Developing Suggestions

Developing Suggestions

This section is for presenting and reviewing suggestions which have not yet been submitted and are still being worked on.

Nothing on this page will be archived.

Further Discussion

• Discussion concerning this page takes place here.
• Discussion concerning the suggestions system in general, including policies about it, takes place here.

Please Read Before Posting

• Be sure to check The Frequently Suggested List and the Suggestions Dos and Do Nots before you post your idea. You can read about many ideas that have been suggested already, which users should be aware of before posting what could be a dupe: a duplicate of an existing suggestion. These include Machine Guns and Sniper Rifles.
• Users should be aware that page is discussion oriented. Other users are free to express their own point of view and are not required to be neutral.
• If you decide not to take your suggestion to voting, please remove it from this page to avoid clutter.
• It is recommended that users spend some time familiarizing themselves with this page before posting their own suggestions.
• After new game updates, users are requested to allow time for the game and community to adjust to these changes before suggesting alterations.

How To Make a Suggestion

Adding a New Suggestion

• Copy the code in the box below.
• Click here to begin editing. This is the same as clicking the [edit] link to the right of the Suggestions header.

• Paste the copied text above the other suggestions, right under the heading.
• Substitute the text in RED CAPITALS with the details of your suggestion.

{{subst:DevelopingSuggestion
|time=~~~~
|name=SUGGESTION NAME
|type=TYPE HERE
|scope=SCOPE HERE
|description=DESCRIPTION HERE
}}

• Name - Give the suggestion a short but descriptive name.
• Type is the nature of the suggestion, such as a new class, skill change, balance change, etc. Basically: What is it? and Is it new, or a change?
• Scope is who or what the suggestion affects. Typically survivors or zombies (or both), but occasionally Malton, the game interface or something else.
• Description should be a full explanation of your suggestion. Include information like flavor text, search odds, hit percentages, etc, as appropriate. Unless you are as yet unsure of the exact details behind the suggestion, try not to leave out anything important. Check your spelling and grammar.

Cycling Suggestions

• Suggestions with no new discussion in the past two days should be given a warning notice. This can be done by adding {{SDW|date}} at the top of the discussion section, where date is the day the suggestion will be removed.
• Suggestions with no new discussion in the past week may be removed.
• If you are adding a comment to a suggestion that has the warning template please remove the {{SDW|date}} at the top of the discussion section to show that there is still ongoing discussion.

This page is prone to breaking when the page gets too long, so sometimes suggestions still under discussion will be moved to the Overflow page, so the discussion can continue.

Please add new suggestions to the top of the list

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Suggestions

Fences are not solid walls, game mechanics there is to be different from buildings

Timestamp: Shambler for Shambala 07:11, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

Type: Change of isolation street/internals in some specific locations.

Scope: Both zombies and surviviors in soem specific locations with specific objects (like zoo cages) instead of buildings.

Description: Zoo enclosure, surrounded by wire fencing, is not solid building surround with concrete wall. Imagine a Lin cage surrounded by something like http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/49/Chain_Link_Fence_Black.jpg and keeping it in mind rethink of all the isolatin buildings' walls impose. It is not realistic. Lion cage was made to aow every visitor from street to see, hear and smell the Lion, not to walk around blind. Even for buildings, something is seen "through broken windows". I think that: 1) it should be visible who is inside even when you are outside. It was Zoo's goal that animals behind fences be visible. So now there are survivors(usually) inside and zombies(usually) on the street. They should see each other just like animals and visitors saw before. 2) Just like the fencing alows to see through, it does not isolate sound as well. What insider say may be heard by outsiders and vice versa. For counting 50 listeners among the mob, then people at another side of fence should be considered far-standers. Say, if inside there are 60 men and outside 30 zombies, the speech of man would only be heard by some 50 of men, and the speech of zombie would be heard by all 29 zombies and some 21 men. 3) BTW, if it is wire fence like photo above, then it probably disallows any melee weapons - knifes, axes, sticks, zombie hands and teeth... - just like the concrete wall does. Afterall it was designed to keep animal and visitors safe of each another. But spaces between the wires (remember photo above?) are to allow pistols and shotguns bursts. Consider this an optional addition to sight and sound corrections above. It is realistic but it (even if only locally) changes weapons balance and might be taboo for some just to think of. I do not want 1 and 2 sunk only because no one likes 3. However i'd still describe effect of wire fencing on the firearms. Shooting through the wires is possible. AP penalty probably would be added then - you need to aim carefully, to shoot between wires of fencing. Or the penalty to hit chance might be appied - you do not aim carefully, but chance is for bullet to be deflected by the fencing especially when target is not still. How this probably would change game mechanics around zoo and other similar locations, if any? Zombies would better saw which of cages (lion enclosure, bear pit, maybe to some extent girafe and eephant houses) is full of healthy protectors or is a weak stronghold, that would allow for better planning of attack (timing and location aim). Zombies would be allowed to groan from street (they do see survivors from street), hence easier gather together to attack. Surviviors would easier see how large is the sieging horde and if they better flee or repell. If shooting through wire fencing would be allowed, then surviviours would have better chance to protect the place, compensating bonuses for zombie organization there. Combined together, that would make new unusual chalenges there for both zombies and surviviors. That would probably also make easy to survivors to reclaim cages back from zombies, provoking them to flee instead of protecting the place. However since there can be offline players they would still have the reason to fight. Alas that might allow to PKers to shoot and run, at least when the daylight shines (no electric light expected in animal cage in daytime zoo). How this probably would change game mechanics Malton-wise? In large scale - no change. Those who don't like it just don't go there. Just like forts, mansions - special place, that you can easily avoid. And just like them - it would add to variety colour of Malton for those who want to look close and intentionally go there. There is a team that strives to make Zoo special, safe recreational park for anyone. I visited zoo to see that "special", beeing little bored of random street fights. And succumbed to that wiki pages about cultural place. My zombie tourist walked in naively - and instantly got shot and then revived. It appeared to be just yet again formless random fighting there (despite i really saw some persons trying to role-play there, but their efforts could not overcome other guys' "shoot 1st" attitude, fear and lust for XP. Just like in any other location in Malton, that i left behind. Same gray colour. Zoo was great idea, and it should be something special and unusual, for those who wants some new joy or sme new challenge. We have a lot of streets with no real difference between them. Zoo is to be special. And Malton would only benefit from added variety. Also little discussion was at http://wiki.urbandead.com/index.php/Talk:The_Lion_Enclosure PS: To some extent this might also be true for wastelands or garbage dumps (i can't remember exact description of those locations, but i remember barricading was displayed to be patching holes in fencing, so i think it is surrounded by fences too, so same idea applies for them) PPS: i also think the graffiti is to be disallowed inside cages or to be rephrased. Thee is no walls, so there is nothing that can be "painted ... on the wall" - it might be on the floor, on some box, on some plackard hanging on the fence... Maybe even some solid door be there - though such doors are not typical for zoo. But not on the wall - no walls.

Discussion (Fences are not solid walls, game mechanics there is to be different from buildings)

1 could be workable, I don't know what people who are regularly in the zoos would say, 2 I personally don't like, 3 is x-ray vision and shouldn't really be allowed.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 10:00, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

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Change Freerunning to Misc. skills

Timestamp: Enigmatalk 04:23, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

Type: Skill change

Scope: Survivors

Description: Makes things a tad easier for scientists, and I never really associated vaults, long-jumps and wall-running etc. with soldiers, but with bored teenagers who like running and jumping over stuff.

Discussion (Change Freerunning to Misc. skills)

I could support this. - User:Whitehouse 11:37, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

Yep --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 11:49, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

Would be a nerf to Military survivors, as free-running is the only really vital skill that is on the Military list. Scientists have at the same time another vital skill with Diagnosis, and IMHO overall the more useful skills. (Healing and reviving are more important in the big picture, and CRing can substitute killing zombies to a good amount. Combat skills are only really useful against rotters, death-cultists, other survivors and other instances where CRing isn't a (sensible) option.) --Spiderzed 12:48, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

Not keen. To me, free-running has always been poorly named - I've seen it more as representing urban warfare tactics like mouse-holing and the like, rather than parkour. If anything, I'd like to see it renamed. Though I do agree that perhaps all the classes should have a greater balance to begin, I don't think this is quite the way to do it. 14:23, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

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Gloves

Timestamp: --10:37, 7 March 2010 (UTC) Jack Kolt Talk|Chars

Type: Clothing addition

Scope: humans, mostly.

Description: Post-quarantine, Malton seems like a cold place. Be it the ridiculous amounts of fog, 3 months of snow every couple years, or the fact that you have to augment your corpse to make it rot. well shouldn't survivors keep their hands warm? well now they can, with gloves. damage: blood flecked,stained,soaked/ripped,torn types: A pair of <color,> nylon gloves A pair of <color> leather gloves A pair of <color> gloves A pair of <color,special> mittens A pair of rubber gloves A pair of fingerless gloves A pair of latex gloves color tags: <color> pertains to the colors: White,Black,Gray,Brown. the "special" tag adds the colors: Blue,Red,Purple,Green,Yellow,Pink all the glove types can be found in malls, except for the normal and latex gloves, which can be found in hospitals

Discussion (Gloves)

This really belongs in Clothes/Suggestions Enigma^talk 10:52, 7 March 2010 (UTC)

In fact, before you submit that blindly over there, there's even a current suggestion about gloves: Clothes/Suggestions#Gloves --Spiderzed 12:02, 7 March 2010 (UTC)

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Memories of Life - Necrotech recognition

Timestamp:  Adward  22:12, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

Type: Skill Tweak

Scope: Zombies with Memories of Life.

Description: When a zombie purchases Memories of Life, they will gain the ability to tell Necrotech buildings from ordinary buildings, as if they had purchased the Necrotech Employment skill. However, if revived, they still cannot use scanners, syringes, or any other Necrotech equipment until they have purchased the Scientist skills. Basically, zombies can now tell NT buildings from the street, but nothing else.-- Adward  22:12, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

Discussion (Memories of Life - Necrotech recognition)

I tried to get this through with the scent tree once. -- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 22:18, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

The difference, from what I can see of the spam votes, is that it's not an entirely new skill.-- Adward  22:20, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

Interesting idea, though flavor-wise, it doesn't make sense, since it would imply that every zombie used to be able to identify NT buildings (i.e. they were all Scientists). If we dismiss the flavor concerns though, I tentatively like the idea. I believe in having the skill trees being largely self-contained, and this is one example where they're not. This suggestion would help that. —Aichon— 23:30, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

Flavour could be something such as your zombie gaining knowledge of certain buildings, such as in Iscariots suggestion.-- Adward  22:26, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

That doesn't work though, since MoL's flavor is that the zombie is remembering things from when they were human, not learning new things. That was my concern about flavor. —Aichon— 22:46, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

I'm with Aichon on this one, the flavor is messed up all to hell. (Why should reactivating a dead region of the Hippocampus give you access to memories you never had???) That aside I kind of like the idea... I just have this nagging feeling that there is a better way. -Devorac 23:41, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

Maybe just make it a new skill off the MoL tree. As for flavor, you mean to tell me that, eventually, NecroTech is going to "higher/employ" everyone in the city?--Pesatyel 19:18, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

That would make it a dupe, and a skill that only gives the ability to see NT's is retarded.-- Adward  22:26, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

Tie it to Memories by making it a vague description, not the precise marking of NT Employment. Something like "You are standing outside the Building Building. A chemical smell hangs in the air", or "You are standing outside the Building Building. A strange logo hangs over its doors". That way, the intelligence idea is preserved, but the concerns for flavour are addressed. The description, whatever is chosen for it, would only be added to NT buildings, so it does add a modicum of acumen to the zombie with Memories, but not as much as NT Employment would (the 3x3 map wouldn't be affected, for example). Kosher for everyone? 22:34, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

This idea works (especially the "chemical smell", I think). It's a bit worse than the human skill, but gives the zombies a new, relatively low-value, aspect to MoL while preserving flavor. I'd get behind this idea. —Aichon— 22:46, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

The chemical smell ties into the flavor perfectly, with that change this a definite keeper for me. -Devorac 01:13, 7 March 2010 (UTC)

Just one quick thing, the door one wouldn't work out because from a flavour point of view, any survivor would notice that too, with or without being employed.

I'd keep with "Chemical smell" (seems quite plausible). But if that's the case, then this wouldn't go under Memories of Life. --Acidifiers 06:24, 7 March 2010 (UTC)

The flavour would be the newfound recognition of a smell that's always been there, perhaps. 17:50, 7 March 2010 (UTC)

We're now going over the same ground I did when I put this up. The argument boils down to:

• Those who want it to be in the Scent tree or the Memories tree
• Those that want to to be a free upgrade to an existing skill or an entirely new one
• Those who point out the flavour reasoning against either major standpoints

-- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 13:27, 7 March 2010 (UTC)

Oxford union style?--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 11:52, 8 March 2010 (UTC)

I've always thought a zombie shouldn't have "access" to the "living skills" (like NecroTech Employment) until they have MoL. But in this suggestion, we are boiling it down to making a zombie version of NecroTech Employment. If THAT is a bad idea, then the rest, and the flavor, is moot. If it IS a good idea, what sounds the most reasonable?--Pesatyel 05:46, 9 March 2010 (UTC)

Does this really change anything ? Zombie player can always open wiki-page and just read which buildings are NT. I do not say about possible Mozilla extension to do it.Shambler for Shambala 06:01, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

Some people don't meta-game.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 10:01, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

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Consistent Nonsense

Timestamp: RosslessnessWant a Location Image? 11:34, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

Type: skill tweak

Scope: Anyone with ears.

Description: If I'm standing outside a building and someone inside emits a feeding groan, I receive a message "You hear a groaning from somewhere nearby." If I'm inside a building and a zombie also inside groans I get a message that says "You hear a groaning from somewhere nearby". If I'm standing outside a building and a zombie that is also outside groans I get the message "You hear a groaning from somewhere nearby". Simply put. If I'm standing Inside a building and someone feeding groans directly outside I want to receive a message that says "You hear a groaning from somewhere nearby. --RosslessnessWant a Location Image? 11:34, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

Discussion (Consistent Nonsense)

Errm... is this really an issue? --Honestmistake 23:32, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

Not hugely game breaking, but simply a tweak. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 08:41, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

I know its a simple tweak but is it really a worthwhile tweak? How often does someone groan outside while you are inside.... Don't get me wrong, I would probably vote keep but as is I just can't see it getting any actual usage. --Honestmistake 13:52, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

Well, it's just for consistency I think. I mean, how often would a zombie scream street treats instead of eating it itself before it got away? And if you're both inside, then uh... thanks captain obvious. The only one of the three examples that probably could be useful would be hearing one inside from out. Enigma^talk 14:11, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

I get the consistency argument, but I think this is a matter of it being unnecessary. If you're in a siege and zombies are dragging folks outside, you hearing the groans of the zombies outside is entirely unnecessary and completely distracting (especially in malls). Same goes for street treats: groaning for them is counter-productive to the zombie cause, since you'd be pulling zombies away from actual targets. I think it's a simple matter of practicality that we don't hear them already. —Aichon— 17:41, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

True, but say Im inside a dark building and someone drags another survivor outside, they can groan to let me finish the job for them. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 18:40, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

I'd see a situation like that and would identify it as the prime example of why this suggestion is unnecessary. At least with the MOB, when we drag a survivor outside, we generally don't finish them since it's a waste of AP for us to do so. Ferals or zealots (members of MOB not in strike teams) will finish them off in a matter of minutes anyway. If they groan, that's just irresponsible of them, since groaning is supposed to lead to a source of food, and a single, almost-dead survivor is not a good source of food for a group of zombies. —Aichon— 18:49, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

No. But to a level one zombie a survivor on 12hp is XP gold. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 19:17, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

Very true, but I just don't think it matters. Let's go through the scenarios.

• If a zombie is in a strike team, either they're not a lowbie or they're gonna get fed by the team (most hordes have this policy). Getting fed is better XP than an injured street treat (sustained 100+XP/day at times).
• If they're feral, then they're probably not inside the building anyway, but are instead following groans, so they'll kill the street treat on the way in.
• If we assume they are in the building already, then they have no way to tell the indoor groans from the outdoor, since the message you propose is the same as what's used for indoors currently.
  • Also, even if they did, they'd have no way of knowing if the street treat is still alive, since zombie anonymity would keep them from being able to tell if the zombie that dragged is back indoors.
  • Complicating matters further, due to zombie anonymity, the other zombies outside wouldn't know if there was a lowbie inside anyway, so they'd have no reason to groan in the first place.

I just don't see a scenario where a zombie would need it. All it would do is cause screen spam. Older zombies have no need for the XP, ferals kill these targets in mere minutes anyway, and lowbies can't be identified unless they're on your contacts list (i.e. in your group, basically), in which case they're already being tended to. —Aichon— 19:48, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

Why the hell not? Lelouch vi Britannia is helping make Ridleybank green_ and gives Achievements 02:41, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

I don't see why not... Enigma^talk 10:27, 4 March 2010 (UTC)

I'm not actually following your suggestion, I'm guessing you were tired when you wrote it. Why don't we just have it as "Groaning nearby" is the location you are in when you receive the message and add a new qualifier to messages in the same block but elsewhere as regards the doors, "You hear a low groaning outside/inside"? -- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 18:43, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

Fair. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 19:17, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

That would allow building protecters to jump out on the street and help someone newb who got in trouble (if zombie calls for dinner - he probably is in trouble :-) ). Without need to spend APs and patrol around just for case.Shambler for Shambala 06:06, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

Well all the survivor would do is shoot the zombie, out on the street, thus causing the zombie to stand back up and kill the survivor. There's no way anyone can really "save" another player.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 10:03, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

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Crack Heads

Timestamp: Cookies and Cream 12:11, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

Type: Skill

Scope: Zombies

Description: Skill gives Zombies 40% chance to do extra 1 damage while biting by cracking open the skull. Also heals 1HP if successful. Any bite attampt after this has a 10% higher chance of gaining the head bite. As usual, can be fixed with FAK, like everything else.

Discussion (Crack Heads)

Are you saying that a player with a cracked skull suffers 5hp damage from all bite attacks? --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 20:45, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

No, I'm saying that, once cracked, a Zombie has a 50% chance of doing 5HP damage from connecting bite attacks. Cookies and Cream 22:16, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

Kind of like a specialized tangling grasp for bite? --Honestmistake 23:28, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

Possibly. It sounds like once a zombie bites, subsequent bites have a chance of doing +1 damage.--Pesatyel 04:48, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

What I had intended was that, firstly, the zombie has to get a successful bite attack. Then, they have a 40% chance to crack the skull. If the skull is cracked, the zombie does 1 extra damage, gets 1HP, and raises the chance of cracking the skull to 50%. Then the cycle repeats, except subsequent bites don't raise the crack chance. Cookies and Cream 06:32, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

I'm having a real hard time understanding it. Can you give me an example. My Zombie ALAN managers to enter a autor repair shop and sees NEWB1 standing there. I click bite. What happens Next? --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 09:41, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

And I'm having real hard time trying to find an explanation!

• Alan's first bite is rolled at 40% chance and succeeds, initiating a secondary roll which also has a 40% chance of hitting.

• The secondary roll fails, Alan does 4 damage.

• No changes occur, next bite is rolled just as the first one.

• The secondary roll succeeds, Alan does 5 damage and inflicts "cracked head" upon Newb1.

• Subsequent attacks against Newb1 have their secondary roll at 50% chance due to Newb1 suffering from "cracked head".

I hope that helped, I don't know why but I found that really difficult to explain. - User:Whitehouse 12:04, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

Ok. Does tangling grasp alter this in any way.?

is cracked head a condition, like being infected?

If another zombie bites NEWB1 between my attacks do I lose the bonus. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 13:40, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure it's like infection, because he said it could be fixed with a good FAKing. Enigma^talk 13:57, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

Assuming this (or something easier to understand but similar in effect) was implemented it would have to cause 4+1 damage rather than a straight 5 or flak would just make it pointless! --Honestmistake 13:36, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

Sorry for the confusion. What Whitehouse has said is correct. That is the way I wanted it to be like. Probably should have provided an example. Cookies and Cream 13:53, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

Exactly what Honestmistake said. XP is based on damage actually caused, therefore the only people that are going to suffer the extra damage are non-rotten zombies and newbies who haven't found a flak yet. -- . . <== DDR Approved Editor 06:51, 28 February 2010 (UTC)

Simplify it down to just being a child skill of tangling grasp that means all successful bites while grasping cause an additional 1 point of damage. I've not done the maths but I would not be surprised if maxed claws were still better in the long run but still. Remember though, to make it meaningful it must be an extra point rather than a flat 5.--Honestmistake 12:12, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

Hmmm. I don't know, flavor-wise it seems like a cracked skull would be a pretty serious problem, more serious than 1HP. But the HP system isn't exactly realistic to begin with. Either way it might be worth it to change the name of the suggestion if it went up for a vote. Something like, "gripping bite". And perhaps polish the explanation a little better.--_GANG Giles Sednik _CAPD 09:06, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

How about "Messy Eater: While grasping a foe the zombie uses its jaws to greater effect. All bites while grasping a target will cause an additional 1 point of damage" Leaves a lot of room for individuals to imagine their own flavour but still gives an explanaition for the extra effect. --Honestmistake 09:14, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

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Suggestions up for voting

• Blood Splatters for Attackers moved to Suggestion talk:20100225 Blood Splatters for Attackers