Suggestion:20071216 Dark Buildings V.1

	Revised
	This suggestion has been withdrawn for revision, the new version is here.

20071216 Dark Buildings V.1

Heinrich Loche 07:32, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Suggestion type
Flavour and tactical change

Suggestion scope
Certain buildings, and the players who use them

Suggestion description
This is the harsher, less far-reaching version of the dark buildings proposal. A softer and wider-spread alternative version will follow.

1) Clubs, cinemas, and mansions are all made 'dark buildings'.

2) When dark buildings are powered, they are as normal. When they are unpowered, the interior description of the building is removed and replaced with the line "It is dark inside."

3) Inside an unpowered dark building, players - both human and zombie - cannot see each other. The player list does not appear, and players cannot heal or attack each other. Speaking is as normal.

4) Inside an unpowered dark building, the search rate drops to nil.

To offset this, the following changes would be made:

1) A new item, the torch (that's a flashlight to Americans), is added. Torches can be found in auto repair shops, cinemas, junkyards and mall hardware stores.

2) Survivors with a torch may use it to switch it on, costing 1 AP. Players with a torch which is on can see as normal and receive normal search odds in unpowered dark buildings. Using the torch a second time turns it off, costing another AP.

3) For every AP spent with a torch on, there is a 5% chance of the torch's batteries running out. If this happens, the torch disappears from the inventory, and a message is displayed: "Your torch flickers out. Its batteries must have died."

4) Torches which are on grant a 2% bonus to search odds, for the player who holds the torch only, in all unpowered buildings other than dark buildings. They have no effect in powered buildings.

1) Zombies with Scent Blood are able to see (and attack) survivors as normal inside dark buildings.

2) Zombies with Scent Death are able to see and interact with other zombies as normal inside dark buildings.

This change is intended to add flavour clubs and cinemas, which otherwise hold little of interest other than for RP purposes, and to mansions, making them creepier and more fitting of a survival horror game (it is assumed that the windows of the mansions are boarded up, and hence there is little light inside, to create the spooky mansion archetype). Because none of the buildings chosen are significant resource buildings, the 0% search rate shouldn't have too much of a negative effect.

Low level zombies are unlikely to have Scent skills, making dark buildings a useful hiding spot against them. On the other hand, mid to high level zombies can see easily, and survivors can only hold the building for so long before their torches go out. Dark buildings would also provide a good hiding spot for zombies seeking to avoid a headshot while they're logged out, as survivors will have to spend an extra AP to switch on their torch if they wish to check inside the building for zombies.

The primary purpose of the change is to add a little more variety to the buildings of Malton, many of which are almost identical.

Voting Section

Voting Rules

Votes must be numbered, justified, signed, and timestamped. # justification ~~~~ Votes that do not conform to the above may be struck by any user.

The only valid votes are Keep, Kill, Spam or Dupe. If you wish to abstain from voting, do not vote.

Keep Votes

1. Keep - Not that bad at all. You forgot to vote on your own suggestion, though. --Private Mark 10:01, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
2. Keep - as Funt Solo below, but in keep section --~~~~ [talk] 12:07, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
3. Keep You turn your torch on. Which is obviously the text that would be used to stop people thinking it was a giant flaming pile of twigs. Also the part of the suggestion reading "Your torch flickers out. Its batteries must have died."--Rosslessness 12:15, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
4. Keep - Realistic, interesting idea. Seems like it would make the gameplay more fun too. I also don't see the point in people complaining that it's not American English - should the brits complain about other things not being British English? --Pgunn 20:44, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
5. Keep - I like it. Adds depth to the game, doesn't really hurt anything, and most importantantly... it uses flashlights (aka "torches.") And Karek, British English is okay. Malton is in England after all. --Uncle Bill 21:13, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
6. Keep/Change - As Han Solo. Han shot first!!! BoboTalkClown 21:26, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
7. Keep - I think it's worth keeping, or I wouldn't have suggested it. --Heinrich Loche 22:01, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
8. Keep- I like it, it add a sence of fear--Worthog117 23:03, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
9. Keep- As above. --Darth Lumis^{T! A! E! SR} 01:47, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
10. Keep - I really like this one! Adds something this game does not have a lot of: fear. Also where I come from, torches are called flashlights.^_^ Waterspark2 01:02 P.M., 17 December 2007 (EST)
11. Keep - Makes Malton a more interesting place. The search odds boost is a bit insignificant considering the locations, but torches would still be useful so that survivors could see each other. --Toejam 22:49, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
12. Keep - We might as well add some depth to ruined and unpowered buildings. --Calypso 22:57, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

Kill Votes

1. Kill/Change - I love the idea, but it needs some work. Can zombies see that survivors are using flashlights in a dark building, from outside? Because, if they can't, then this is overpowered in favour of survivors. The upped search odds need to be balanced by visibility to the zambah horde. (Previous flashlight suggestions have been rejected on those grounds.) Now, your choice of buildings is interesting. Clubs and cinemas, I get - but mansions? Don't they have big windows? Your flashlight is spookily similar to my own from the Peer Reviewed Underworld, with the 5% battery run-out chance. I like how that part balances with the zombies scent skills. In the long run, it places zombies at an advantage in dark buildings. How much does the torch weigh? --Funt Solo ^QT 11:21, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

   Good points, especially about zombies seeing torches from outside. What if the search bonus for torches/flashlights was dropped to 1%, and a line was added to the outside description of the building letting players know that a torch was shining from inside? Mansions I chose just because they're traditionally dark and scary. If it's an old mansion, it probably has a lot of interior rooms with no windows. The other possibilities were factories and warehouses, but factories are resource buildings so I expect that would get shot down. The torch would weigh 2-3%, similar to a spray can, which seems logical to me. --Heinrich Loche 22:01, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

   If I were you, I'd resubmit it, catering for some of the Kill-ers worries. Maybe allow any zombie a reduced attack %, instead of total blindness (to give the newbies a chance). Karek's just ranting like a lunatic - don't pay too much attention to him. And, it does no harm to use "flashlight", as then even the linguistically challenged will understand what's already really easy to understand. --Funt Solo ^QT 23:17, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

   The softer alternative version, 'Slightly Gloomy Buildings', might address some of peoples' worries anyway, so I'll submit that tomorrow before seeing if it's worth reworking this one. --Heinrich Loche 03:08, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

2. Kill - If it's a building that doesn't need searching, there's no disadvantage to survivors.Studoku 11:24, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
3. Kill/change - like it but there are just to many ways (for both humans and zambahs) to avoid the darkness. --the wallaby^♥ 12:11, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
4. Kill - Really uneeded. Why would those buildings be dark and not say an unpowered hospital or building?--  AHLGTG THE END IS NIGH! 17:00, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
5. Kill - No way. Suppose in a hypothetical situation, all buildings in Malton were ruined. That being said, it's a little over yourself to be making assumptions about what other people would think "Torch" would mean. –Ariedartin ^Talk 17:49, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

   I'm not sure what you mean. If all the buildings in Malton were ruined, then all the dark buildings would be dark, but I don't see how that would have a bad effect. --Heinrich Loche 22:01, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

   Apologies, I forgot that it affected only three types of buildings, not all. However, Funt's comments do make some sense. As Funt, then. –Ariedartin ^Talk 10:29, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

6. Kill -As Funt. --Heretic144 19:46, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
7. Change - As Funt. --Pavluk ^{A! E!} 20:22, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
8. Change - Remove the zombie restrictions. Hard enough on them as it is. --Druuuuu ^OcTRR 21:32, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
9. Kill - As Funt. --_Ducis ^Dux_Sloth^Talk 21:50, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
10. Kill - As Karek's rant. And I don't like that high level zombies are simply unaffected by this skill, whereas survivors have to spend a bunch of ap to make these buildings of any use. Kinda just giving these buildings to high level zombies. --Pdeq^Talk* 00:28, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
11. Kill - meh--Corndoghero^T-S-Z 03:05, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
12. I like the idea. I just think this itteration is pointless. The the locations in the suggestions don't even HAVE items to find (clubs, negligably). So the flashlilght part is essentially useless. The benefit, perhaps, is that survivors can sleep in there with less fear of attack since no one can see each other. But what about those with the appropriate skills? Survivors could be slaughtered.--Pesatyel 07:18, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
13. Kill - I'm not big on this --Ryiis 14:55, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

Spam/Dupe Votes

1. Spam - Where to begin. Low Level Zombies Don't Need the Game To Be Any Harder, it's already near unplayable for them as is. Flashlight Not Torch There's no fire, it's not super idiotic terms with multiple meanings hour, say flashlight it A)makes more sense B) doesn't show off your pompous belief that British English is anything but the worst English out there_{(due to terms like Torch that they make purposely confusing that are kept because it can serve as a direct reference to the age of the language. Languages update for a reason.)} and C)Torch=fire, any other claim is pointless because that's how 8/10 players will see it, regardless of your intentions, so No Fire!. Do Not Nerf People For No Reason, You give survivors flavor and an inconsequential nerf but then you give yet another massive nerf to low level zombies? No, that's unbalanced and idiotic. No one in the whole game has it harder than low level zombies and to claim otherwise shows your ignorance, of all people they do not need a nerf, low level survivors do not need protection from low level zombies, they barely need protection from even high level ones because their limitations actually help to keep them alive_{(free running and construction lead to hiding idiocy, without them you can't make stupid mistakes giving away your location, you don't need barricades/doors/entry points)}. And finally, Make The Game More Fun, Not Less, this sucks, seriously, it sucks. The flavor is that in a building survivors how have 0% search, an item called a FLASHLIGHT_{(not using torch)}, low level zombies get an even harder time finding people_{(ruins and un-barricaded mean they have to spend 4 AP on everyone they come across, so it's not really an issue of them finding and killing too many people)}, and you REMOVE the flavor in Cinemas and Clubs for the sake of making buildings more unique when those are already two of the most unique buildings in the game. --Karek^maps?! 12:00, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
2. Erm..... as Karek. -doc crook 21:34, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
3. Spam - Hurts zombie attack rates, and doesn't harm survivor searchs much (it's not like they're TRPs) -- boxy ^{talk • i} 06:57 17 December 2007 (BST)
4. Spam - I think Karek said it all. -- John Rubin^{T! ZG} 09:16, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

---