpack. Items in your backpack will not be shown in your inventory, but the backpack itself will be shown in your inventory. There will be a drop box next to the word backpack that shows all the items inside. When you click on an item in that drop box, it removes it from your backpack (1 AP). |
| |}
| |
| ====Discussion (Crack Heads)====
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| Are you saying that a player with a cracked skull suffers 5hp damage from all bite attacks? --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 20:45, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
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| :No, I'm saying that, once cracked, a Zombie has a 50% chance of doing 5HP damage from connecting bite attacks. {{User:Sorakairi/sig}} 22:16, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
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| Kind of like a specialized tangling grasp for bite? --[[User:Honestmistake|Honestmistake]] 23:28, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
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| :Possibly. It sounds like once a zombie bites, subsequent bites have a chance of doing +1 damage.--[[User:Pesatyel|Pesatyel]] 04:48, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
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| ::What I had intended was that, firstly, the zombie has to get a successful bite attack. Then, they have a 40% chance to crack the skull. If the skull is cracked, the zombie does 1 extra damage, gets 1HP, and raises the chance of cracking the skull to 50%. Then the cycle repeats, except subsequent bites don't raise the crack chance. {{User:Sorakairi/sig}} 06:32, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
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| I'm having a real hard time understanding it. Can you give me an example. My Zombie ALAN managers to enter a autor repair shop and sees NEWB1 standing there. I click bite. What happens Next? --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 09:41, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
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| :And I'm having real hard time trying to find an explanation!
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| :*Alan's first bite is rolled at 40% chance and succeeds, initiating a secondary roll which also has a 40% chance of hitting.
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| ::*The secondary roll fails, Alan does 4 damage.
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| :::*No changes occur, next bite is rolled just as the first one.
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| ::*The secondary roll succeeds, Alan does 5 damage and inflicts "cracked head" upon Newb1.
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| :::*Subsequent attacks against Newb1 have their secondary roll at 50% chance due to Newb1 suffering from "cracked head".
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| :I hope that helped, I don't know why but I found that really difficult to explain. - [[User:Whitehouse]] 12:04, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
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| | Q: Wouldn't this buff survivors, since they can carry more bullets and kill more zombies? |
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| Ok. Does tangling grasp alter this in any way.?
| | A: Since it costs an AP to add and remove an item, it wastes a lot of AP to put bullet clips in your backpack if you are planning on using them right away. |
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| is cracked head a condition, like being infected?
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| If another zombie bites NEWB1 between my attacks do I lose the bonus. --{{User:Rosslessness/Sig}} 13:40, 26 February 2010 (UTC) | | Q: If it wastes AP, what is the point? |
| :I'm pretty sure it's like infection, because he said it could be fixed with a good FAKing. [[User:Enigma179|Enigma]]<sup>[[User talk:Enigma179|<span style="color:orange">talk</span>]] </sup> 13:57, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
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| Assuming this (or something easier to understand but similar in effect) was implemented it would have to cause 4+1 damage rather than a straight 5 or flak would just make it pointless! --[[User:Honestmistake|Honestmistake]] 13:36, 27 February 2010 (UTC)
| | A: It will be useful if you want to carry around an extra stash of items, such as FAKs and Revivification Syringes, or if you are going far away from any resource buildings and need some extra supplies. |
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| Sorry for the confusion. What Whitehouse has said is correct. That is the way I wanted it to be like. Probably should have provided an example. {{User:Sorakairi/sig}} 13:53, 27 February 2010 (UTC)
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| Exactly what Honestmistake said. XP is based on damage actually caused, therefore the only people that are going to suffer the extra damage are non-rotten zombies and newbies who haven't found a flak yet. -- {{User:Iscariot/Signature}} 06:51, 28 February 2010 (UTC)
| | Please give your thoughts. |
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| Simplify it down to just being a child skill of tangling grasp that means all successful bites while grasping cause an additional 1 point of damage. I've not done the maths but I would not be surprised if maxed claws were still better in the long run but still. Remember though, to make it meaningful it must be an extra point rather than a flat 5.--[[User:Honestmistake|Honestmistake]] 12:12, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
| | |} |
| :Hmmm. I don't know, flavor-wise it seems like a cracked skull would be a pretty serious problem, more serious than 1HP. But the HP system isn't exactly realistic to begin with. Either way it might be worth it to change the name of the suggestion if it went up for a vote. Something like, "gripping bite". And perhaps polish the explanation a little better.--{{User:Giles Sednik/sig}} 09:06, 10 March 2010 (UTC)
| | ====Discussion (Backpack)==== |
| ::How about "Messy Eater: While grasping a foe the zombie uses its jaws to greater effect. All bites while grasping a target will cause an additional 1 point of damage" Leaves a lot of room for individuals to imagine their own flavour but still gives an explanaition for the extra effect. --[[User:Honestmistake|Honestmistake]] 09:14, 10 March 2010 (UTC)
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| Sorry about the delayed reaction. Thanks for all the feedback, and especial thanks to Whitehouse. I'll suggest your idea Whitehouse, with credit to you for the betterness. {{User:Sorakairi/sig}} 11:59, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
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| ---- | | ---- |
|
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| ==Suggestions up for voting==
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| [[Suggestion:20100316 Flares or Flare Guns?|Flares or Flare Guns?]]
| |
