UDWiki:Administration/Vandal Banning/Archive/2011 04

This page is for the reporting of vandalism within the Urban Dead wiki, as defined by vandalism policy. On this wiki, the punishment for Vandalism is temporary banning, but due to security concerns, the ability to mete out this punishment is restricted to System Operators. As such, regular users will need to lodge a report for a Vandal to be banned from the wiki. For consistency and accountability, System Operators are requested to note on this board their actions in dealing with Vandals.

Guidelines for Vandalism Reporting

In dealing with Vandalism, time is often of the essence. As such, we ask that all users include the following information in a Vandalism report:

• A link to the pages in question.

Preferably bolded for visibility. If the Vandalism is occurring over a sufficiently large number of pages, instead include a time range of the vandalism attempt, or alternatively, a link to the first vandalised page. This allows us to quickly find the damage so we can quickly assess the situation.

• The user name of the Vandal.

This allows us to more easily identify the culprit, and to check details.

• A signed datestamp.

For accountability purposes, we ask that you record in your request your user name and the time you lodged the report.

• Please report at the top.

There's conflict with where to post and a lot of the reports are missed. If it's placed at the top of the page it's probably going to be seen and dealt with.

If you see Vandalism in progress, don't wait for System Operators to deal with it, as there may be no System Operator online at the time. Lodge the report, then start reverting pages back to their original form. This can be done by going to the "History" tab at the top of the page, and finding the last edit before the Vandal's attack. When a System Operator is available, they'll assess the situation, and if the report is legitimate, we will take steps to either warn the vandal, or ban them if they are on their second warning.

If the page is long, you can add new reports by editing the top report and placing your new report above its header in the edit screen.

Before Submitting a Report

• This page, Vandal Banning, deals with bad-faith breaches of official policy.
• Interpersonal complaints are better sorted out at UDWiki:Administration/Arbitration.
• As much as is practical, assume good faith and try to iron out problems with other users one to one, only using this page as a last resort.
• Avoid submitting reports which are petty.

Vandalism Report Space

Administration Notice Talk with the user before reporting or accusing someone of vandalism for small edits. In most cases it's simply a case of a new user that doesn't know how this wiki works. Sometimes assuming good faith and speaking with others can avoid a lot of drama, and can even help newbies feel part of this community. Administration Notice If you are not a System Operator, the user who made the vandal report, the user being reported, or directly involved in the case, the administration asks that you use the talk page for further discussion. Free-for-all commenting can lead to a less respectful environment. Administration Notice Warned users can remove one entry of their warning history every one month and 250 edits after their last warning. Remember to ask a sysop to remove them in due time. You are as responsible for keeping track of your history as the sysops are; In case of a sysop wrongly punishing you due to an outdated history, he might not be punished for his actions.

Spambots

Spambots are to be reported on this page. New reports should be added to the top. Reports may be purged after one week.

April 2011

user:XJENSENx115x

XJENSENx115x (talk | contribs | logs | block | IP Check | vndl data | discuss)

Verdict	Vandalism
Action taken	3-Edit Rule

Only contribs are blanking DHPD pages. Permabanned.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 23:18, 2 April 2011 (BST)

User:Shazam

Shazam (talk | contribs | logs | block | IP Check | vndl data | discuss)

Verdict	Vandalism
Action taken	24h ban

These edits look like a clear case of vandalism. It's not the first time, by the way (case 1, case 2). Regards, G F J 16:20, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Vandalism. Not a three edit vandal though, as the user had also created and maintained a legitimate group page in the past. -- Spiderzed▋ 16:39, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Vandalism. ~ _{17:02, 2 April 2011}

Vandalism --Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 17:20, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Verdict is vandalism. On Shazam's escalation level, that means a 24 hour ban. -- Spiderzed▋ 17:33, 2 April 2011 (BST)

User:Spiderzed

Spiderzed (talk | contribs | logs | block | IP Check | vndl data | discuss)

Verdict	{{{1}}}
Action taken	{{{2}}}

Putting a user who hasn't edited in 7 months up for promotion. [1]. Of course he'll claim seriousness despite any evidence but he hasn't even notified the user about it so all actions just lead to drama wanking. Sigh. -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 01:17, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Are you psychic DDR? I mean come on, you must be psychic to assume all of this. Are you going to A/VB everyone who vouched too?--THE Godfather of Яesensitized, Anime Sucks ^{Yalk | W! U! WMM| CC CPFOAS LOE ZHU | Яezzens} 01:23, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Of course not. -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 01:24, 2 April 2011 (BST)

You guys might want to check your calendars. Just saying. -- Spiderzed▋ 01:37, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Ah, well unfortunately I live in Australia so it's been 2nd for 11 hours now, forgive me for overlooking that. -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 01:39, 2 April 2011 (BST)

dum dum dum! -- The preceding signed comment was added by these amazing looking

bitch 04:47 2 April 2011 (UTC)

Vandalism - Spiderzed knows not to do this. Bid should be moved to the talk as per precedent.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 01:22, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Apoligies to all, in australia April fools has been over for a while. As long as it's removed after GMT April 1st ends, I don't see anything wrong with pushing the envelope for April fools. -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 01:48, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Boxy has beaten me to the actual bid, but I removed the news entry (which I didn't put up in the first place). All traces should be gone, unless I miss something? -- Spiderzed▋ 11:36, 2 April 2011 (BST)

I have a relevant question. Were the Grim promotion or the Iscariot promotion escalated? Cause if not then there's no reason why this bid is any different, bids a bid and even a joke bid that won't pass still means community discussion on a user's qualification so there's no way it's harmful to the page or spamming. --Karek^maps?! 04:08, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Answered it myself, I hope this link is good enough to settle this since it's both unanimous and involving the reporter --Karek^maps?! 04:14, 2 April 2011 (BST)

You may want to check the history of Jerrel. He got an escalation for putting himself up for promotion multiple times, despite being told not to. Also we did move dumb bid's like these to the talk page before, see WOOT. I don't know why we stopped doing so in Grim's case, but there was a time spam bids were just moved. -- Thadeous Oakley Talk 07:07, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Actually, as it turns out, if they were ever "just moved" that's the fluke, not leaving them, and it shouldn't be done in the future. Bid stays up until the user refuses to accept it and the precedent you were referring to actually should have led to either a misconduct escalation for any crat that closed the case or a vandal escalation for whoever moved it. To compare the Jerrel bid, a serious one, or the current bid in question to, just a reminder, This is absurd on ever possible level and if you can't see that difference then leave now, you'll probably wind up demoted for legitimate misconduct within three months and have no clue why. --Karek^maps?! 13:59, 2 April 2011 (BST)

....what? I'm honestly having trouble understanding what you're trying to say. This is almost Iscariot's level of English. If I understand correctly you think Jerrel and WOOT should not have been escalated, and bids no matter what should never be moved? -- Thadeous Oakley Talk 14:21, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Reading comprehension is your friend, especially when you're a sysop.

1) Jerrel was escalated on unrelated precedent and, yes, the removal of his bid, not the bid itself, should have been taken as vandalism because it was a user removing a bid because they didn't like the person putting it up. 2) WOOT's bid was vandalism. Read the bid, it's blatantly both spamming and not in good faith. It is not, however, in any way related to this bid or, for that matter, Jerrel's because of the content of that specific bid being why it was vandalism not the subject of the bid. It is not vandalism for a user to be put up for promotion simply because of who they are. --Karek^maps?! 14:26, 2 April 2011 (BST)

_{Note I am not a sysop and this is not a ruling, it's emphasis. --Karek^maps?! 14:27, 2 April 2011 (BST)}

Of course it's not vandalism for Jerrel if someone else puts him up for a bid. And no, this case is indeed not related to those other cases. Nor have I said otherwise. -- Thadeous Oakley Talk 14:51, 2 April 2011 (BST)

finally! i knew this would come in handy.-- The preceding signed comment was added by these amazing looking

bitch 14:39 2 April 2011 (UTC)

Well, surely this case fits those criteria as well, Karek. It wasn't made in good faith (good faith would be actually willing for that user to be promoted, and spiderzed has said that it was a joke) and it was created solely for the purpose of spamming admin pages (putting something on there other than the intended (i.e. a bid)). In my opinion, it being April Fools isn't a defence.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 15:23, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Actually Yonnua, the intent to lighten the tone of the page after some perceived drama is about as good faith as it gets. It isn't spamming admin pages because it's a legitimate bid on a page with no specific rules against why someone is put up for a promotion bid, unlike A/VB, A/M, or Suggestions which all have rules specifically regulating when it's appropriate to report someone and it in no way hurts the usefulness of the page as the page is low traffic and fairly simple and easy to follow even with 4 bids running at the same time. He didn't break any rules, He didn't make anything worse off, and his intent was obviously to lighten the mood. Without coming to the discussion with some idea that not using the page how you'd prefer it would be used being bad faith(also known as assuming bad faith) there's nothing he did in violation of the spirit or letter of the page, wiki, or rules. --Karek^maps?! 19:13, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Well, as the page exists to promote users to system operator I'd say he actually probably wasn't using it as it was intended. Ultimately, you've done nothing to convince me it isn't vandalism, and I've done nothing to convince you that it is, so we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 19:54, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Yonnua, the page exists to discuss user's suitability to being promoted to system operator not to promote them. That's your disconnect here. It's not vandalism to post a fake suggestion on Talk:Suggestions who's purpose is to develop suggestions, A/PM is the same thing. It's not a matter of convincing me that it is, you are responsible to show how what he did was in bad faith and as it's been shown quite clearly that non-serious bids are historically not vandalism your ruling can't reasonably be based on that with you actually having reviewed the relevant links posted or precedent cited.

So I ask you, is there some external user specific reason why this doesn't mesh with what has always been the established way of ruling these cases or is there some personal drama between you and him that gives you reason to see what he's doing as intentionally damaging to the wiki? Because, frankly, if you can't come up with something more you probably shouldn't be ruling on questionable cases about degrees like joke edits. --Karek^maps?! 20:04, 2 April 2011 (BST)

How about that posting non-serious cases/bids/suggestions that amount to nothing constructive or contributive can actually be interpreted as bad-faith and/or spam especially when done repeatedly? I know I'm not going to convince you, but you should realize you haven't any actual point at all why this isn't vandalism besides your own opinion/interpretation, hence making this discussion indeed a case of disagreement rather than being right or wrong. -- Thadeous Oakley Talk 20:21, 2 April 2011 (BST)

I think you're missing the part where relevant precedent was shown. I can find more directly comparative links if that's what floats your boat, I can think of at least five off the top of my head that we didn't escalate for that match this almost exactly. Here's a link with three in which Yonnua rules the fake bid as not vandalism.--Karek^maps?! 21:04, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Read the case and you might learn that it wasn't vandalism because Sonny hadn't repeatedly been put up for promotion before, whereas Jerrel has. But do keep trying to bully people in to changing their rulings, Karek. It makes you look really mature.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 21:18, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Yonnua, it was not vandalism because Misanthropy didn't have a history of putting up fake reports, does Spiderzed? Keep in mind I have no dog in this fight, I'm bringing this up in the discussion because it needs to be brought up. I don't actually care if he gets escalated I care that you guys are actually using precedent right and the precedent relevant to joke bids like Sonny's, like both of Iscariot's, like Grim's, like The Surgeon General's all point to it not being vandalism to post or cycle a joke bid. If you feel I'm being bullying maybe it's because I'm refusing to go away quietly into a corner until this very simple but all important point gets picked up. You don't make up the rules as you go, you follow the precedents relevant to the case and in this case Spiderzed obviously had every possible reason to believe this to be an acceptable edit because it always has been. --Karek^maps?! 21:31, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Sorry, but I still have to disagree with you. In my opinion, it isn't an appropriate use of an admin page; Spiderzed intended it as a joke, which isn't what the page is for (I have a perfectly good humour admin pages page in my namespace). The reason it typically isn't vandalism for first time offenders isn't because it's "acceptable", it's because they might not know better. In this case, Spiderzed most definitely did know better, and so I still believe it's vandalism. It may be more appropriate for him to have a soft warning (I'm impartial as to whether it should be a full or soft warning, but I'm leaning ever so slightly towards full as it stands, because he should be setting an example for more casual users who are breeding drama on that page). I get where you're coming from, and your help is appreciated, but I don't see myself changing my mind failing the discovery of a completely earth-shattering precedent that I'm unaware of.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 21:45, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Every case I brought up was made by established knowledgeable users. What basis do you have that he knew better, what can you point to that shows that he had any way of knowing this wasn't allowed before the creation of this case and your ruling? That's the standard for ruling it in bad faith, without that you're essentially manufacturing intent.

It's worth note that Soft Warnings are actually not vandalism rulings but with the distinction that the user gets the good faith notice that it's not OK that didn't happen before the action. --Karek^maps?! 21:52, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Look, I'm really not interested in you trying to pretend I'm biased, and I'm not even going to bother acknowledging comments of that nature again. In terms of why I believe he knew that what he was doing was wrong, he copied a bid which was a) removed from the promotions page and b) ruled vandalism, changed it ever so slightly, and then posted it on the page. In more general terms of spamming admin pages, he obviously knows that that isn't on, and as a wiki regular, he shouldn't be doign either of the above.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 22:01, 2 April 2011 (BST)

I'm not pretending you're anything. All you'd previously said was that he should know better and didn't give a reason when pressed. It is, however, worth noting that he did, in fact, not rule on that case. Nor was it escalated for what he's being escalated for now. You can't escalate him simply because he put Jerrel up for promotion, and Jerrel being escalated previously for spamming A/VB with monthly bids without regard to why they were being removed/failing. It was user specific. So again, I ask, how would he know as both the points you just made obviously aren't the case. --Karek^maps?! 22:13, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Naw, Yonnua, you couldn't be biased because Spider has an alt in a group that has been kicking your group's ass for well over a year. Cause you're a reasonable unbiased neutral Sysop. (You know, the kind that would never abuse your position and post someones IP address on your DA forum. Oh wait, nevermind.) Yeah you couldn't be out to wave your E-Penis around again after losing the last E-Penis swordfight you were in with...who was it again? Oh YEAH! I remember now. Gee, I just can't imagine why 99% of the UD player base avoids the Wiki like the plague. Not when a harmless April Fool's joke would never be trumped up to score a few petty points. That sort of thing would never happen around here in our paradise of reasonable unbiased neutral Sysops.--

| T | BALLS! | 00:08 3 April 2011(UTC)

It's nice precedent, which I have seen before, but I do still believe there's a limit on how much you can push these sort of non-serious bids. I don't believe the limit has been reached yet, as you can I see I haven't voted vandalism, but if Spiderzed would do this sorta thing again in the foreseeable future I would not be so lenient. And again, the precedent is nice but there is a subtle difference, mainly that the user in question, Jerrel, is inactive for months and the fact that Spiderzed didn't contact Jerrel on his talk page. I can see why Yonnua voted for Vandalism, (and Vapor for Softwarning), since this I can agree with them this shouldn't be encouraged, although an actual escalation goes to far. Do you think the bid should have stayed on for two weeks? -- Thadeous Oakley Talk 21:25, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Oh no, I understand that. I'm not arguing for a ruling, I'm arguing for the rule. Obviously repeatedly doing this is soon would qualify as drama mongering on an admin page and vandalism.

Jerrel's isn't different from Grim's obviously in the regards of activity, there was nothing wrong with removing the bid. The problems start when A/VB is being made to create new rules about all joke bids imply bad faith to the act of doing it, that's not ok. --Karek^maps?! 21:31, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Just for the record, I wouldn't have kept the bid around for 2 weeks. I'd have removed it myself over the course of April 2. -- Spiderzed▋ 21:34, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Even more recent precedent about humorous use of admin pages. And I picked Jerrel purposefully, because his history should make it crystal-clear that this isn't a serious bid, and because it gave me an excuse to use his involuntarily hilarious campaign assets table :P -- Spiderzed▋ 11:36, 2 April 2011 (BST)

I would have thought it was pretty obvious this one was an April Fools? C'mon people... ~ Kempy “YaketyYak” | ◆◆◆ | CAPD |

 

11:44, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Meh It wasn't very funny. I don't think this is worth an escalation, but the bid should be pulled off now, it's spam and especially since A/PM is already so cluttered. -- Thadeous Oakley Talk 07:12, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Spiderzed, don't do this again. Thanks. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 13:08, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Don't plan to. Not for the next 364 days at least :P -- Spiderzed▋ 14:19, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Soft Warning. ~ _{17:02, 2 April 2011}

Question - Spiderzed, why did you post the bid?--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 22:31, 2 April 2011 (BST)

The joke bid was put up for April's Fool day, to celebrate the holiday and lighten up the wiki a bit. From my knowledge of joking use of admin pages (Karl vs Ash arbies, Hagnat's demotion and Grim's promotion just to pick three recent ones), I knew that a first-time joke is tolerated and wouldn't be considered vandalism. I don't know even a single precedent where such a thing has been deemed vandalism, and neither has one been brought up in this discussion so far. I would expect an escalation even less so given the seasonal context and given that I don't have history of repeatedly putting up jokes. (The latter might get me escalated as per Jerrel and Woot precedent, but as of now, the case isn't comparable. What got them escalated was repetition, not futility.) -- Spiderzed▋ 22:57, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Actually, Woot was escalated for his first bid, iirc. Also, I take it these are straight answers, and that if I log on to redrum's irc, I won't find you, Karek and Sexualharrison co-ordinating your responses, right?--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 23:01, 2 April 2011 (BST)

Scratch that, his second bid was, at which point he expressly said he didn't know doign it a month later was bad.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 23:10, 2 April 2011 (BST)

yon hate to break this to you.. i have a life. and you all should lighten the fuck up. spidey made a joke. give it a rest.-- The preceding signed comment was added by these amazing looking

bitch 23:52 2 April 2011 (UTC)