Suggestion talk:20080327 Radios to "Walkie Talkies"
1st Suggestion
This is my first attempt at a suggestion, I tried to follow the guide lines/suggestions as closely as possible. If I have made any errors please let me know so I don't make any repeat mistakes. Thanks--Airborne88
T|Z.Quiz|PSS 17:09, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
- All keeps so far! HURRAH! but we still have to wait for funt :( --/~Rakuen~\Talk
I Still Love Grim 19:27, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
- Holy Shit, Funt voted Keep :O --/~Rakuen~\Talk I Still Love Grim 19:29, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
- And agreed with me. Man thats weird, normally its me saying As Funt --RosslessnessWant a Location Image? 20:03, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
- It's been a few months since I last saw Funt vote keep...Wow. Just wow. --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ #nerftemplatedsigs 20:06, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
- And agreed with me. Man thats weird, normally its me saying As Funt --RosslessnessWant a Location Image? 20:03, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
- Holy Shit, Funt voted Keep :O --/~Rakuen~\Talk
To explain more clearly: Zombies have the ability to disrupt communications by destroying a generator or radio, this nerfs that zombie ability. Tho if this got in my next suggestion would be to remove mobiles from the game as a useless item. - Pardus 08:01, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
- I disagree. Learn to sign and indent your posts properly. No soup for you.--Airborne88
T|Z.Quiz|PSS 08:57, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
- Maybe explain why you disagree instead of nitpicking on the formatting of things ? Even though I like the idea lot, I have to agree with Pardus on this one. Zombies wouldn't be able to prevent harmanz from communicating on a relatively large scale anymore. If you haven't yet, would you please take the time to think about this, since it may affect the gameplay a lot ? With your suggestion implemented in the game, survivors would be able to broadcast from anywhere on the map as long as they do not drop their radios – and they probably never will. – SadYear 09:14, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
- I was just kidding about the formating thing, was on my way to bed and didn't have time to explain my disagreement. I do now though. Zombies can still disrupt vital city wide communication the same way they always do: destroying transmitters. Hand held radios only allow for 10X10 radius of communication to survivors who "happen to be on the same frequency". Depending on where the survivors is standing, most of the time will not even cover a whole suburb with their transmission (percentage is going to bleed into the next suburb). Cell phones are still a vital form of communication in that they provide "secure" city wide communication. Radios though they don't require a generator or a phone mast to work are "unsecured" communications and prone to interception. One of the Survivor's worst enemies is new players "spilling the beans". What is to say that zombies don't just carry tons of radios each set to a different frequency? (it is one of the few items zombies can actually use) Between just a few zombies you would be able to intercept the vast majority of Human communications, and due to the short range of of walkie talkies it would be relevant information because the transmissions would be the status of what was w/in 10 square blocks. How many zombie payers have ever wondered which EHB building was worthy of attacking? Of course some newbie is going to wander into a safe house where a strike team is, and the first thing they are going to do is transmit, "OMG! Everybody get over to [12,34] right now!! There are 50 Death Dealers getting ready to retake Caiger Mall!! OMG! Hurry! Oh, and the doors are only at loosely barricaded to fool the stupid Zeds!! Ha! They are so dumb! WOoT!" I believe that the radio improvement is very balanced and a perk for all who play UD, tactics on both sides would have to evolve. I think it is important to note as well that this an item that realistically should already exist. Every police officer, paramedic, and fireman carries some form of "walkie talkie". I could go the electronics store at my local mall and have over 10 different types of "walkie talkies" to choose from ranging from $20 to over $1,000. In conclusion I think if you really think about it, this change doesn't nerf cell phones or the current transmitters and it would be a big plus and big minus for zombies and humans. Like everything, tactics would just have to be worked out. --Airborne88T|Z.Quiz|PSS 19:20, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
- Thanks for the deeper explanation you provided here. It clarifies what kind of balancing you were thinking about when you wrote this suggestion. I'm still wondering whether it'd be a good change for the game or not, though. – SadYear 19:37, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
- You are very welcome. I have a fairly extensive background in communications and really spent about 2 weeks trying to decide how to make this suggestion and if "it would be good for the game". I decided that it would. Lots of people wanted me bump up the range, but that would infringe on the actual transmitters. Hand held radios just add another level of communications. I am never going to drop my cell phone. I have been on many ops where cell phones were the only form of communication used because they were secure.--Airborne88T|Z.Quiz|PSS 19:57, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
- I sort of thought more zombie players would be on board with idea. You know, anything to distract humans from spending their APs barricading, reviveing, and searching for ammo.--Airborne88T|Z.Quiz|PSS 20:08, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
- Just thought Id throw in my two cents seeing as how some people view this suggestion as a cell phone nerf. It will not nerf cell phones for the very same reason the main transmitter does not-THEY ARE TWO VERY DIFFERENT FORMS OF COMMUNICATION! This seems to be the one thing people have missed. Cell phones are meant to be a form of private, city wide communication between two, and only two, players. Radios are meant for mass communication to co-ordinate siege defenses, organize rebuilding efforts, etc. With radios however, you run the risk of anybody tuning in and listening-such as enemies or even zombie spies. You do not run that risk with cell phones. If you want to communicate in private with a friend halfway across the city, you will still have to use a cell phone. This suggestion will not affect their currrent usage, or lack thereof. Remember, the real reason cell phones currently arent used much is because of outside forums! Not radios. Think about it-on a forum you can send a private message to a friend that no one else will see, without spending any in-game action points. The blame for the lack of cell phone usage cant be attributed to radios, or the walkie talkies in this suggestion. Outside meta-gaming is to fault for that. Good luck getting that removed!--Dr Doom86
T PSS 20:57, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
- Just thought Id throw in my two cents seeing as how some people view this suggestion as a cell phone nerf. It will not nerf cell phones for the very same reason the main transmitter does not-THEY ARE TWO VERY DIFFERENT FORMS OF COMMUNICATION! This seems to be the one thing people have missed. Cell phones are meant to be a form of private, city wide communication between two, and only two, players. Radios are meant for mass communication to co-ordinate siege defenses, organize rebuilding efforts, etc. With radios however, you run the risk of anybody tuning in and listening-such as enemies or even zombie spies. You do not run that risk with cell phones. If you want to communicate in private with a friend halfway across the city, you will still have to use a cell phone. This suggestion will not affect their currrent usage, or lack thereof. Remember, the real reason cell phones currently arent used much is because of outside forums! Not radios. Think about it-on a forum you can send a private message to a friend that no one else will see, without spending any in-game action points. The blame for the lack of cell phone usage cant be attributed to radios, or the walkie talkies in this suggestion. Outside meta-gaming is to fault for that. Good luck getting that removed!--Dr Doom86
- I sort of thought more zombie players would be on board with idea. You know, anything to distract humans from spending their APs barricading, reviveing, and searching for ammo.--Airborne88
- You are very welcome. I have a fairly extensive background in communications and really spent about 2 weeks trying to decide how to make this suggestion and if "it would be good for the game". I decided that it would. Lots of people wanted me bump up the range, but that would infringe on the actual transmitters. Hand held radios just add another level of communications. I am never going to drop my cell phone. I have been on many ops where cell phones were the only form of communication used because they were secure.--Airborne88
- I can confirm that some zeds carry loads of radios - mine does. However it can't be all that popular because I've never heard anyone else complain about the fact that you can only carry 16 of them (which is inconsistent with their encumbrance.) --Explodey 17:44, 9 April 2008 (BST)
- Thanks for the deeper explanation you provided here. It clarifies what kind of balancing you were thinking about when you wrote this suggestion. I'm still wondering whether it'd be a good change for the game or not, though. – SadYear 19:37, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
Response to RayHanley's suggestion to create a new item: I had considered that, but I came to the conclusion that it would create a fairly complicated situation having 2 very similar items. If Walkie Talkies were to become a new item it would nerf the current radio receiver. Both items would be able to receive the same transmissions thereby leaving no incentive to carry a radio receiver. If I were to "tweek" the specs of the walkie talkie (IE: needs batteries/ heavy item/ ect) it would result in too much confusion having 2 such similar items. I think the scope of the current suggestion is well within reason, fairly simple enough for the average player, and balanced.--Airborne88T|Z.Quiz|PSS 21:44, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
- Another thing to point out in regards to creating a new item: if that were done, it would lower search percentages for guns and ammo inside of PD's! If you add a new walkie talkie item, rather than simply convert the old radio over, it creates another thing to be found inside of Police Departments, thus diluting your chances of finding pistol clips and shotgun shells. The more logical conclusion is simply to change the handheld radio, as search percentages will remain the same and not be messed with.--Dr Doom86 T PSS 23:08, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
- That is the central point of my suggestion. Simplicity. The more you try to change the more ripples you see elsewhere in the game. Walkie Talkies don't really nerf anything, they just add a little depth to the game and some flavor. Cell phones and stationary transmitters retain all of their usefulness and individual perks. Walkie talkies don't give any major buff to any one side either. I tried to keep this very simple because I want to actually see it happen. Right now it is not that had for Kevan to modify radios to transmit and it is a simple enough change that it won't confuse all the players. --Airborne88T|Z.Quiz|PSS 23:34, 28 March 2008 (UTC)
- That is the central point of my suggestion. Simplicity. The more you try to change the more ripples you see elsewhere in the game. Walkie Talkies don't really nerf anything, they just add a little depth to the game and some flavor. Cell phones and stationary transmitters retain all of their usefulness and individual perks. Walkie talkies don't give any major buff to any one side either. I tried to keep this very simple because I want to actually see it happen. Right now it is not that had for Kevan to modify radios to transmit and it is a simple enough change that it won't confuse all the players. --Airborne88
In addition to various other objections... This is realism >< more fun. And... radio stations are usually at most regional, i.e. serve a few suburbs; mostly they serve a single suburb. Which means that walkie-talkies totally duplicate the functionality of transmitters as they are usually used in the game. And, as I've said, cells are what you use for hand held, mobile communications -- mobile phones!! ... IMO Cell phones need a buff, not radios. And, finally, these walkie talkies need to power of any sort, apparently.. BAAAAD IDEA. --WanYao 02:20, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
- As noted above, the main competetion with cell phones is not the radio, but metagaming (forums and even this wiki). How would you buff cell phones to make them able to compete with that?
Swiers 02:40, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
- If there is such a problem with cell phones (mine works just fine), perhaps you should make a cell phone buff suggestion and let "walkie talkies" stand on its own promise. Lets not get into comparing shotguns to fire axes.--Airborne88T|Z.Quiz|PSS 05:30, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
- such buffs have already been suggested. mainly, i'm thinking the ability to send the same text to multiple people on your contacts. that alone would be huge, and make them worth using. maybe it's a bit overpowered, dunno.. but it's an idea... and, i think that one is already in peer reviewed somewhere. --WanYao 09:29, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
- moreover... i just don't like this suggestion... i believe radios and transmitters are fine as they are, i don't want to see them changed. especially not in the way you suggest, which is totally overpowered -- i've explained why i think that... and provided an alternative, which is not so overpowered, i.e. a small cell phone buff. sorry if you don't like fact i don't like your suggestion... well actually no i'm not, i've explained myself well, i'm happy. --WanYao 09:34, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
- I am not unhappy with you at all. I am glad you continue to come back and explain your reasons for not liking the suggestion. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, just because we don't see eye to eye is no reason for me to be "unhappy" with you. I have tried to defend my position as best I can and if still disagree, that's ok.--Airborne88T|Z.Quiz|PSS 22:20, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
- I am not unhappy with you at all. I am glad you continue to come back and explain your reasons for not liking the suggestion. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, just because we don't see eye to eye is no reason for me to be "unhappy" with you. I have tried to defend my position as best I can and if still disagree, that's ok.--Airborne88
- If there is such a problem with cell phones (mine works just fine), perhaps you should make a cell phone buff suggestion and let "walkie talkies" stand on its own promise. Lets not get into comparing shotguns to fire axes.--Airborne88
I find it useless for zombies to be able to broadcast on them. Just imagine this:
28.01 MHz: “Mrh?”
Survivor said, “Who needs revived?”
28.01 MHz: “Mrh?”
Survivor said, “Where are you?”
28.01 MHz: “Mrh?”
Survivor said, “WTF, man!? Dude, like, seriously, WTF??? How the hell am I supposed to revive you if I don’t know who you are or where you’re at?”
28.01 MHz: “Mrh?”
Survivor said, “FAK off, pal. I can’t help you. Go away.”
28.01 MHz: “Mrh?”
And even the Death Rattlers would have a hard time giving specific directions for things, and would mostly just use the walkie talkies to either taunt (without being able to back it up since they don’t have any AP left to enter buildings) or spam the area where a siege is just to interfere with communications. Really, the zombie use of it is quite useless, and I find it hard to believe they could even fumble around with all the little buttons and dials. Might as well let them use firearms and Free Run with their new-found dexterity. Please remove that part, and I could consider this.
Besides, spammers would have no reason to stop spamming on their transmitters and local frequencies would instead suffer constant zombie spam from local zombies.--Kolechovski 20:41, 1 April 2008 (BST)
- I think the zombies being able to transmit is intended more for fun purposes. Sure its not really going to help them tactically, but its just something that might add a bit more entertainment to playing a zombie, which quite frankly is pretty boring. Also, its only at 25% chance, so its more of an accident, rather than the zombie actually having any real type of dexterity. Airborne, please correct me if I am wrong about the intent of your suggestion. Thanks!--Dr Doom86 T PSS 07:45, 2 April 2008 (BST)
- hey dude's, i really like where all of this is going, it gave me the idea to change how cell coverage works, check my talk page and leave some input! maybe collectively we can all put something together that hits a midle ground. -- Jack S13 T! PC 16:34, 2 April 2008 (BST)
- I just said that it might get radio spamers to reduce their area of influance. They can and are doing it right now, so this would just be an "incentive" to reduce those effected by them. Maybe the zombie percentage should be lowered a little bit, but I see no reason they can't transmit as well. They can't really communicate with them so eventually it would ust be random that you would hear a zombie on your channel. I still believe cell phone are not nerfed. They are city wide secure personnel communication. --Airborne88T|Z.Quiz|PSS 07:00, 3 April 2008 (BST)
- I just said that it might get radio spamers to reduce their area of influance. They can and are doing it right now, so this would just be an "incentive" to reduce those effected by them. Maybe the zombie percentage should be lowered a little bit, but I see no reason they can't transmit as well. They can't really communicate with them so eventually it would ust be random that you would hear a zombie on your channel. I still believe cell phone are not nerfed. They are city wide secure personnel communication. --Airborne88
- hey dude's, i really like where all of this is going, it gave me the idea to change how cell coverage works, check my talk page and leave some input! maybe collectively we can all put something together that hits a midle ground. -- Jack S13 T! PC 16:34, 2 April 2008 (BST)
it would only effect cells, so i guess it is like nextel. the idea would increase the range and effectiveness of phone masts, and as a result make cells a more usefull iitem, i've added it to the suggestions talk, help and editing page, if you want to take a look --Jack S13 T! PC 21:50, 7 April 2008 (BST)
So anyhow, since area frequencies would still be in-tact, this wouldn't change the distance thing a whole lot (except those attempting to mass broadcast in an area where no transmitters exist, but they'll likely be dead in such a situation, because the only reason no transmitters would be functioning is due to zombie wipe-out), so it's basically just meaning that transmitters are no longer needed since everyone will just pick up a walkie-talkie for the most part, right? This would basically mean that only resource buildings get lit for the most part, which saves survivors a tremendous hassle, right?--Kolechovski 03:56, 9 April 2008 (BST)
- You are asking me to "see the future". I am sorry I can't do that. I do know that this item would have a very subtly effect the game. Tactics would have to evolve on all sides. Will survivors choose to abandon transmitters for short range commo?? Who knows. With this suggestion, each communication item has its own unique benefit and downfall. How it is implemented is up to the players. I do think it would not have any tremendous advantage/disadvantage either way.--Airborne88T|Z.Quiz|PSS 04:09, 9 April 2008 (BST)
