UDWiki talk:Administration/Policy Discussion/Speedy Deletion Criterion 14

Thoughts? -- Cheese 17:46, 6 May 2010 (BST)

This sounds like a very useful criterion. If a user has the authority to put his subpages up for speedy deletion without having to go through the two weeks, a group represented by the group leader or an otherwise clearly authorized member should be able to do the same. This is a great proposal. G F J 19:49, 6 May 2010 (BST)

It's certainly interesting. I feel there's a bit of uncertainty, however, especially with the reasonable suspicion clause. Since there's no way to virtually gauge if the sysop has reasonable suspicion, and some group leaders aren't on the wiki, I can see some potential probelms being caused, but nothing horrendously world-breaking.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 20:04, 6 May 2010 (BST)

There is probably a better way to word it but it would basically cover any disgruntled or newbie members trying to delete stuff without permission. Doesn't usually happen but it's more of a "just in case" kind of thing. -- Cheese 20:06, 6 May 2010 (BST)

Yeah, and there definitely has to be a clause, I guess I just don't like reasonable suspicion because of its usage in England. I think just group leader would be suitable, and if not, it can go through deletions. :/ I dunno.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 20:10, 6 May 2010 (BST)

Nothing world-breaking? Tell Minsathropy that on A/M. --

 

 

 

 

01:43, 7 May 2010 (BST)

The fact that there has to be a clause at all, suggests it isn't a simple decision and should go through the normal deletion process. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 20:12, 6 May 2010 (BST)

Regarding the clause, why not just say that the group leader needs to provide a list of authorized editors somewhere in their space? Or else maybe we just say that anyone listed as an officer is permitted. Anyone on the list can then request speedy deletion with the full authority of the group. The way I see it, only a handful of the larger groups (DEM, DHPD, etc.) will be doing stuff like this anyway, so it's not at all a major inconvenience to require that they provide us with a list of people who are allowed to act on their behalf, whether that be officers or specific people. Otherwise though, I like the idea. Owners of pages should have control of their space. —Aichon— 20:49, 6 May 2010 (BST)

To add a little to what Aichon was saying,... I don't know how big of a deal it is really. To me, it seems like this would apply only to larger groups... DEM, MOB, RRF, that sort of thing. When you get smaller groups like EVIL for example,... it becomes extremly clear who the authorized user is, and who the real owner of the page is. In situations for smaller groups, I think it would be ineffective to have as a rule, but for larger groups,... god only knows who can request what. It's to vague,... but a great idea. -Poodle of Doom^{M! T} 23:49, 6 May 2010 (BST)

description said:

A "suitable" representative would be the group leader or someone who is acting on the authority of the group leader. If the attending sysop feels the user requesting deletion does not have this authority they can either turn down the request or ask the group's leader to give their approval.

The presence of off-wiki politics coming into play with page deletions, especially after your A/M stint with Misanthropy, is laughable, Cheese. Either way, I think this will be useful but the representative bit needs working. Essentially, this is for Crit 7's, in every sense of the way we've treated them for years, but you're giving them a new crit and allowing other "group representatives" via (most likely) off-wiki sources to delete pages where they may have no on-wiki confirmation that they have permission to. And judging by the fact that if a group leader goes on the wiki to confirm on his talk page that he wants this deleted (to a subordinate) then it will a) get deleted anyway as a crit 7 by proxy, or b) they have the capability to go to A/SD and request it themselves.

Keep it with "group leader" imo.. the 'representative' bit is too abuseable unless you can word it a bit better. --

 

 

 

 

01:43, 7 May 2010 (BST)

Update

Right, I've scratched the representative bit so it's just group leaders now. Thoughts before I chuck this up for voting? -- Cheese 16:10, 8 May 2010 (BST)

Yes, one last issue. In the case of things like the recent UBCS leadership battle, who would have group rights in that instance, as both were making claims to ownership of the UBCS. I recall something similar happened with the DHPD earlier this year. Is it fair to assume that in cases like that, deletion would be postponed until a decision was made? And also that any deletion would be reversed until it became clear who had the authority?--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 23:58, 10 May 2010 (BST)

A group leader could request deletion of a group subpage, but if they're not the person who created the content, or page, how would that work out? I'm curious,... because of the whole intelecutal property thing,.... -Poodle of Doom^{M! T} 00:17, 11 May 2010 (BST)

Who cares about intellectual property, if they put their own "intellectual property" onto a page and someone deletes it, who cares? It isn't being stolen or modified. So to answer your question, if the group leader requests it, it gets deleted regardless of who asked for it. That is the entire point of the policy, mind. --

 

 

 

 

00:45, 11 May 2010 (BST)

Yeah... I'm not sure you caught my point. If someone modifies my user main space, without my permission, there'd be drama, blah blah blah,... vandalism. I'm considered the owner of the page. Likewise, a group is considered the owner of the groups namespace. Likewise, I'd consider the leader of the group to be the owner of said group, thus owner of said page. Technically, no one should be editing that page, and subpages, but the owner of the group. Likewise though, being part of said group, one could claim that they had a right to create said subpage, and claim intelectual property rights over it, as part of that group. I just see there being a lot of "I was told to do this,...", "No you weren't,...", "I'm the leader of this,...", "But I'm the leader of that,...",... I'm saying that there could be a lot of resulting drama from this policy... -Poodle of Doom^{M! T} 02:22, 11 May 2010 (BST)

No, a group page is, at least to my understanding, the property of all members of the group, unless the group has a specific policy on it. For instance, The page for the Dulston Alliance was made by User:Mobius187. However, myself, User:Officer Murphy and User:Red Hawk One are all members, and have all editted the news section before. At least to my understanding.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 08:32, 11 May 2010 (BST)