Suggestion:20080425 Memories of Life NT Requirement Update

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20080425 Memories of Life NT Requirement Update

Tselita 23:33, 25 April 2008 (BST)

Suggestion type
Rule Change for Skill
Suggestion scope
Zombies Suggestion description
Thsi is a very simple and direct suggestion, so it's not my usual 20 page novel.

Currently, when people turn into zombies, if they have NT Employment, they can recognize NT buildings even when zombies. Even though they don't have Memories of Life.

That doesn't make sense.

They can't remember how to open a door without Memories of Life, but they can remember which anonymous-looking building is NT and which is a normal office building? Remember, NT buildings are indistinguishable from normal buildings from the outside. There's no NECROTECH logo or anything on the outside. And yet they can remember which buildings are NT and which aren't from when they were alive, but they have trouble with the concept of the doorknob?

I propose a simple change in the requirements for recognizing NT buildings while a zombie. Instead of needing just NT Employment, you would need both NT employment and Memories of Life. This won't affect many people most likely, since many people just use the wiki anyway, and many people who have NT Employment probably already have Memories of Life, but it just makes more sense in general. If anything, it will encourage zombies to get Memories of Life a little bit earlier.

As was said by a commenter in Talk:Discussion, it's called Memories of LIFE, not just Memories of Doorknobs. That means it should be the requirement for things which let you remember things from when you were alive.

Voting Section

Voting Rules

Votes must be numbered, justified, signed, and timestamped. # justification ~~~~ Votes that do not conform to the above may be struck by any user.

The only valid votes are Keep, Kill, Spam or Dupe. If you wish to abstain from voting, do not vote.

Keep Votes

1. Keep - Author keep (note: Pesatyel's the one who came up with the 'memories of doorknob' comment - props to him for that) --Tselita 23:34, 25 April 2008 (BST)
2. Keep- Good idea. -- BKM 23:59, 25 April 2008 (BST)
3. Keep- I killed him. =P ^ --BoboTalkClown 00:54, 26 April 2008 (BST)
4. Keep - Yeah! now that I think about it, we should have to get both! It would give a player who likes playing as a zed another reason to get revived and buy a new skill.--Jamie Cantwel3 ^{Talk TTC} 00:58, 26 April 2008 (BST)
5. Keep- Zeds get to use to many survivor skills, (or survivors don't benefit enough from zeds skills) in any case. --FXI 01:32, 26 April 2008 (BST)
6. Keep - My justification is as Ms.Panes only I equate the zombie to have animal level intelligence, thus is confounded by these things known as doorknobs. Normal survivors who are alive don't know what an NT building looks like without training, so why shouldn't a zombie have the same thing, except that they also have to remember said training from when they were alive. Makes sense to me. --Amanu Jaku 03:30, 26 April 2008 (BST)
7. Keep - Makes sense. --Pdeq^Talk* 03:46, 26 April 2008 (BST)
8. Keep - I see no problem with it. Although it's hard to apply logic in a game packed with zombies, it still makes enough sense to warrant the change. Charlie Jackpot 09:25, 26 April 2008 (BST)
9. Keep - sounds right --~~~~ [talk] 12:55, 26 April 2008 (BST)
10. Keep - What the hell, you know? A new wrinkle in zombie builds and a change that hardly breaks the game due to available meta-gaming options.--  ^Z_Z 05:26, 28 April 2008 (BST)
11. Keep - I think its too late to include in MALTON, but it makes sense.--Pesatyel 08:12, 27 April 2008 (BST)
12. Keep A small change, but needed for common sense reasons. --Shusamchen 08:27, 27 April 2008 (BST)
13. Keep It's either this or change the name of MOL to 'open doors'... but the latter would require the tree to be rebuilt. Hurray to common sense. --Kamikazie-Bunny 13:29, 27 April 2008 (BST)
14. Keep - Simple, sensible and only small ramification for new players which can be easily overcome.--Scurley7 14:00, 27 April 2008 (BST)
15. Keep - voting keep on a suggestion that makes sense. --People's Commissar Hagnat ^{[cloned] [mod]} 15:56, 28 April 2008 (BST)
16. Keep - How can a zed remember a specific bit of information from life without MoL? This makes a lot of sense.--DI Sweeny 16:13, 28 April 2008 (BST)
17. keep(ish) - to steal Ms Panes analogy... if they need MoL to open the larder they need MoL to recognize it as such! Still, far more important things to change than what is in effect a very minor flavour change.--Honestmistake 11:47, 29 April 2008 (BST)
18. Keep - Makes sense, what with the whole door thing and all.--Medico 16:06, 29 April 2008 (BST)
19. Keep - Common sense will eventually prevail in Malton. --Pvt human 10:55, 30 April 2008 (BST)
20. Keep - Touche. --Vandurn 20:26, 30 April 2008 (BST)
21. Keep - makes sense --Frednotyetdead 22:32, 4 May 2008 (BST)
22. Keep - Hey, look, a door. I can open it, but I can't remember that it was my workplace for helf of my life, even though I have MEMORIES OF LIFE. --UCFSD 17:46, 5 May 2008 (BST)
23. Keep - This suggestion is completely unbalanced and gamebreaking, and thus gets my keep. --Hhal 23:54, 7 May 2008 (BST)
24. Keep - Makes sense. --_└^Frozen_┘^┌_Flame^┐ 22:54, 8 May 2008 (BST)
25. Keep - As above. Also, zombies having to act like zombies unless they have the proper requirements=fun. Zombies not needing any requirements to do what survivors can do != fun. --Barton 17:29, 9 May 2008 (BST)
26. Keep - Needs more..but this is about all that will pass.gabdewulf 02:27, 11 May 2008 (BST)

Kill Votes

1. Kill - This just makes things harder for newbie survivors who aren't using the wiki. When they're dead, they won't be able to see NTs, which will make it more difficult to find revives. If you find an NT that isn't ruined, you can look around and probably find an operational revive point nearby, without ever looking at a map. For most people, this is just flavor, and I think it makes sense, but it will just make things harder on newbies. --Jasonjason 01:56, 26 April 2008 (BST)

   • Seriously.... why are people thinking that newbie survivors-turned-zombies need to find NT buidings in order to get revived? Sacred Ground policy, Revive Points? Why do newbie zombies wanting revives need to find the NT so badly? There is graffiti everywhere in game stating where the revive points are, and every single cemetery is a de facto revive point. What newbies are we talking about? A level 2 survivor turned zombie who's only zombie skill is brain rot? The only reason anyone ever would need an NT to get revived is if they're brain rotted. *pause* I need a cafe mocha --Tselita 02:59, 26 April 2008 (BST)

2. Kill - If everything had to make perfect sense there wouldn't be zombies in the first place. But let's use an analogy to explain how the current system makes perfect sense, anyway. Let's say that you have a fridge. You sense that food is inside, you don't know how you know, but instinct tells you it's waiting behind the door. So you break down the barricades to get at it. But try as you might you can't open the door. The handle confounds you. Because you're a ***ing 2 year old. Mommy never taught you how to open the fridge. Only instead of a fridge, it's an NT building. And instead of food, you're seeking the needle of life. And instead of being two, you are one of the (much less feared) members of zombie-kind. See? Everything is perfectly logical in this game. --Ms.Panes 03:32, 26 April 2008 (BST)
3. Kill - No, just makes people go look at a map to find where the NT's are. Finding an operational NT's to stand near does significantly increase your chance of revival, btw, sacred ground policy, or not -- boxy ^{talk • i} 04:35 26 April 2008 (BST)
4. As Boxy.--ShadowScope^{'the true enemy'} 16:59, 26 April 2008 (BST)
5. Kill - DO NOT nerf newbie harmanz... newbie zambahz too... Please. -- 
   •  Nevin McAvoy 
   •  (talk) 
   17:20, 26 April 2008 (BST)
6. Kill - The current system makes sense to me. Memories of Life and related skills help dexterity/coordination, not vision/hearing/recall. And it's pointless if it can be worked around by looking at the map on the wiki. --Explodey 22:27, 27 April 2008 (BST)
7. Kill - Whether more logical or not (and that's debatable), this suggestion makes it too hard and too complicated for zombies to see NTs... Period. --WanYao 07:32, 30 April 2008 (BST)
8. Kill - This works against simplicity. --Toejam 06:19, 8 May 2008 (BST)
9. Kill - Reality != fun. Omega 01:49, 9 May 2008 (BST)

Spam/Dupe Votes

1. Spam - Because you don't need NecroNet Access to Scent Death as a human and there is no parallel zombie skill to seeing NTs.--Karek^maps?! 00:44, 26 April 2008 (BST)

   Re - I'm saying this with all honesty and no insult intended, I swear ... but I have no idea what you just said in the first part of the sentence. As for the second part - there's no parallel zombie skill to seeing NTs? The skill itself is a crossover skill - it can be used by survivors or zombies... but in order to use it, which would involve remembering things from your time among the living, I'm proposing you actually 'have' memories of life since you'd be using memories from your life. If possible please explain the first part, preferably in Discussion. Thank you. --Tselita 00:51, 26 April 2008 (BST)

   If you don't even know what I'm saying then why are you commenting on my vote? You're proposing zombies need MoL to use crossover skills while survivors still don't, you're proposing making it that much harder on low leveled players because you don't think it's fair that zombies can see NTs, you're proposing we don't let people find syringes without metagaming or having to spend a huge amount of XP at the point where they need those skills the most,see all the level 1 scientists who now can't find revives.--Karek^maps?! 01:00, 26 April 2008 (BST)

   To Discussion --Tselita 01:15, 26 April 2008 (BST)

2. Spam - Nice to see that even discussion in Peer Review won't stop you from posting stupid ass ideas. Keep reaching for that rainbow! --X 21:23 25 April 2008 (ZTC)

   Yes I particularly liked the part in talk:discussion where you cursed me out. Very stupid of me to feel that to remember something from life you'd need a skill which lets you remember something from life. The joy of the internet is getting to hear words of wisdom from people like you. --Tselita 03:04, 26 April 2008 (BST)

3. Spam - Dumb. I mean, really. It's not broke. Don't fix it. Just adds needless complication, -Druuuuu ^OcTRR 03:34, 26 April 2008 (BST)
4. Spam - As karek, both here and on talk. And id like to take this opportunity to say you are as dumb as a sack of doorknobs for so thoroughly missing the points people have been trying to make. --The Grimch ^{U! E! WAT!} 04:33, 26 April 2008 (BST)
5. Spam - I hate this suggestion. --The Hierophant 05:48, 26 April 2008 (BST)
6. Spam – It's practically useless anyway given the ready availability of maps. Don't make things harder for non-metagamers. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 05:15, 28 April 2008 (BST)
7. Spam - What karek said. It just doesn't seem right that for zombies to benefit from a survivor skill, they need more zombie skills. And if this change is going to happen, I don't see how you can keep arguing that MoL shouldn't allow survivor skill X. A Keep vote is a vote for zombie shopping markets.--TagUrIt 05:24, 2 May 2008 (BST)
8. Spam - As Druuu.  Billy Club Thorton  T!  RR  06:17, 3 May 2008 (BST)
9. Spam - Non meta low levels are hurt by this. - . . <== DDR Approved Editor 19:18, 6 May 2008 (BST)