Suggestions/14th-Jan-2007

Closed Suggestions

1. These suggestions are now closed. No more voting or editing is to be done to them.
2. Suggestions with a rational Vote tally of 2/3 Keeps over total of Keeps, Kills, and Spams will be moved to the Peer Reviewed Suggestions page by a moderator, unless the original author has re-suggested the Suggestion.
3. Suggestions under the 2/3 proportion but with more or equal Keeps to Kills ration will be moved to the Undecided Suggestions page.
4. All other Suggestions will be moved to either the Peer Rejected Suggestions page or the Humorous Suggestions page.
5. Some suggestions may not be moved in a timely manner; moving Suggestions to Peer Reviewed Suggestions page will take higest priority.
6. Again, DO NOT EDIT THIS PAGE IN ANY WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM. It will be used as a historical record and will eventually be locked.

Scrounging skill

Timestamp:	Steveha 08:52, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
Type:	Skill
Scope:	A skill for survivors.
Description:	I'm proposing a new skill: Scrounging. Scrounging is very similar to searching, except for two things: (a) you can specify what you are searching for; (b) it takes longer than 1 AP. As an example, let's consider a survivor searching for a revive syringe, and then the same survivor scrounging for a revive syrings. Searching: finds nothing (1AP), finds DNA extractor (1AP), drops DNA extractor since he already has one, finds nothing (1AP), finds DNA extractor (1AP), drops DNA extractor, finds syringe (1AP); total is 5AP. Scrounging: selects "revive syringe" from the list, and the game says "After scrounging for 5AP, you find a revive syringe." Please note that scrounging does NOT find items in fewer AP. The number of AP it will take to scrounge an item is based on the odds of finding that item; one simple way to calculate it is to simulate repeated search commands until the item is found. Please note also that, when searching, you may find valuable items while looking for something else. When you want shotgun shells, sometimes you find a shotgun. When Scrounging for shotgun shells, you will never find a shotgun. However, you will click fewer times with your mouse, and you won't have to drop a whole bunch of DNA extractors, GPS units, etc. This is mainly for high-level characters; when you already have one of everything, plus four pistols and four shotguns, it would be nice not to have to drop so many extraneous items. This would slightly reduce the load on the server. Currently, a search that takes 10AP will require ten hits on the server, each one using the random number generator to decide the results of the search, and possibly each one adding an item to inventory (which may just be dropped again). With Scrounging, one hit on the server will return one item that will not be dropped, and will still cost the player 10AP. I suggest that this should have Shopping as a prerequisite. Perhaps even Bargain Hunting. What happens if you Scrounge for a revive syringe in a Junkyard, or other place where they just aren't there to be found? Two possibilities: the game could say "You realize there is no point in looking for that here", or else it could burn a random number of AP and then say "You look and look without success. Discouraged, you stop looking." I am suggesting the second one ("Discouraged, you stop looking."). What if you have 2 AP left, and you Scrounge and the game decides it takes 10 AP? Then you have -8 AP, just as if you had used "Manufacture Syringe" inside an NT building and you didn't have 20 AP.

Keep Votes

1. Keep - I kind of like the idea. I'd use it. I would recommend adding a drop down box that lets you choose the type of item you are searching for (only items available at that location) and maybe a way to select how long you are willing to scrounge. (Scrounge X AP for a first aid kit.) --Uncle Bill 17:48, 14 January 2007 (UTC) EDIT: Oh and yes, make bargain hunting a prerequisite. (It looks like you'll have to revise this anyway.) --Uncle Bill 17:49, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
2. Keep You buy a skill, for the convenience. Nothing wrong with that! The PK'ers and gun loonies should love this one finally, I can search only for shotgun shells, yayyy... MrAushvitz 20:17, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
   

Kill Votes

1. Kill - Although this is a Dupe (I'm too lazy to dig around for the link), this is a good idea. Unfortunately, there are too many parts of this suggestion that needs tinkering and refinement. Revise this, please. --Wikidead 09:46, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

   I tried to do my homework before suggesting this, and I didn't see anything remotely like this suggestion. You say it's a dupe? Well, I guess I lose then. No, I don't think I'll revise this. This suggestion process does not seem like a productive use of my time. If anyone wants to take this idea and run with it, by all means please do, and take credit for it too since you will be doing the work. Steveha 09:48, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

2. Kill - I'd change to a keep-vote, if you scrounged 1 AP at a time. If I don't know how many AP I'm going to use on a search, AP-management is very hard to do. - BzAli 10:52, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

   That's fine with me. The one-click scrounge was intended to ease the load on the server, but it's just another reason to kill the suggestion, so forget it. Steveha 09:48, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

3. Kill - I hate "OMG ZERGERS!" kills, but... 1 IP hit per item? OMG ZERGERS! Also, renders necronet access useless --Gene Splicer 12:41, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

   For all I care, the server could make you wait while it thinks. Or implement it such that the user has to click repeatedly. Mostly these days I just want to go around and revive people; the price I pay for that is having to drop ten million DNA Extractors, GPS Units, etc. I had genuinely forgotten the "server hits" limit since my characters are paid for; Scrounging is not intended to save server hits from unpaid characters, see comment below. Steveha 09:48, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

4. Kill- Make it so that you have to click the button each time for 1 ap, but you won't find anything but what you searching for.--Grigori 19:52, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

   Works for me. Suggest it and take credit for the idea, please. Steveha 09:48, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

5. Kill I agree that an element of randomness makes things more fun. --Jon Pyre 20:19, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
6. Kill - I'm sorry, but I just don't find this as being very useful. -- 20:50, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

   First of all we DON'T need more MALL-RELATED skills. Malls are already easy enough to find stuff in. I'm not understanding the suggestion. On the Search Odds Page, there is a 12% chance of finding a syringe (to use your example) with an average AP cost of 8. So, would you AUTOMATICALLY find a syringe at 8 AP (not to mention this NERFS Syringe Manufacturing)? Or what about the Flak Jacket? Would you AUTOMATICALLY spend 62 AP to get one? I doubt people would have a problem spending 50 AP to automatically acquire 10 FAK. I also don't see why this should only be for high-levels. I could, maybe, see this working if it cost a lot more to do (since the searcher is being "picky" about what they find).--Pesatyel 23:43, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

   This is not mall related AT ALL. My example was searching an NT building! Clearly you do not understand the suggestion.

   When Kevan modified the search odds to make an average AP cost of 8 for finding a syringe, THAT nerfed syringe manufacturing; Scrounging does not change this situation at all.

   You would not AUTOMATICALLY find a syringe at 8AP. One time it might cost you 1AP, another time it might cost you 15AP, just like right now; the difference is you would only click once. Also I want it to cost the same number of "server hits" even though it only really hits the server once, because I do not want to help zergers. I would be fine with Flak Jackets not being something you could Scrounge for. I really want it for revive syringes, shotgun shells, pistol clips, generators, and fuel cans. I'm tired of collecting a bunch of stuff I already have just to get what I need.

   I don't care if high levels or low levels take it. But as a low level, you would not want to pass up the chance to get a free shotgun while searching for shotgun shells; as a high level you might well have four shotguns already and no interest in a fifth.

   I'd be fine with a slight penalty for this. I had personally thought that it was enough of a penalty that you would never find any cool extra goodies.

   I really have no idea why I even took the time to make a suggestion. Well, thanks for responding, I guess. Steveha 09:48, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

   This IS "mall related" because the suggestion SAYS THAT IT IS. ...this should have Shopping as a prerequisite. Perhaps even Bargain Hunting. THOSE skills are ONLY used in Malls.--Pesatyel

   I'll just say that the skill was never intended to be "mall related". If you think it would be better with no prerequisites, then fine, whatever. Steveha 08:47, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

7. Author Kill - The desire to make suggestions has once again been burned away from me. I will take no further action to promote this idea. I am not being sarcastic when I say I would welcome someone claiming the idea as their own, tweaking it as needed, and suggesting it. I'm done, though. I'm just finished. Steveha 09:48, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
8. Kill - Your ideas and arguments make a lot of sense (we need more of that around here), but please stop being a drama whore. Anyway, the main problem with this is that it decreases the amount of time it takes to find things. Let's say that there's a breach during a siege and zombies start infecting everyone. Normally, survivors would have to search a couple times before they would find a FAK. Now, they would be guaranteed to find one instantly, with the only delay being the time it takes to click the button once. Also, this might as well remove the useless items from the game, which many voters are not going to like. --Reaper with no name ^TJ! 18:01, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

   Survivors would only need to Scrounge once to find a FAK, but it would burn through just as many AP as repeated searching, and I'd be fine with the server making them wait while it simulated the searches. I'd also be fine with an automatic drop of useless items, which (as I've argued elsewhere) is actually more "powerful" than the proposed scrounging. Many voters may not like this, and I do not like needing to drop dozens of DNA Extractors, so we're even. You shouldn't turn down every suggestion just because someone won't like it. Well, see you in Malton. Steveha 09:56, 19 January 2007 (UTC)
   

Spam/Dupe Votes

1. Spam - much of this game (in fact, much of most computer games) is based on chance. Chance makes each new iteration of a game a different challenge, and thus more interesting for the player. This suggestion aims to remove all the chance involved in searching. Why search at all if a set cost is equal to the average search chance? --Funt Solo 10:58, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

   Gee, thanks for flagging this as spam. That will sure teach me to make a suggestion. If you just don't like an idea, I think that's properly a "Kill" vote... If you WANTED to drive me away, then well done. By the way, one time you would Scrounge and it would cost 1AP; another time it might cost 9AP; chance is still present, you just don't click as many times. Not that I care anymore. Steveha 09:48, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

   If you don't want Spam votes, then I suggest you use the discussion page to hash out your suggestions in future. This one is broken. As for my spam vote being enough to drive you away - oh, please: don't be such a drama whore. --Funt Solo 12:33, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

2. Spam - As Funt. --Aeneid 19:29, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
3. Spam - Funt has it wrong in the way that it doesn't take the chance of the game (it can take you 1 AP to scrounge for a syringe in a powered NT building as well as 10 AP, if I readed the suggestion right), but it saves server hits per AP spent, and so it makes room for a guy to have even more characters, ultimately helping zergers and hurting the little ammount of revenues Kevan can get from the game by allowing an user to maintain more characters simultaneously without needing to donate. --Matthew Fahrenheit ^YRC☺T☺+1 21:19, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

   I was just trying to spare the poor server when it's busy. The "server hits" cost for non-paid-for characters should be the same. If you Scrounge and it costs 8AP, it should also cost 8 server hits, even though the actual load on the server is reduced. I absolutely DO NOT want to help zergers. Steveha 09:48, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

4. Spam - Randomise! Setting it to auto-drop what you don't want is fine, but this is bad. Also, don't abuse statistics. If there is a 20% chance of finding an item in one search, there is an approximately 67% chance you'll have found something and around 41% chance that you'll have found exactly one thing. --Burgan 22:03, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

   The auto-drop is really enough to make me much happier. I'm just so tired of dropping DNA Extractors. Please suggest an auto-drop feature. "don't abuse statistics"? Whatever, dude, whatever. Steveha 09:48, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

5. Spamtastic - UD is a game of chance. Keep it that way. --_Ducis ^Dux_Sloth^Talk 04:54, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

   Right now UD is a game of dropping DNA Extractors too. Please don't keep it that way. Steveha 09:48, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

6. Thanks for the clarification, but that, to me, now makes it spam worthy. First, there are already several "drop related" suggestion in Peer Review (like this for example). Secondly, inventory management is an important part of playing a survivor. If I could just ALWAYS find what I wanted (and, usually, you can find at least ONE of whatever within 10 or so searches, hell I found three generators within 50 AP!) it would imbalance the game.--Pesatyel 19:55, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

   Thank you for pointing out the related suggestion. I missed that when checking for previous suggestions, else I would not have bothered to suggest this. I do not agree that "Scrounging" is spam, even though it overlaps a bit with "Autodrop useless double item", but it doesn't really matter. I do not agree that it breaks the game; if it took you 50 AP to find three generators with searching, it would still take you 50 AP to find three generators with Scrounging, and with the search you might find some bonus item you wanted (so an autodrop feature would actually be more "powerful" than Scrounging.) Well, see you in Malton. Steveha 08:47, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

7. As Funt. And why the hell would the author vote kill on his own suggestion??!? --Slice 'N' Dicin' Axe Hack 12:47, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

   Because I am not willing to invest the amount of time it would take to try to revise this to the point where people would vote for it. I'll say it again: I would welcome someone else grabbing the idea and running with it, and taking credit for it as well since they would be doing the work. I'd rather play the game than spend a bunch of hours trying to hone the perfect suggestion, so I decided to stop trying to convince people. Steveha 09:56, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

8. Kill - The search thing is random. There's no way of knowing how many AP searching would take, so there's no way of the server knowing how much AP scrounging would take.

   It's easily done. The simplest way would be for the server to simulate repeated Searches until one succeeded. The server could also have a precomputed set of odds, and could use one "roll of the dice" (the random number generator) to index into the precomputed odds table and come up with a number of AP in one shot. Kevan could do this without any advice from me or anyone else. Vote no if you don't like the idea, but don't think it's impossible; it's easily done.

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Kill Counter

Timestamp:	c138 RR - PKer 17:21, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
Type:	Profile addition
Scope:	Everyone
Description:	In your profile, under the field that shows how many times you've died, there will be a new field marked "Kills". This shows how many other players you have successfully bumped off. Zombie/survivor kills will not be differentiated; this totall will only display the overall tally of all kills your character has made. The purpose of this is to let active fighters show proof of their efforts, to let healers show evidence of their pacifist nature, etc.

Keep Votes

1. Keep - ...or shoud I say "kill" (bad pun intended)? --Uncle Bill 17:51, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
2. Keep - It makes keeping track of your kills that much easier.--Brendoshi 19:35, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
3. Keep - Ooooh --Gene Splicer 20:03, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
4. Keep Start countin' blam blam blam blam MrAushvitz 20:18, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
5. Keep - Meh, I like it. Always wanted one... Probably wont be retroactive, but Im ok with that. Unsigned vote removed. -Mark 21:53, 14 January 2007 (UTC) Dammit, I forgot to sign this thing... --GhostStalker 20:10, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
6. PKer killing sprees!!! --Slice 'N' Dicin' Axe Hack 13:09, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
7. Keep - I can't think of a reason why not. It shows how often you've died (at least when you're a zombie); why shouldn't it show how many people you've killed? --Reaper with no name ^TJ! 18:03, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
8. Keep - Because I can. --c138 ^{RR - PKer} 16:12, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
9. Keep - i love this idea i want to see how many i kill. Neji
10. Keep - I agree with this death toll idea! before I came on here I was looking to see if I had a tally anywhere on my characters profile. --Turneo
    

Kill Votes

1. Kill - All this does is enable keeping score for kids in trench coats who get in kill scoring contests. I like the fact that the game does NOT track kills, and hence is more free-form and less of a pissing match. --Swiers 20:36, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
2. Kill - There are many better suggestions concerning information shown on profiles. I prefer those. Still no spam. --Matthew Fahrenheit ^YRC☺T☺+1 21:15, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
3. Kill - Interesting, but Swiers makes a good point. Besides, some PKers might start trying to target pacifists. --Wikidead 21:21, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
4. Kill -- I agree with Swiers. -- Whitehouse 22:21, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
5. Kill - Barricaders deserve more kudos than trenchies -- boxy ^{T L ZS PA DA} 03:24, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
6. Kill - Just not really needed. I'd rather an overall stat-page of many different actions, etc. which has been mentioned before. --_Ducis ^Dux_Sloth^Talk 04:56, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
7. Kill - I like the version on the discussion page that keeps this stat a secret from other players. --Funt Solo 14:32, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
8. Kill - Would cause killing spree matches between PKrs.--J Muller 05:00, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
9. Swiers says it best. --ExplodingFerret 05:38, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
   

Spam/Dupe Votes
Spam/Dupe Votes here

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Bandoleer

Timestamp:	MrAushvitz 21:01, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
Type:	New shotgun loader item
Scope:	Reloading shotgun shells, near larger groups of zombies is easier
Description:	Bandoleer Commonly used by hunters, law enforcement (usually S.W.A.T.), and depending on ammo type & size, millitary personnel. They are used (in various shapes, sizes, styles and configurations) to make your ammunition "easy access" (especially if you're nervous or cold and your hands are shaking.) Even in the modern day they still exist, and can always found usually in hunting stores & the homes of a serious game hunter. Game Mechanics: Can be found in: Mall: Gun Store / Mansion / Armory (1.5%); Police Department (1%). These chances are added to current search %'s replacing the you find nothing search odds, so it won't take away from other available arms, ammo and equipment. You may only carry 1 Bandoleer at a time. Weight: 1 item slot (Cool looking belt/shoulder strap) If you find another bandoleer and you are already carrying one, you get the message: "You already have a bandoleer" and the extra bandoleer is not added (saves IP hits for dropping.) If you are at any location that contains at least 15 zombies, this is how the bandoller will function: While in your inventory, if you click on your Bandoleer and you have any single shotgun shells available in your inventory: For 2 AP, up to 3 seperate shotgun shells will be loaded into your shotguns.. starting with the most fully loaded shotguns 1st. (If you are in active combat this may come in very handy as far as actual game time, and attacks going back and forth.) Clicking on a bandoleer outside of an area that contains 15 or more zombies: no AP is spent and you get the message "This item is only effective in direct contact with 15 or more zombies" (So newbies will know when to use it, and not waste any AP...) Having a Bandoleer does not prevent you from reloading your shotguns in the normal manner, by clicking on single shells. The effective reason why it works is that the bandoleer doesn't allow you to carry more shotgun shells, but it definately makes them easier to access ammo accurately in combat. But since we won't allow something for nothing, and with PK'ing its so easy to find human targets.. we'll just say it only allows that +50% to reloading speed if you are in direct contact with a mob of at least 15 zombies. (So if your building is becoming overrun, it's your handy last stand piece of equipment.) The zombies outside probably won't mind, gives them a chance to add some excitement to your gaming experience.

Keep Votes

1. Author Keep Kind of hard to abuse it, if you're spending AP to step outside and back inside. But if you get feeding dragged outside.. fire away! This would work in very well with current gameplay and game mechanics. MrAushvitz 21:01, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
   

Kill Votes
Lock and load...

1. Kill -- Because I fail to see the relevance of 15 zombies effecting when you use a bandoleer. I understand that the 15 zombies part is meant as balance, but apart from that it makes no sense. -- Whitehouse 21:05, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
2. Kill - See no reason to improve on the Dam/AP ratio for shotguns. - BzAli 21:13, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
3. Kill Artificially limiting the use or discovery of an item is probably a sign that it's overpowered. I just don't see why humans need a boost in loading ammo at this point. The only change to guns I think are needed are to allow players to consolidate all their currently loaded ammunition into fewer firearms. --Jon Pyre 21:15, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
4. Kill - Kudos for uniqueness and creativity. No kudos for an abusive and overpowered suggestion. --Wikidead 21:24, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
5. Kill - Mostly alright, but get red of that 15 zombie nonsense. --Burgan 21:39, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
6. Good idea, and I see what you're trying to do, but I don't think this is the way to do it. -Mark 21:51, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
7. This sucks worse then the LAST time you submitted this. First of all, what does a zombie presences have to do with anything? Secondly, WHERE are the shotgun shells? In the bandoleer (then it would be a TWO space item)? In your inventory? Inventory management is a consequence of playing a survivor.--Pesatyel 23:04, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
8. Kill - I don't find this to be very useful when you can just load a shotgun for 2AP. -- 23:20, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
9. Kill - You can already carry multiple shotguns to get the same effect (less reload time) in game. Minus the extremes like one shotgun, one bandoleer, and nothing else but ammo, this adds nothing to the game, effect wise. Given that nobody would really carry 3+ shotguns, its easier to assume in role play terms that people carry one shotgun, and have found and are using neat toys like this (or shotguns with bigger capacity) when they carry "multiple" 2 shot shotguns. Since the effect is already in the game, why add complexity? --Swiers 23:34, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
   • Re Actually my intention, is this item will make being a shotgun user would make life simpler, think of how hard it is to search drop, search drop, reload etc.. this item would save on a lot of that hassle. Unload all your shotguns, get inside, next day.. step outside reload them all start a shootin'. MrAushvitz 02:28, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
10. Kill - The high AP cost of reloading a shotgun is what counter-balances it's high hit/damage rate. Shotties are powerful enough as is -- boxy ^{T L ZS PA DA} 03:19, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
11. Kill - I don't see much use for this really. --_Ducis ^Dux_Sloth^Talk 04:59, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
12. Kill - It's "bandolier."--'STER-Talk-Mod^P! 05:08, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
13. Huh? - I fail to see how this suggestion works... Are the shotgun shells you are loading on your body or in the bandolier? If they are contained in the bandolier, then why does it only take up one inventory space? And why does this only work when there are 15 or more zombies in the place? I just dont get this. --GhostStalker 20:17, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
14. Kill- I also don't see how the number of zombies would affect this. --Reaper with no name ^TJ! 18:06, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
    

Spam/Dupe Votes

1. Another day, another MrAushvitz suggestion spammed. Don't mess with something that works fine.--Gage 03:21, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
2. Spam - the worst thing about this is the only if there are lots of zombies around bit. Everything else about it is also awful, though. --Funt Solo 09:26, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
3. Note to MrA....shotguns hold 2 shells, not 3. --Slice 'N' Dicin' Axe Hack 13:31, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
4. Inventive in some ways. yet bizarre and broken for the main part. My survivor searches and reloads all his weapons at once, until he has an inventory full of loaded pistols and loaded shotguns (and a few other things). He then regenerates his AP to near max, leaves the safehouse, killkillkill, then back in when out of AP. After doing this a couple of times, he then travels back to reload. A lot of people probably do this. Is it worth having your 8 shotguns and their ammo taking up 32 inventory slots instead of 16 just so you can reload them in an action situation and save 5AP? And is it worth having less AP left to fight, and so having to go back to the safe-house essentially sooner (having done less fighting)? Umm... no. --ExplodingFerret 05:47, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

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