Developing Suggestions

Developing Suggestions

This section is for presenting and reviewing suggestions which have not yet been submitted and are still being worked on.

Nothing on this page will be archived.

Further Discussion

• Discussion concerning this page takes place here.
• Discussion concerning the suggestions system in general, including policies about it, takes place here.

Please Read Before Posting

• Be sure to check The Frequently Suggested List and the Suggestions Dos and Do Nots before you post your idea. You can read about many ideas that have been suggested already, which users should be aware of before posting what could be a dupe: a duplicate of an existing suggestion. These include Machine Guns and Sniper Rifles.
• Users should be aware that page is discussion oriented. Other users are free to express their own point of view and are not required to be neutral.
• If you decide not to take your suggestion to voting, please remove it from this page to avoid clutter.
• It is recommended that users spend some time familiarizing themselves with this page before posting their own suggestions.
• After new game updates, users are requested to allow time for the game and community to adjust to these changes before suggesting alterations.

How To Make a Suggestion

Adding a New Suggestion

• Copy the code in the box below.
• Click here to begin editing. This is the same as clicking the [edit] link to the right of the Suggestions header.

• Paste the copied text above the other suggestions, right under the heading.
• Substitute the text in RED CAPITALS with the details of your suggestion.

{{subst:DevelopingSuggestion
|time=~~~~
|name=SUGGESTION NAME
|type=TYPE HERE
|scope=SCOPE HERE
|description=DESCRIPTION HERE
}}

• Name - Give the suggestion a short but descriptive name.
• Type is the nature of the suggestion, such as a new class, skill change, balance change, etc. Basically: What is it? and Is it new, or a change?
• Scope is who or what the suggestion affects. Typically survivors or zombies (or both), but occasionally Malton, the game interface or something else.
• Description should be a full explanation of your suggestion. Include information like flavor text, search odds, hit percentages, etc, as appropriate. Unless you are as yet unsure of the exact details behind the suggestion, try not to leave out anything important. Check your spelling and grammar.

Cycling Suggestions

• Suggestions with no new discussion in the past two days should be given a warning notice. This can be done by adding {{SDW|date}} at the top of the discussion section, where date is the day the suggestion will be removed.
• Suggestions with no new discussion in the past week may be removed.
• If you are adding a comment to a suggestion that has the warning template please remove the {{SDW|date}} at the top of the discussion section to show that there is still ongoing discussion.

This page is prone to breaking when the page gets too long, so sometimes suggestions still under discussion will be moved to the Overflow page, so the discussion can continue.

Please add new suggestions to the top of the list

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Suggestions

New class: Ganster

Timestamp: User:Richerd joshepson/Sig 06:34, 30 March 2010 (BST)

Type: New class

Scope:New players and old players who needs more variarity

Description:In this incredible game, you can decide be a survivor or a zombie, if you choose be a survivor, you can be a militar, a scientist or a civil, the civils are Doctors, Police officers, Firefighters and Consumers, everyone fighting for they own life, but, how do the criminals to survive the outbreak, or theres no crime in the city of malton? As a ganster, you starts with shotgun training skill, a shotgun an spare ammo(4 or 6 shells) and a knife or a melee weapon and the hand to hand combat skill(a real ganster should be better equiped) and you pay 75 exp points for civilians skill and military skills(the gansters knows who attack like soldiers and act like normal people) and 150 exp points for scientist skills, obviously, they are not the smarter guys of the town, and the startup message could be You are in a job, there is a dead body near you,the job is not very nice, but it gives some money, then, there are a lot of activity, shots, screams, cops and soldiers everywhere, you think, maybe a gang war, but,the body in the room rises, he tries to attack you, you run out of the building, and you dicover a ten thousands worser scene, zombies, with blood in their mouths and your patners are dead in a crash car, you take a weapon from the car, you leave the block, running for the city, at least, you find a safe place,then you think, if the hell exists, it moves to malton. or a shorter version of that. Notes If someday includes machine-guns in the game, this class can starts with that weapon. the shotgun training skill can be swapped for tha basic firearm training skill.

Discussion (New Class: Gangster)

Emm... use the proper format first off, and gangsters are way overpowered, if they start with 4 shells, a shotgun, 2 skills, and only pay 75 xp for all but 7 of the skills in this game. --Enigma^talk 04:51, 31 March 2010 (BST)

I fixed it.-Pesatyel 05:39, 31 March 2010 (BST)

Actually you got the discussion header wrong, but it's all good now. -Devorac 06:56, 31 March 2010 (BST)

We already have Convict in Peer Review. Similarly, we have Punk. The problem with "new" classes is that they aren't really necessary since, by level 6ish, every class is essentially the same. Everyone takes Body Building, Construction, Diagnosis, Free Running and NecroTech Employment. Healers will take Lab Experience and combat types will take Hand to Hand (or another gun skill). Everything else is "personal preference" and, yes, I know so is the list above, but those skills are the ones everyone takes pretty quick. As for the suggestion itself, as pointed out, it is overpowered. NO class starts with 2 skills, so why should this one? Secondly, which "category" would this be in? THAT would dicatate the cost of the skill purchases.--Pesatyel 05:39, 31 March 2010 (BST)

First question, is your first language English? Next question, how do you justify a class that will out level every other current class (No class yet has two 25% cost deductions to their skill tracks), comes out hotter (two start skills), and starts out with a decent weapon on top of that (Giving gun skills and hand to hand to a newly created character is a zerger's dream). Obey the Midnight's rules. -Devorac 06:56, 31 March 2010 (BST)

Luckily for you this has already been taken apart by nice people. There is one starting class that needs two starting skills, but good luck getting that through Peer Reviewed. -- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 10:43, 31 March 2010 (BST)

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Suicide

Timestamp: Jack Kolt Talk|Chars 06:26, 29 March 2010 (BST)

Type: New twist for anyone who is suicidal.

Scope: survivors, CR'd zombies

Description: Malton is a dangerous place. people are scared to death about getting eaten. so what do you do? well, if you've seen any zombie movie worth it's salt, you know there's always the person who goes and kills themself. now, there is the old standby of jumping of a building, but what if you have something that can do the job for you? this is where suicide comes in. basically, kill yourself with stuff on hand. Now, only a few items would make the cut. and they are: knife pistol shotgun When you click on an these items (when they are in your inventory) you get this message: this item has little effect besides combat (or some such) . would you like to use it on yourself? this will kill you yes/no clicking on yes will give you this text (if you use a gun, and will use one bullet/shell) placing the barrel of the gun to your mouth, you exhale sharply, then pull the trigger. there is a loud gunshot, and you collapse to the ground, dead. clicking on yes will give you this text (if you use knife) placing the cold blade of the knife to your throat, you clench your teeth and cut your neck open. blood drips over your chest, and you collapse to the ground, dead. --notes-- you do not take headshot for this regardless if you are a zombie hunter. anyone in the vicinity would see "Soandso killed themselves with a (insert weapon here)" any other weapons are far to unwieldy to warrant enough damage to kill yourself. your clothes get bloodied as usual.

Discussion (Suicide)

• Been suggested a buncha times before, but I'll let Izzy toss the list up, since he's got everything on tab. Main reason it's never been implemented was balance/abuse. Makes parachuting way too easy. A bunch of death cultists could hop into a mall and kill themselves with 48 or so AP left to kill and pinata the place. Etc RinKou 06:39, 29 March 2010 (BST)

RE Looking back on this, I'm sure didn't think this one through enough, as the amount of abuse this would get would be catastrophic. Well, good thing this isn't the real suggestions page. --Jack Kolt ^Talk|Chars 02:51, 30 March 2010 (BST)

Might as well just cut out the middleman and give zombies free-running... Hmmm :) --Honestmistake 08:55, 29 March 2010 (BST)

Suggestion:20071210 Suicide By Firearm is a good example of a dupe. And please explain how you can put a gun in your mouth and pull the trigger, without causing a headshot. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 10:03, 29 March 2010 (BST)

You know better than to use logic on a member of the DEM. -- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 10:33, 29 March 2010 (BST)

RE oh god, not these stereotypes again. but yes, It makes more sense to have a headshot. --Jack Kolt ^Talk|Chars 02:51, 30 March 2010 (BST)

Ross stole one of the better dupes from my files. The main reason that this is always shot down is due to barricade negation concerns, barricades are the core mechanic of this game, removing their effect in such a blatant and clumsy way is just stupid. -- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 10:33, 29 March 2010 (BST)

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Audible shooting

Timestamp: Girobu 19:43, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Type: Ambience

Scope: All

Description: When someone uses firearms at the same square, player should see something like "You hear a shot in the building", when hearing from outside, or "SomeName shoots at SomeOther" when both player and shooter inside (or both outside). Now you notice shooting only when someone falls dead, which is strange. When someone shoots inside building it means that something wrong (or interesting) goes on inside. It makes PKing reasonably more difficult, on the other hand survivors will think twice before executing PKer, when it may reveal they presence to other PKers and zombs. And we'll have more reasons to use less powerful, but silent melee weapons.

Discussion (Audible shooting)

Pretty sure is a Dupe. I'll go look in a bit. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 19:47, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Suggestion:20070627 gunshots --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 19:48, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Let's do a better one, keepeng in mind all the cons! --Girobu 20:30, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

OK, let it work ONLY for shooting at the same square. Silent shooting = TOO easy PKing. --Girobu 19:58, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

It'll just be extra lines of text to read. It doesn't give any useful information, it doesn't tell who is shooting or who/what is being shot at. - User:Whitehouse 20:12, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

You think, better to write like "SomeGuy shoots at SomeOtherGuy"? --Girobu 20:18, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Disagree about non-usefulness - when someone shoots inside building it means that something wrong (or interesting) goes on inside. It makes PKing reasonably more difficult, on the other hand survivors will think twice before executing PKer, when it may reveal they presence to other PKers and zombs.--Girobu 20:23, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

How would I know the difference between someone shooting a survivor on the other side of the room, and someone shooting a zombie on the other side of the room? --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 20:26, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

See above. You'll see "CoodGuy shoots at zombie" or "BadGuy shoots at you" - when all that guys and you are at the same square and have same "inside/outside status" --Girobu 20:33, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

When you outside and someone shoots inside, you just notice, that life is more interesting inside ^) the same when you inside, and gunfire - outside --Girobu 20:35, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

So how would you deal with screen spam? If I'm in a building with several individuals and I only log in once a day, won't my screen be full of. "Goodguy shoots at zombie" Zombie bites goodguy" "Zombie Destroys generator" "badguy shoots at goodguy"? And how will you know who is shooting who outside when you are inside? Will zombies get the same messages? --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 20:37, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

You will see such descriptive messages only if you and shooter are both inside or both outside at the same square. In other cases you will see just "Someone shoots in the street... and again..." when you inside at the same square, or "Someone shoots inside the building" when you outside. You'll see nothing if shooting is at other square --Girobu 20:42, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Zombies (i think) should see the same messages. They can hear, probably...--Girobu 20:43, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Jorm had a system in his game where every player got to see a notification of every attack against them, though people in the same room couldn't unless the attack killed the person. You want more notifications than even Jorm's system handed out.

Do you know the difference between Jorm's game and Kevan's? Jorm's doesn't exist any more because it cost too much to run with all these notifications.

Deliver to Kevan a hundred grand and you can have your retarded PKer nerf, until you do show up with the coin, this is a dupe and I'll make it die the second it goes into the main system. -- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 22:01, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

That do you Ross? -- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 22:01, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

I'm gonna have to go with "no" on this idea. Can you imagine an actual siege situation? If you're gone during a mall siege for a day, you're already getting screen spammed to death. This would probably make it 2-3x worse, I'd imagine. Also, as a PKer, I fail to see where the deterrent is to PKers. If anything, it gets us more recognition, which is what a lot of PKers are looking for anyway. The only time it would deter us is when we take the chance at making a kill when we're low on AP and end up humiliated when we have to leave the job undone, but most PKers I know make a point of finishing the job. For reference, I've only ever had to abandon one kill-in-progress due to lack of AP out of the dozens I've made. The current system already lets you spot PKers by telling who who kills who, which is enough information, without being too much. —Aichon— 02:11, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

It will add one line for all shooting outside (Someone shoot outside... and again...) and one line for each gunfire incident inside (with ...and again). No more.--Girobu 07:35, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

That's still way too much. And this would completely ruin Red Rum's / Glitch's mall seige tactic.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 08:20, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

It's about 10-15 lines max. Aforementioned tactic is not fair, because it's exploits game mechanics glitches. So, if my suggestion ruin this - it's another reason to vote for.--Girobu 09:31, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

(EDIT: Despite the fact that Iscariot just edit conflicted me with a better version of what I was gonna say, I'm gonna say it anyway, since I hate throwing out perfectly good comments) It's still gonna be about a minimum of 2x more lines of text (dunno what mall sieges you've been in, but I'd say that means 100+ lines after just one day), and if someone wanted to abuse it, I've realized a simple way that they could create dozens of lines of text by themselves. Even more with a group.

If we look at the best case scenario, where people behave as they do today, then the key thing you're forgetting is that "...and again" text only shows up if nothing else happens in between the "...and again" events. The problem here is that every single time a kill is made, anyone says anything, or the barricades are brought up/destroyed, you'll have a new event that comes between the "...and again". So, if we imagine a normal scenario where a survivor is shooting zombies that breached during a mall siege, everyone else will see the incident of him shooting the first zombie, followed by a kill notice, then the incident of him shooting the next zombie so that it's wounded. Whenever the next person starts in on the wounded zombie, people will get a fresh incident of shooting, followed by a kill report, then another incident of shooting as he starts in on a third zombie, etc. That's twice as much text, roughly.

If we consider abuse of your idea, someone (most likely a PKer) could simply alternate between two targets, Players A and B. The "...and again" wouldn't show up for him shooting Player A, since an event (him shooting Player B) has taken place in between, forcing his newest attack on Player A to get a line of its own. Basically, we'll see individual lines for every single attack. Even if he makes the two kills, you're still talking about messages coming in about 25x more often than they do now. Couple that with the fact that PKer strike teams are not at all uncommon with large mall sieges, and you have a recipe for thousands of lines of text each day. This suggestion simply doesn't work when you apply the "multiply it by a billion" principle. —Aichon— 10:07, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

Okay, now I'm almost agree that it's not a very good idea. --Girobu 11:04, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

Since you're obviously stupid, I'll have to do this the long way:

1. Don't use suggestions to complain about things in game. You're butthurt over being PKed and I don't care. The only thing this is going to do is make every PKer that views this page seek out your profile and add you to their kill list.
2. Kevan has stated he has no intention of nerfing PKers in any way.
3. Example time: We'll go back to my GC days, myself and one other GCer attack the target. Since we're fully stocked and APed we can expect to kill two characters each in every strike. You are a bystander in the building, you see:
   • Cliff Spab shot Zuton with a shotgun. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Feon Kensai with a shotgun. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot Goolina with a shotgun. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot SexyRexyGrossman with a shotgun. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Zuton with a shotgun. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Feon Kensai with a shotgun. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot Goolina with a shotgun. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot SexyRexyGrossman with a shotgun. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Zuton with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Feon Kensai with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot Goolina with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot SexyRexyGrossman with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Zuton with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Feon Kensai with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot Goolina with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot SexyRexyGrossman with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Zuton with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Feon Kensai with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot Goolina with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot SexyRexyGrossman with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Zuton with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Feon Kensai with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot Goolina with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot SexyRexyGrossman with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Zuton with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Feon Kensai with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot Goolina with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot SexyRexyGrossman with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Zuton with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Feon Kensai with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot Goolina with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot SexyRexyGrossman with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Zuton with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Feon Kensai with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot Goolina with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot SexyRexyGrossman with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Zuton with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Feon Kensai with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot Goolina with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot SexyRexyGrossman with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Zuton with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Feon Kensai with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot Goolina with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot SexyRexyGrossman with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Zuton with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab shot Feon Kensai with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot Goolina with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith shot SexyRexyGrossman with a . (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab killed Zuton with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Cliff Spab killed Feon Kensai with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith killed Goolina with a pistol. (Yesterday)
   • Raine Joslin Smith killed SexyRexyGrossman with a pistol. (Yesterday)

   You'll notice your 'and again' clause doesn't kick in because we've deliberately taken our actions non-sequentially. That's a change from four notifications under the current system to 52 under your system. Please note the above example only counts shots that hit, if you want to also have notifications that include missed shots then increase that number by 35%.

4. So, I ask again, are you going to personally pay (in cashy money) for the cost of all these extra notifications? Especially since I've already given you an example of a game that had more notifications than Urban Dead that's gone under due to running costs. -- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 10:03, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

About 1st point: ...and what? That's a game, let them go. My suggestion doesn't alternate balance between Gker's and other gamers, as you can see. But - yes - now I see - it really makes more spam. Needs more polishing. --Girobu 11:03, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

Wait... He's apparently butt-hurt over being PKd and I've been repeatedly targeted by MOB? Are you projecting by any chance? --Kamikazie-Bunny 12:32, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

He wants to make PKing harder, and you want a location that zombie groups without death cultists can't touch in any way. Yeah, you're both butthurt over dying. -- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 12:35, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

I don't think my suggestion making PKing harder. At least, not dramatically harder :)--Girobu 12:49, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

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Fallout Bunker

Timestamp: Kamikazie-Bunny 18:40, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Type: Unique Location

Scope: Location

Description: "Hidden deep underground in Malton is the remains of an old Nuclear Fallout shelter. Although looted of supplies the heavy blast doors can still provide protection from the horde; not for long though, the air supply is broken." The Fallout bunker is a 1x1 location located at Shelper Park, Lukinswood [29,49] (Any other suitable, external location may be used), the bunker is not visible but the park description states "There is a fallout bunker hidden amongst some trees and bushes, the doors are open/closed." and there is an option to 'enter the building'. It counts as a dark building. As the bunker is underground Radios, Phones and GPS units do not work, however if a generator is set-up the lights can not be seen externally and the emergency radio is activated (This radio is set to receive 25.92Mhz (EBS), cannot be changed and cannot broadcast). The bunker features a heavy blast door. This door can only be opened and closed by survivors from the inside and costs 5AP to do so (the doors cannot be closed when ruined). If there are no active survivors inside the door automatically opens. When the door is closed bodies cannot be dumped. As a consequence of the air recycling system being broken any actions performed inside the bunker with the doors closed costs 1Hp. The internal descriptions are: You cannot discern anything in the darkness of the bunker. The lights flicker on and off along the cold concrete walls with the humm of the generator, water drips and the air smells stale . The air recycling system is broken and needs a new Air-Chip. Although the Bunker has been looted of most supplies survivors can still find lengths of pipe and newspapers. Unique clothing in the form of a blue and yellow jumpsuit can also be found within the bunker.

Discussion (Fallout Bunker)

I support unique hidden structures, like the garland museum, or the Coram building. Not sure about the details though. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 19:01, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

The outside location should be randomly placed like the Emergancey Broadcast system was, makes things more intresting. --^TCAPD(╯°□°)╯ ┻━┻ 19:05, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Aye. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 19:08, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

I was suggesting that park because it was convenient for me but it can happily be placed in any other location which could provide suitable 'camouflage', I just don't think it would be appropriate to suddenly appear in the middile of the street. --Kamikazie-Bunny 05:26, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

Pointless. Because I'd break it.

If an 'active' character is no longer in it, the doors open. It takes five days for a character to idle. I only need to perform 1 action to stay active. Behold the timeline:

1. Myself and friends with PKer and death cultist alts attack the bunker in a mass strike and kill and dump all the inhabitants.
2. Only my character remains and he closes the door, locking himself in with just his inventory.
3. Once every five days I log in and hit search.
4. I have 60HP, at this rate (60 x 5) it will take me 300 days to run out of health and die.
5. I have a full inventory of 50 FAKs. This provides me with and additional 500HP of potential health.
6. I use these FAKs periodically. This provides me (560 x 5) with 2800 days until I run out of health and die. To save you doing the maths, 2800 days is 7.67 years, longer than the game has currently been running.
7. Should I be in danger of actually running out of health seven years from now, I will contact a friend and he will substitute his character for mine. The door to your bunker will be open for 30 seconds every seven years.

Can we cycle this yet? -- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 22:10, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Once again I underestimated the basement-dwelling-ass-hole factor, then again it could become a role-playing part of Malton, we know there's a vault, we know people can get in but no one knows anyone who's actually been inside, only rumours. But if you really feel that it's a good idea, go ahead, anyone with 1/2 a life would get bored of doing it after a week or two, there may be really pathetic people who keep it up for a month or two but it's not exactly game breaking. Could you honestly see someone keeping this up for a year out of spite (I doubt even you'd do that)? Of course your plan assumes you can get in the vault your self, it'll be entertaining seeing groups fighting for control of it at peak hours. But if you really want we can have 'open' days on August the 6th and 9th (see Hiroshima/Nagasaki) so people can enter and exit freely without doors, happy?.

Using that sort of thinking me might as well ban survivor characters though.

"Behold;"

1) I use a proxy to create a scout/fireman

2) I kill/wound a survivor

3) I jump out a building and kill myself with my last AP

4) Are there any survivors left?

Yes - Goto 1

No - Goto 4

5) Congratulations - You've broken the game (and in less than 7.67 years).

Do you see where this is going? EVERYTHING can be abused, it's simply a matter of determination... --Kamikazie-Bunny 05:46, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

The difference between his example and yours is that his is allowed within the rules of the game, whereas yours is not. We can't always deal with people that will break the rules, but we can deal with people within the rules. Anyway, I honestly like the flavor, but Iscariot is right about the mechanics. There needs to be some way in besides someone on the inside opening up, since I could see a duo of PKers using it as their personal safehouse for years to come, where they take turns going out and coming back, opening and closing the doors for each other while coordinating via IRC. You'd have a window of maybe 10 seconds each day where you could get in, otherwise you'd be out of luck, and no one has enough IP hits to refresh that often. Perhaps the doors might get "loose" occasionally and need maintenance, much like a generator needs fuel, and if they're not maintained, they can be broken through? It's a random idea that I haven't thought through yet, so I have no idea how feasible it is. —Aichon— 06:06, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

What Aichon said. The difference is that you're a cheating scumfuck that's acting contrary to the game rules and basic fairplay, and I'm using intelligence to deny survivors a resource within the rules. What next? Are you going to compare rotters at revive points to zerging? People will get bored? What of setting a reminder on their computer and logging in six times a month for two IP hits to watch survivors whine? I'd happily make that effort for years. Of course if other players step inside with identical characters to me, only one of us needs to be active once every five days. Redundancy is a great thing.

Open days? Awww, did I point out the unfairness of this idea by using it on you? Tough. Forts have big heavy gates, yet zombies can still break in. What's actually unfair is you want a nice safe location that zombies have no chance of getting in without death cultists to open the doors. What happened? Did MOB kill you just one too many times for you to cope with?

There should be no location that a fully leveled zombie shouldn't be able to get into in this game. -- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 10:11, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

Aich - How does needing an active generator to close the door sound? I did toy with the idea of having a specific barricade for this building with no free running access below VSB but a higher upper limit (to reflect the heavy doors), but that would require a total rework of the barricading system or an entirely new barricade system for one location, I think it's unfeasible either way. In my experience most of the rotter's I've seen at revive points have been zergs (with zergy names), the exception to this is when large numbers of zeds are raiding the area.

Izzy - You can't claim 'basic fairplay' after saying what you'd do (which is a variation of sentinel zerging). I could argue I'm using my own brand of intelligence (or indecisiveness) to create a PKer account then abandoning it to create a new account ("I didn't like the name"); having old unused/abandoned accounts does not make one a zerger. I don't get the whole MOB thing, I've never had issues with them as I avoid them when I'm a survivor for obvious safety reasons. If I did have issues I'd browse their forums and find a way to be safe, honestly though I think the level of meta-gaming zombie-obsesses do is atrocious, you could argue that survivors aren't that co-ordinated but most survivors use the in-game functions to communicate, not many zombies have the ballz to do that.

You always criticise but I rarely see you make an effort, do me a favour and try be positive.

--Kamikazie-Bunny 12:03, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

Wait, so in your eyes deliberately denying resources to survivors is 'sentinel zerging'? So in your little world, the Gray Guard and SFHNAS are all zergs? Don't be so fucking retarded. It's entirely acceptable to deny opponents a resource, using weasel words to express the fact that you don't like it doesn't change the fact that you're coming across butthurt. It can only be zerging if multiple characters are used to achieve an objective. My example doesn't use multiple characters controlled by a single player. Your example breaks Kevan's own dictates on multiple accounts. "Yes you can have multiple characters providing they lead separate existences" Your example shows that they aren't leading separate existences, they have a goal following that of other characters you own. Arguing this point just makes you sound like a member of Extinction.

Zombies don't have the 'ballz' to use in game communication methods? Are you trying to sound like ZL? Also, ever heard of feeding groan? Communication tool, used extensively everywhere. If you're referring to death rattle then it might be due to the fact that they have to learn to read and write in an entirely new language. When all your survivors can write in their first language, then and only then do you get to criticise players of a 10 minute a day browser game for not learning a new one.

The majority you've seen are zergs? That must be why your post count is so high on Resens. Alternately I'm going to forward the notion that you're just making shit up.

You've still yet to comment on the major point that there should be no location in the game that zombies can't break into on their own. That basic concept miss your gaze?

This idea is so retarded that if it was my child I'd drown it. And if you ever alter the spacing on my comments again, you will be getting a warning. -- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 12:28, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

"Honestly though, I think the level of meta-gaming zombie-obsesses do is atrocious."

I was going to offer constructive criticism until I read that. Are you on liquid paper? Have you ever tried using a feral zombie for a week, cracking at barricades and never getting anywhere? The only meat a lonely zombie can get are street treats because of barricades. Just 10 AP of barricade construction takes about 40 to knock down. The only way for zombies to get any action is via coordination, and your scoffing at that coordination scream volumes about your misunderstanding of this game.

Now for your concept: Tis broken and easy to abuse. Zombies, in an organised dedication, should not be shut out from being able to break into and ruin any part of the city. Making a system that can be shut for years is not a good idea in any way I can imagine, and I would happily join Ach in shutting it down if it was ever implemented just to prove its flaws. John Ibans 13:07, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

lIzzy - I never said it was, I said it was similar to, an alt or zergs used to watch a specific properties (e.g Masts) wouldn't be that dissimilar to using one to camp the vault. As for my example, it doesn't break the "Yes you can have multiple characters providing they lead separate existences" rule, If I have one character who goes on a rampage, then permanently discard it, when I create a new it is leading a separate existence because the old one is effectively perma-dead and has no further effects on the game. It walks the line but never crosses it, it's would be like me accusing you of being a zerg because you had a different account attack a building 6 months ago (albeit with a longer timeline).

As a zombie I've found the in game communications sufficient for finding forming and joining groups. It has been aided by a combat revive or two but the large zombie groups I've seen won't even make the initiate attempt to contact you in game because they don't have the BALLZ to use an AP trying to help someone without the guarantee of a pat on the head, unless it's part of radio spamming. The only groups I've joined I've done so because they coordinated in game or at least made the effort to try.

The rotters; if you noticed I did say "In my experience", spending a week going to quiet revive points and seeing the same name with a different suffix doesn't guarantee they're a zerg but it's normally an indication of something suspicious. The Resens thing... I don't feel a need to go report things on other forums because I have BALLZ and I'm prepared to spend my AP telling the in game players about these things rather than circumventing the in game features to gain an unfair advantage.

The inaccessible to zombie thing is being worked on, after all this is developing, feel free to contribute something positive at any time rather than the usual. Sorry I didn't reply to it last time, I was expecting some Jerry Springer-esque final thought and skipped it.

"This idea is so retarded that if it was my child I'd drown it." I doubt you have the BALLZ to live up to that sort of thing.

John - Don't worry about the communication thing, it's just a little flushing. The impossible to enter part is being worked on. It may not be fast progress but I'm looking at ides. --Kamikazie-Bunny 02:59, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

I thought of the active generator idea, but didn't quite like it enough to put it forward. The issue I have with it is the same as Iscariot's main issue: done right, zombies will never have a chance to get in. A duo could pop out for fuel once every few weeks and stock up on enough to last them for that long, and it'd enforce their activity, since I believe fuel runs out faster than five days, though don't quote me on that. The basic problem though, is that they could keep it locked in perpetuity since they'd get a warning for when they need to refuel, without ever having had the doors become vulnerable to breach.

The approach I mentioned earlier, having to maintain the doors, is nice since it means that the doors are occasionally vulnerable until they are fixed, and during that window, zombies are free to attack and attempt to breach. If the delay between when maintenance was needed was randomized and frequent, it could create an interesting dynamic. It certainly wouldn't be accurate to how we think of fallout bunkers as impenetrable structures, but it'd work better within the mechanics of the game. I'm not suggesting or pushing for my idea to be used, but rather using it as an example to point out the types of mechanics I was talking about that are necessary for this to work. —Aichon— 16:36, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

I can't quite visualise how this system will work, it seems like it might work but could you elaborate on the mechanics a bit for me. Not necessarily numbers.--Kamikazie-Bunny 03:05, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

Basically, the doors will, on occasion (say, somewhere between a few times a day and a few times a week) become "loose" and will be in need of repairs by someone with a Toolbox on the inside. While the doors are loose, they act like normal barricades (maybe starting at EHB?) and can be broken down by zombies or survivors outside. Once the doors are damaged enough (i.e. the barricades are gone), the doors are forced open and people can freely enter. This continues until someone repairs the doors and closes them again. As for when they become loose, it'd have to be randomized in order to prevent abuse, otherwise it'd be a scheduled event that the people on the inside could maintain forever. Again though, this merely demonstrates what I perceive to be the desirable properties, and isn't necessarily the best solution in and of itself. —Aichon— 04:02, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

I can think of a few things that might make some variant of this workable:

• the bunker is way below ground and cost 10AP to climb down (half this if its light).... each climb has a chance to fall that is equal to the players current encumbrance because it is dark and slippery and i am a bastard. This fall would cause 61 damage (no flak)
• Anyone entering can choose to jump instead of climb... this would of course cause them about 61 damage.
• Once inside a generator would have to be set down to allow the doors to be locked
• Once powered a survivor faces another risky climb to lock the door and another risky climb to get back inside... anyone choosing to stay on the ladder checks for falling every time they log in. Running out of AP while mid journey also results in a fall!
• The bunker counts as a hospital, an armory and a partial NT facility (needle creation only) too...
• Sadly the air-con eats power at an alarming rate and it will short the generator at a very unpredictable rate (IE 1-100 hours at random) Unpowered the door of course opens!
• Lastly... zombies cannot climb very well and add 50 to the fall chance. Dumping is 10AP + Fall chance and cannot be done while there are standing zombies inside because even 1 standing zombie blocks the ladder with a 100% success rate.

I'd vote Vouch for this death trap... --Honestmistake 17:05, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

I'll accept this but you would have to add that zombies are too un-cooridinated to climb the ladder back out, so only survivors can climb back out. I particularly like the 1-100 hour generator thing but I'd suggest making it something closer to 6-12hrs, or that faulty electronics automatically open the door after 6-12 hours. It would help relive the "zombies can't enter" problem, you'd be safe but for how long? --Kamikazie-Bunny 03:05, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

Well I do say zombies add 50% to the fall chance which pretty much means that if they have any gear at all they are going to be stuck for a good while... locking them in completely is no good though as it means rotters could never get out and thats even more OTT than never letting them in. --Honestmistake 10:48, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

To summarise New hidden locations are good, the elaborate location suggested here is overly complicated and too easily abusable. Join SFHNAS. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 18:35, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

Dumb and out of genre. Nowhere in Urban Dead is safe. That's the point. Lelouch vi Britannia is helping make Ridleybank green_ and gives Achievements 21:09, 24 March 2010 (UTC)

I support this idea only if zombies get a JDAM to use on any given day they feel like. Humans get a safe underground bunker and zombies get a bomb to blow it up :D -- 

•   Timmah!  

•   Talk  

03:12, 25 March 2010 (UTC)

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Suggestions up for voting

Flares or Flare Guns?