Suggestions/17th-Apr-2006

Closed Suggestions

1. These suggestions are now closed. No more voting or editing is to be done to them.
2. Suggestions with a rational Vote tally of 2/3 Keeps over total of Keeps, Kills, and Spams will be moved to the Peer Reviewed Suggestions page by a moderator, unless the original author has re-suggested the Suggestion.
3. Suggestions under the 2/3 proportion but with more or equal Keeps to Kills ration will be moved to the Undecided Suggestions page.
4. All other Suggestions will be moved to either the Peer Rejected Suggestions page or the Humorous Suggestions page.
5. Some suggestions may not be moved in a timely manner; moving Suggestions to Peer Reviewed Suggestions page will take higest priority.
6. Again, DO NOT EDIT THIS PAGE IN ANY WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM. It will be used as a historical record and will eventually be locked.

VOTING ENDS: 1st-May-2006

Advance NecroNet Training

Timestamp:	08:56, 17 April 2006 (BST)
Type:	Skill
Scope:	All players
Description:	As scientists practice using the NecroNet machinery they become more skilled in using it meaning that they are much quicker at using the machinery. This idea is just for a skill for NT guys to spend 5Ap less on making a syringe taking it down to 15Ap for making one syringe. This means that scientists will be able to make one extra syringe on the whole (presuming they use 60Ap). So what does this mean to Zombies then if survivors can make more syringes? Well it'll mean almost nothing really. The NT guy would only realistically revive only 1.5 Zombies on average per day (Three Zombies over a two day cycle) for either manufacturing syringes at 15Ap or 20Ap each. Ok, sure in theory you could revive two Zombies in one day but that would mean the NT guy would be stuck out on the street alone and cold. So really the amount of revives wouldn't go up. What this means to the NT guys though is that they have 5 to 10 extra AP or so to spend for the day. This could be used to get to and back from safety without cutting it as close. For all of those people who will say, "But that means no one will search for the syringes any more". Although that would be true most likely there is also the consideration on finding fuel and a generator to keep this running which I believe would lead it to being overall equal in Ap cost as searching for a syringe.

Votes

1. Kill - The rate was set that high because it was the average amount of searches it look to find syringes. We've seen that excessive supply leads to excessive usage (Combat revives following Caiger 1 Find Rate Spike), and that ease of use leads to over use (Post NT net CRs). As it stands it's fairly balanced. Velkrin 09:09, 17 April 2006 (BST)
   • Re - I don't see how this could lead to over use. Sure NT guys can make 1 more syringe per day (at tops). As either system would work, if you made 3 syringes at 20AP each on the first day that would be 40AP left for the next day to revive 3 Zombies. If you made 4 syringes at 15AP each that would leave 40AP the next day and you don't want to revive 4 Zombies because you'll end out stuck on the street. So the only real difference is that the NT guy would have 1 more syringe every two days. - Jedaz 09:19, 17 April 2006 (BST)

   • Re - The tricky thing about the game is that seemingly little changes can completely throw it off. Lets do the current math. Assuming you start with 48 AP (24 hours worth), you could make 2 syringes, and be left with 8 AP. The next day you'll have 50 AP if you log in at the same time, but you could use up to 56 AP if you logged in earlier. Assuming you did that would leave you with 16 AP after making two syringes. Day 3 you could make 3 syringes and be left with 4 AP. Short version: 2/8, 2/16, 3/4, 2/12, 3/0 Under your suggestion it would go 3/3, 3/6, 3/9, 3/12, 4/0. So instead of having 12 over 5 days you'd have 16 over 5 days, creating a stockpile for the syringe makers. As I mentioned with Caiger siege 1, you had a surge in syringe numbers followed by a huge number of combat revives. While revives still cost 10 AP for a non-rot zombie, people who saw this change would think reviving is easier again and promptly attempt combat revives again. The trick is that if players think something is easier, they're going to do it more often. I also have to wonder how you managed to get 100 AP in two days. It's only 96 per 48 hours. Velkrin 09:58, 17 April 2006 (BST)

   • Re - I stretched the numbers a bit for ease. Thats how I got 100AP in two days. Any way you are presuming that you don't revive Zombies which is a major factor. Ok, sure over 5 days you will make 4 more syringes. So you take 3 days to use all of your syringes (total 8 days) if you have 12. Or 4 days to use 16 syringes (total of 9 days). The only difference between both is one day realy, and it's not like it's a realy short period of time, in less than one week the situation in the game can change very quickly regardless if this is implemented or not. Any way I'm not going to argue that if people think something is easier then they will do it more. - Jedaz 10:14, 17 April 2006 (BST)

   • Notice - Again? I have to use a Notice AGAIN??? --Cyberbob240^CDF 10:16, 17 April 2006 (BST) Notices are supposed to be in some way informative.--The General ^{W! Mod} 13:42, 18 April 2006 (BST)
2. Kill - Manufacturing costs 20ap for a reason. Dont mess with that. If you want more, try searching. --Grim s 09:09, 17 April 2006 (BST) Edit: - And dont give us crap about NT's being hard to play. Im playing one right now and its pathetically easy to level up, hide, and otherwise do all scientist tasks. (And im in Grigg Heights, a contested suburb) --Grim s 09:26, 17 April 2006 (BST)
   • Re - I never said NT's were hard to play (well once you get free running they are realy easy but which class isn't?), next time don't try and read too much into things. - Jedaz 09:36, 17 April 2006 (BST)
     • Re - I know you didnt say it, but it was a pre-emptive assault on just that justification being thrown around for such a skill. Its been done countless times in the past, so i felt justified in rebutting it before it was made. And as for free running, my NT only got that yesterday, and spent a week running around a zombie infested suburb tagging and reviving to get the exp required, hiding inside Grey Bank (4, 51) with no death or other unpleasantness befalling him (Im no longer in that building, and the character doesnt follow my previous naming conventions, so you will never find him). --Grim s 09:42, 17 April 2006 (BST)
       • Re - In a debate you don't just rebut something if you are the first speaker or if it hasn't been said. Plus also you don't need to keep arguing about the difficulty or lack of it, I alredy agreed that it wasn't any more difficult than any other class, but I don't belive that this change would make things much easier for NT guys. On another note you seem to imply that I would go and attack your game character for some reason. Trust me, I'm not that petty. - Jedaz 10:22, 17 April 2006 (BST)
         • Re - I should have been more clear that i was talking to the crowd with everything after the edit i made in my first comment. My apologies. --Grim s 10:24, 17 April 2006 (BST)
           • Re - No worries then - Jedaz 10:34, 17 April 2006 (BST)
3. Keep - Doesn't affect revive rates, and allows NT's to get to cover? Two thumbs-up from me. --Cyberbob240^CDF 09:12, 17 April 2006 (BST) Edit: Grim s, you can't stop attacking people, can you? He wasn't whining about anything. TURN IT OFF. --Cyberbob240^CDF 09:28, 17 April 2006 (BST)
4. Kill - Either be happy you have Necronet at all, or search for syringes instead of manufacturing. -Nubis _A.R.S.E. 09:14, 17 April 2006 (BST)
   • Re - This is actualy designed to be a round about way of dealing with the 10AP cost that was slaped on NT guys for reviving Zombies. - Jedaz 09:23, 17 April 2006 (BST)
     • Re - And since the game isn't in a horrible state of disrepair because of that change, why do we need to change it? -Nubis _A.R.S.E. 09:33, 17 April 2006 (BST)
     • Notice - Discussion moved to talk page. Advance NecroNet Training- Jedaz 09:43, 17 April 2006 (BST)
5. Kill - Whatever the numbers say, anything like this could unbalance the game.--The General ^{W! Mod} 09:27, 17 April 2006 (BST)
6. Kill - Seeing as some people still think (erroneously) that it's useful to combat revive my zombie characters, and that my survivor has no problem getting syringes, I don't believe this is a needed change. If the ratio switches heavily in favor of the zombies, suggest this again pretty much as is.--Guardian of Nekops 09:38, 17 April 2006 (BST)
   • Re - Although I don't reckon that it would change the combat revives I will suggest this again if there is a large ratio change - Jedaz 09:45, 17 April 2006 (BST)
7. Kill - Don't mess with the AP to syringe ratio. -Craw 10:19, 17 April 2006 (BST)
8. Kill - What they all said. --Mookiemookie 12:11, 17 April 2006 (BST)
9. Kill - 5 AP savings is a little too generous. If it only saved 3 AP it would be in line with the search odds and would make manufacturing syringes worthwhile. (It's pretty stupid as it is, searching is much more fruitful.) --John Ember 15:08, 17 April 2006 (BST)
10. Keep -I'm not sure the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" argument flies here, so I am voting Keep, if just to make this an implement option. I do however agree that the current system (20AP Manufacture,10AP Revive) should be given some time to see how it works itself out. Right now, we're sitting at the extreme end of the pendulum swing, from capricious combat-revives to long lines at revive points, but hopefully once the NTs start figuring out how best to work within (and work together) the new system, it should even out a bit. Otherwise, this seems a sensible option.--Xavier06 19:17, 17 April 2006 (BST)
11. Kill - I've never bothered with manufacturing, anyways. I tend to find them pretty easily.--Wifey 19:25, 17 April 2006 (BST)
12. Kill - the game is finnally getting intersting, 50/50 why do people insist on 'fixing' the last update --xbehave 20:08, 17 April 2006 (BST)
13. Kill - There's a reason that we've finally reached a 50/50 ratio. - CthulhuFhtagn 21:24, 17 April 2006 (BST)
14. Keep - Although I would like to see it (and other skills) be made Starting class specific. A 25% reduction in manufacture cost seems reasonable considering the learning curve on other skills. Removed unsigned vote, remove strikeout when timestamp is added--Bermudez 23:17, 17 April 2006 (BST)
15. Kill - The game is balanced, don't go breaking it again.--Bermudez 23:20, 17 April 2006 (BST)
16. Kill -No no no. It's not even 50/50 yet. Haet--Mpaturet 23:49, 17 April 2006 (BST)
17. Kill - Take your CR nerf like a man, and Daddy will take you out for ice cream after! --Undeadinator 03:30, 18 April 2006 (BST)
18. Kill - Multiply it by a billion. Dickus Maximus 06:04, 28 April 2006 (BST)
    • Tally - 15 Kill, 2 Keep, 17 Total.--The General ^{W! Mod} 15:27, 1 May 2006 (BST)

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Only show last days worth of feeding groans

Timestamp:	12:26, 17 April 2006 (BST)
Type:	improvement
Scope:	Zombies (mainly)
Description:	I think that when a zombie logs in they should only see the last days worth of feeding groans. This is to reduce the ridiculously large amount of spam you get when you log in. One day is easily sufficient because nothing older then that is going to be any use in finding safehouses and, in practice, it usually has to be minutes ago in order to be of any use. It also makes sense: if dead bodies can't hear, possibly useful, talking, then why should they have to read several pages of spam! Sum up: Zombie only hear the last days worth of feeding groans.

Votes

1. Keep - Author vote. Of course I like my own suggestion!--The General ^{W! Mod} 12:26, 17 April 2006 (BST)
2. Keep - A little hard to read, but from what I can tell it looks pretty good. --Cyberbob240^CDF 12:31, 17 April 2006 (BST) Edit: Thanks for the edit. Much easier to understand :) --Cyberbob240^CDF 12:38, 17 April 2006 (BST)
3. Keep - 'cause I liked it before. Now, if you had an option to not see the groans at all I'd love you. *ahem* .... BuncyTheFrog ^{Talk GBP} 14:01, 17 April 2006 (BST)
4. Keep - I'm all for less spam--Mookiemookie 14:20, 17 April 2006 (BST)
5. Keep - This is great, and to be honest, I actually think the last 5 hour of groan will do, with the speed of human barrication, most location had groans 5 hours before will be totally rebarricated, or for some huge hordes attack like TSO attacks, groans of the last hour will be effectively useless as all the survivors will be killed or left. --Changchad 14:42, 17 April 2006 (BST)
6. Keep - Just to clarify, would it be just groans from the last 24 hours, or just groans since 00:00 GMT? Apart from that, great suggestion. Catriona McM 14:44, 17 April 2006 (BST)
   • Re - I think the fairest way to do it would be to have it from the last 24 hours but it might be too much server load.--The General ^{W! Mod} 15:34, 17 April 2006 (BST)
     • Re - Well, going to the assumption that DNA Scans are reset every 24hrs I don't see how it could. -- Andrew McM ^W! 17:52, 17 April 2006 (BST)
7. Keep - I only follow the most recent groans anyway. --John Ember 15:03, 17 April 2006 (BST)
8. Keep - I agree this would reduce the groans spam. --Abi79 ^AB 15:07, 17 April 2006 (BST)
9. Keep - Sounds good. --Technerd 16:34, 17 April 2006 (BST)
10. Keep - I'm not a zombie but even I think this is a good idea. Agent Heroic 18:09, 17 April 2006 (BST)
11. Keep - works for me --CPQD 18:46, 17 April 2006 (BST)
12. Keep - Old feeding growns make me sad. -Banana Bear4 19:22, 17 April 2006 (BST)
13. Keep - Old feeding groans confuse the baby zombies. Please, think of the baby zombies. And the black-necked swans. MaulMachine 19:24, 17 April 2006 (BST)
14. Kill- Frankly, at this point, the spam doesn't bother me. Even at the height of the Caigar Seige, I scrolled through it pretty fast. You don't have to read it, people. But I do agree that there is little use for out-of-date Feeding Groans and I'd vote "Keep" for this if it was allowed as an option. There might be people out there who want to follow the zombie migratory patterns/wake of destruction. A niggling point, I know, but that's me.--Xavier06 19:27, 17 April 2006 (BST)
15. Keep - It's not like any groans that are more than a day old are relevant, anyways. Either all of the harmanz are eaten, or the place is barricaded again.--Wifey 19:31, 17 April 2006 (BST)
16. Keep - True, any groans over 24 hours the info is not useful anyways. The building could have brand new barricades by then. And if there's a lot of feeding groans in my area, I'll probably be a zombie myself by the time I log on. --MrAushvitz 23:09, 17 April 2006 (BST)
17. Keep - Although it seems limited in its effectiveness if you log in each day. -Nubis _A.R.S.E. 23:24, 17 April 2006 (BST)
18. Keep - <3 this suggestion.--Mpaturet 23:31, 17 April 2006 (BST)
19. Keep - Sure, you can scroll down... but doing that can make you overlook other messages you might have wanted to read. --Certified=Insane 00:59, 18 April 2006 (BST)
20. Keep - Bueno! Prevents spam, retains useful info --Tetra 02:36, 18 April 2006 (BST)
21. Keep - Who cares about the old groans anyway? I don't pay any attention to them unless they happened within the hour--Teksura 06:06, 22 April 2006 (BST)
22. Keep - Good idea, don't need to know about yesterday's lunch! -- --Mister Sandmann 00:56, 1 May 2006 (BST)
23. kill - what Xavier06 said--xbehave 18:19, 30 April 2006 (BST)
    • Tally - 21 Keep, 2 Kill, 23 Total.--The General ^{W! Mod} 15:24, 1 May 2006 (BST)

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Both Guns Blazing

Spaminated with 14 Spam, need I say more?--The General ^{W! Mod} 13:27, 18 April 2006 (BST)

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Revival Candidate Selection

Timestamp:	08:04, 17 April 2006 (BST)
Type:	Revive option
Scope:	Random choice of another zombie in stack, after a wasted revive
Description:	The above suggestion is brilliant, but let's simplify and balence it very carefully (if I can do it, god help us all!) Revival Candidate Selection New science skill appears after NecroNet Access on science skills tree. Adds no benefit to you zombie character. After unsuccessfully attempting to revive from a stack of zombies for the first time at this location in the last 24 hours, the reviver then gets the target option "a random zombie" from the pulldown menu, if they so choose. What this means: Once you've already wasted a revive at this location, and there are other zombies here you want to help. You have the option to choose any other zombie other than the one you just attempted on. The selection is random (any zombie other than that one you just "tested" on.) All this would do, is make it possible for you to choose another zombie at this location, it does not prevent you from losing the 1st revive needle.. but you are free to help others, if you can, and are willing to do so. In this manner rotters still get to "screw" revive scientists (making them throw their taped glasses to the ground and curse vehemently at the cost of the medicines), but the wiser of these scientists are free to use the scientific method and try, try again until they get a success! Zombies who prefer to be human will get revived more easily, or sooner, vote accordingly if you hate being a zombie for a long time.

Votes

1. Keep - Can't screw anonymity because all you're doing is walking up to another zombie and sticking the needle in that other one's head. MrAushvitz 08:04, 17 April 2006 (BST)
2. Kill - Okay, I agonized over this one. You've put together the best suggestion along these lines that I've seen (but seem to have got it in just as the page was being cycled over, hence the lack of activity), so good job. However, the principle of the game seems to be that zombies always appear as a unified horde to the user. You can't pick and choose zombies from the list unless you have them as contacts. Since survivors can add rotters to their contact lists and avoid sticking them that way, or can just refrain from sticking any zombies they don't have on their lists as known survivor players, I don't think we need to further erode the horde approach -- even with an option to pick "any zombie but this zombie."--John Ember 22:55, 17 April 2006 (BST)
3. Keep - good idea!--Flarias12:23, 19 April 2006 (BST)
4. Keep - good idea and come on how hard is it to stab zombie number 2 in the neck with a syringe than zombie number 1 realy now.--LCpl Mendoza 19:07,27 April 2006 (EST)
5. Keep - Makes sense that if you see a brain rotter you can pick another zombie to revive--xbehave 01:09, 1 May 2006 (BST)
   • Tally - 4 Keep, 1 Kill, 5 Total.--The General ^{W! Mod} 15:22, 1 May 2006 (BST)

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Beatdown

Timestamp:	08:36, 17 April 2006 (BST)
Type:	Yet another blunt weapon suggestion
Scope:	Yet another blunt weapon suggestion
Description:	Beatdown Civillian skill, does NOT add a benefit to your zombie character. Any time a living survivor has taken at least 20 points of blunt weapon damage from successful attacks in the last hour. Blunt Trauma Damage comes into effect. Blunt Trauma Damage So long as a survivor suffering from "Blunt Trauma Damage" is at 40 or less HP, whenever they are healed by the use of an FAK, it heals 4 less points per FAK used. Once a survivor has healed to 41 or more HP the red "Blunt Trauma Damage" status on their map is gone, and they now heal normally. This healing difficulty relates to internal bleeding, concussions and the like, better medical facilities are required to help those suffering from these effects. Why Bother? Beatdown is a skill which is intended to allow humans to "punish" other humans for certain infractions "in game" as a result of endangering people to zombies, looting, destroying generators, being a zombie spy, etc. or it is a skill highly prized by many gangs and PK'ers, fighting over turf (even the police have the occasional use for this skill, only other cops are invited to partake.) This skill's time limit usually means to be successful your blunt weapon accuracy must be decent, or it would help if several players were bludgeoning the same player.. hence the name "beatdown." In this manner, it allows a non-lethal, but very painful method of discouraging other players from being in your area, without having to murder them per se. Players could for example have a conversation about another player's actions at a nearby building, agree to all go over there and kick so and so's ass, and proceed to do so, leaving a message telling them to "leave town" or "betta get muh money to me biatch" and so forth. There could be spraypainted messages at hospitals "do not treat "so and so" he is a zombie spy bastard" etc. How it is used is up to the imagination. It is a human vs. human non-lethal combat option, also a nasty way to deal with traitors who switch sides in the middle of a zombie fight that you want slowed, but not dead (yet.)

Votes

1. Keep - Has some promise. And when the chips are down, is this not how often people solve their problems under stress, with violence? MrAushvitz 08:36, 17 April 2006 (BST)
2. Keep - Thats how it works in the real world, why not Malton? --CaptainM ^P 09:13, 17 April 2006 (BST)
3. Keep - Ha ha, this is awesome. Keeper! --John Ember 15:18, 17 April 2006 (BST)
4. Kill How did everyone miss this? This encourages survivors to attack each other and cause heavy amounts of grief without killing them, and thus, won't be ocunted as PKers. Healing 1 HP per FAK is a horrible amount, and at that rate, it would take 40 FAKs to undo the damage done to you! They don't kill the target, but they make it so that they're easily killable by anyone nearby, and griefs them incredibly by almost removing their ability to heal! --Volke 18:34, 17 April 2006 (BST)
5. Kill - Realistically, it's 6 HP per FAK. But hey, same diff. - DavidMalfisto 20:52, 17 April 2006 (BST)
6. Kill - Every PKer in Malton would buy this skill overnight. Think it through. --Max Grivas 05:58, 18 April 2006 (BST)
7. Kill -Don't disagree with the idea per se, but I do have a question to be resolved before I can vote "Keep": Does everyone need to have the Beatdown skill for this to work? If, say, one person with the skill beat his victim, but only for 18, would someone without the skill be able to activate it if they did the extra two damage? In essense, does the Trauma status kick in after the first Beatdown hit (and then activate when the required damage is received) or does the victim have to receive all his beatings from someone with the skill before it works? Otherwise, not a bad way to make useless weapons sorta useful without overpowering them.--Xavier06 00:16, 19 April 2006 (BST)
8. Keep - Oh this is good.and its good for humiliation too.Suggestion though is that HP just heal 2 less though.would be more fair me thinks.--LCpl Mendoza 19:13,27 April 2006 (EST)
9. Kill - I like this, but indeed it is a mighty attractive skill for griefers. Change the HP per FAK and you'll have my vote. Monkeylord 03:35, 29 April 2006 (BST)
10. Kill - PK party woooo! Tokakeke 04:33, 1 May 2006 (BST)
    • Tally - 6 Kill, 4 Keep, 10 Total.--The General ^{W! Mod} 15:21, 1 May 2006 (BST)

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