Suggestion:20070903 Barbed Wire Fencing 2.0

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20070903 Barbed Wire Fencing 2.0

O'Sheehy 07:34, 3 September 2007 (BST)

Suggestion type
New Item/Skills

Suggestion scope
Survivor Defense

Suggestion description

Barbed Wire Fencing 2.0

First off, this is not a duplicate of another idea. Although there have been many "Fence" suggestions (regarding junkyards and other such nonsense), this is not like any of those.

The premise of this idea is barbed wire fences that can be created and destroyed on the map. There would be a new item: Barbed Wire Spool Locations: Auto Repair Shops (.5%), Warehouses (1%), Mall Hardware stores (4%), Junkyards (8%), Storehouses (12%) Encumbrance: 5%

If you have as a prerequisite the skill construction and a toolbox in your inventory you can click on it in your inventory and a drop down bar will appear offering: North, South, East, West, and Cancel. Cancel would obviously cancel the action, and selecting a derection would construct a 'fence' along the respective side of the square you are standing in. This action would cost 2 ap, and a message would appear saying "You unravel the spool and set up a fence on the *Respective Direction* of the building/street." On the map the line along that square's side would be bold blue, similarly to how the walls around Forts are bold brown (the color blue is not important and is debatable for aesthetic reasons). Standing in that square, the description of that building/street would say "A piece of barbed wire blocks the *Directional*". Fences cannot be set up indoors, and no more than two sides of a single square could be fenced off.

Crossing through barbed wire is based on a certain percentage, and everytime you try to pass through you get damage. Survivors have a 25% chance of passing through barbed wire and a 75% of getting 'entangled'. If they get entangled a message comes up saying "Making your way through, your *piece of clothing* gets entangled in the wire." and they lose 3 hp (their respective clothes are torn/ripped). If succesful, they simply pass through the barbed wire unharmed. With the Free Running Skill, a survivor gets an additional 20% to successfully run through barbed wire.

Zombies have a harder time getting through the wire at only 10%, but take less damage, losing only 2 hp when getting entangled (for flavor purposes perhaps Zombies could have more gruesome entanglement messages such as "Making your way through the wire, your stomach rips open and your intestines become entangled in the wire"). With the Lurching Gait skill they would get an additional 15% chance to pass through barbed wire, raising it to 25%.

Survivors can only use blunt objects and fire axes in combat against barbed wire fences. Like when attacking barricades, the combat percentages of blunt objects are halved. Barbed wire fences have different levels of stability. Each level has 1 hp, similar to how barricades need only be succesfully struck to be brought down a level. Barbed wire fences can either be at full strength, have a 'small hole', or a 'large hole'. Successfully attacking a barbed wire fence with a 'large hole' completely destroys the fence. With a small hole, the percentage of passing through for both survivors and zombies increases by 20%, and a large hole an additional 20%. Fences can instead be destroyed by wirecutters, which automatically reduces the fence to a lower level without a combat percentage. Zombies combat percentages against barbed wire fences are also halved. Zombies get 1 xp for taking a fence down a level, and Survivors do not. Fences cannot be repaired, only new fences can be built over existing ones.

To balance things out for zombies, two new skills become available.

A subskill of Vigour Mortis: Thrashing Fist - Zombie is able to attack barbed wire fences at their regular combat percentage ('doubling' their chances now) A subskill of Brain Rot: Flesh Rot - Zombie loses one less hp by getting entangled in barbed wire (reducing the damge to 1 hp).

Uses: Well, I'm sure every survivor group would come up with their own barbed wire fence plan just as they have barricade plans. Fences could be used to flank free running lanes from attack, it could completely surround malls during sieges, it could block the gatehouse of a fort during an attack, etc. During more relaxed times a suburbs fence plan may be very minimal but during a suburb attack they have an emergency plan. People will be able to use this anyway they choose too, and I could expect a lot of creative things arising on their own which is the nature of this game.

Yes, I realize there is a potential with griefing, any good group has anti griefing measures.

Also, it makes the junkyard a more useful location to have gennyed up, and thus it becomes a defensive 'resource' building, adding more flavor to choice of location for human and zombie alike.

I don't think this is overy powerful for the survivors, being that most hordes have some higher level zombies in them, whom would have to lead groups of zombies and make gaps in the fences. Not to mention in all the majorly controlled zombie suburbs (such as Ridleybank), coordinated zombies would easily destroy any attempt to barricade areas off.

Voting Section

Voting Rules

Votes must be numbered, justified, signed, and timestamped. # justification ~~~~ Votes that do not conform to the above may be struck by any user.

The only valid votes are Keep, Kill, Spam or Dupe. If you wish to abstain from voting, do not vote.

Keep Votes

1. Keep - Author's Keep Vote. --O'Sheehy 07:36, 3 September 2007 (BST)
2. Keep - Not a bad idea really. Well thought-out. Could use some community imput though, I'm pretty sure this is going to get killed. I'd restrict the barbed wire to streets, lanes, etc. only and flip the percentages - 75% chance to get through, 25% not. Lower the damage for survivors to 2HP also. 3 is a bit much. And maybe have 2HP for Survivors, 1HP for Zeds. Still, as the city is getting increasingly ruined and groups claiming areas, I could see this happening. Oh damn, You better get rid of the Zed skill which attacks 'cades at the normal rate. Big no-no there. Zeds already have the advantage of numbers + ability to stand right back up after dying for attacking 'cades. --_Ducis ^Dux_Sloth^Talk 08:44, 3 September 2007 (BST)

   Re: Damn, thanks for pointing that out about the barricades. It was supposed to be a bonus against barbed wire, that was the whole point. I'm also not opposed to changing the numerical values of the other percentages and stuff, like you were saying. --O'Sheehy 08:49, 3 September 2007 (BST)

   Re: No problem. Best off to leave the tweaks to a later revision. Or post on talk:suggestions, the community and I could help you out with balancing the numbers and tweaks. --_Ducis ^Dux_Sloth^Talk 09:00, 3 September 2007 (BST)

3. Keep - A keep from me is a rare thing. This suggestion is really neat. Opens loads of new ways for roleplaying. Possibly modify the spools to worl a little like spray cans though. Allow between one and three uses per spool. --The Grimch ^U! 09:52, 3 September 2007 (BST)
4. Keep - It could use some tweaks, but it's still pretty good. --Anotherpongo 10:01, 3 September 2007 (BST)
5. Keep - Sounds interesting. --Amanu Jaku 11:53, 3 September 2007 (BST)
6. Keep - This is what happens when you put the time and effort into creating a suggestion. Even an Idea that has previously been regarded as unworkable can be fixed up. --Seventythree 12:02, 3 September 2007 (BST)

   Re: Thanks man. I'm hoping most people will simply vote on the concept, and acknowledge that the numbers/percentages are open to change. It looks like most of the kill votes have been critical of a specific nuance in my suggestion and not the whole thing; maybe I'll take it to the talk page to refine it. --O'Sheehy 17:35, 3 September 2007 (BST)

7. KEEP KEEP KEEP! Fantastic idea , friend. Not only does it add another aspect to the game, it makes a useless item (wirecutters) useful, as well as turns a useless building into a resource building. Why didn't anyone think of this earlier!--Franz Molotov 17:48, 3 September 2007 (BST)
8. Keep - This looks better than the last go, and seems like it would make the game more interesting. --Pgunn 18:07, 3 September 2007 (BST)
9. Keep - Nice updates, makes it less of a griefing tool and more of a formidable wall.--Private Mark 23:13, 3 September 2007 (BST)
10. Keep - As Private Mark. I feel flattered that you rememberd my idea of taking damage. I agree with JohnRubin though: encumberance should be increased. As for Steakfish's claim that it would be easy to grief, it's in my experience that when a community runs into a wall (so to speak) they work around it. In this case, zombie's would likely employ groups for explicitly removing fences in their 'burbs. Bonus for giving zombies another gameplay role. BUT: you MUST work out how diagonal movement will factor into the use of fences.--Last_Ranger 23:57, 3 September 2007 (PST)
11. Keep - i like it --~~~~ [Talk] 10:47, 4 September 2007 (BST)
12. Keep - A very solid, well thought out plan that just needs some tweaking. I like it a lot.Barrylocke 17:21, 4 September 2007 (BST)
13. Keep - As Barry, i think it's a brilliant idea! --Acoustic Pie 23:13, 4 September 2007 (BST)
14. Coolio - OMG, this is a good idea. No nerfs, adds new aspect to game, and adds funnnn!!!! But, mebbe add more encumberance. A V3 would DEFINETLY pass. BoboTalkClown 00:04, 5 September 2007 (BST)
15. Keep - A couple of the numbers could use a bit of tweaking, but really, when is that ever not true for great ideas? Frankly, I think this is well thought out and balanced. An annoyance, but not easily abusable or game-breaking. Furthermore, it works both ways. The only thing I'm sure about is the statement about blunt objects having 1/2 accuracy against these, "just like barricades". Last time I checked, using a blunt object had no effect on accuracy against barricades (except the crowbar, which is twice as effective against barricades rather than half). But I think that part was just a mistake in wording. --Reaper with no name ^TJ! 19:40, 13 September 2007 (BST)
16. Keep I personnely like it --Zach016 04:20, 15 September 2007 (BST)

Kill Votes

1. Kill/Change - Barb wire spools (big enough for making, for example, a concertina wire) are quite heavy. For the sake of realism and (more important) balance they must have much higher encumbrance - I suggest 20% (as generators). It will still have a lot of potential for griefing. -- John Rubin^{T! ZG} 11:45, 3 September 2007 (BST)
2. Kill - Barbed wire makes some sense... but I just can't see a way to make it actually work well... including this... Basically, you're nerf-bombing Free Running, and that is BAAAD. It's a very good try, though, kudos for effort, anyway. --WanYao 13:17, 3 September 2007 (BST)
3. Kill - Well though out, but has some kinks. As Dux said, take it to the talk page. --Sonofagun18 17:03, 3 September 2007 (BST)
4. Kill - but nearly there! Address Midianian's concern about diagonal movement and you'll have my vote. -- Pavluk 19:26, 3 September 2007 (BST)

   - actually not that hard to address, i posted it up on the talk--Zach016 21:41, 18 September 2007 (BST) Non Author RE.--Karek^maps?! 10:10, 19 September 2007 (BST)

5. Kill - I think this sort of fencing would be worse for survivors than for zombies: it takes away HP which is important for survivors but not for zombies. I don't know why survivors would choose to set it up. --Toejam ^{A Stats Graph} 02:00, 4 September 2007 (BST)
6. Kill - as the others.-- Vista  +1  13:22, 4 September 2007 (BST)
7. Kill - Potential for griefing. --Poju 15:19, 6 September 2007 (BST)

Spam/Dupe Votes

1. Spam I Am Where did I see this before? oh yeh... NEXUS WARS FOR THE LAST TIME URBAN DEAD =/= NEXUS WARS NOW GTFO!!!! Sockem 07:40, 3 September 2007 (BST)
2. Spam - Incomplete. 1) What are storehouses? I don't seem to recall that kind of buildings in UD. 2) Does this obstruct normal freerunning? If so, what happens when you fail? 3) What about diagonal movement? --Midianian|T|T:S|C:RCS| 14:06, 3 September 2007 (BST)

   Re: Storehouses are buildings located inside of Forts. Please, do your research before you accuse people of having "incomplete" suggestions. --Themanwhocares4 14:52, 3 September 2007 (BST)

   Re: My bad, but it still is incomplete. Not telling how freerunning and diagonal movement works is a very large deficiency. --Midianian|T|T:S|C:RCS| 15:32, 3 September 2007 (BST)

   Re: Well, I thought since it says that they have no effect indoors people would take it for granted that the idea does not affect inside movement or free running. This is simply intended as an 'outside only' item. I'll make that clearer in my next version. --O'Sheehy 17:37, 3 September 2007 (BST)

   Re: I kind of guessed that, but you should really be explicit in those kind of things. And there's still the question of diagonal movement you haven't answered! --Midianian|T|T:S|C:RCS| 16:08, 4 September 2007 (BST)

3. HONK HONK HONK - Habeeb it. --Sonny Corleone ^{RRF DORIS CRF pr0n} 15:59, 3 September 2007 (BST)
4. Spam - No Auto-attacks. --Saluton 16:11, 3 September 2007 (BST)
5. Spam - As Saluton. This is simultaneously an auto-attack and an area-effect attack. It's also a big nerf to low-level Zeds, who are usually feral (no high level buddies to break the wire for them) and usually DO care about HP (they may not have Lurching Gait or Ankle Grab yet). It also fails the "multiply by a million" test. --Steakfish 00:13, 4 September 2007 (BST)
6. Spam - aren't there enough 'OMFG BARRICADEZ IN DA STREETZ!!1' suggestions yet? --Ropponmatsu 00:56, 4 September 2007 (BST)
7. Spam - Auto-attacks, lowbie zombie nerf, and just plain old no. --Druuuuu 19:42, 4 September 2007 (BST)
8. Super spam -No brain rot sub-skills, no "traps", this suggestion really has no point, or at least is way more useful to griefers (or at least obsessively safe idiots.) than it is to pro-survivors. It distresses me to see how many people were stupid enough to vote keep. --AlexanderRM 02:03, 6 September 2007 (BST)
9. Spam - As others.--Karek^maps?! 14:59, 6 September 2007 (BST)
10. Screw it. I'm not giving a reason for the rest of my votes in this spree.-- dǝǝɥs oʇ ɯɐds: sʎɐʍ1ɐ! 17:33, 9 September 2007 (BST)
11. Repeat after me. Autoattacks baaaad... --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 22:09, 11 September 2007 (BST)