User:Aichon/Archive 2011

Aichon:Talk Archive 2011

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Aichon

ˈīˌkän :Talk Archive 2011

Announcement: I'm no longer active. My talk page is still your best bet to get in touch. —Aichon— 04:39, 15 December 2018 (UTC)

This is an archive. Don't post here.

If you have anything you'd like to add to one of these conversations, then go to my talk page, reference the relevant conversation from here, and post your comments there. This page should not be edited by others. These are all messages I've filed away. They shouldn't be changed or added to, since the contexts of the situations have been lost, forgotten, or could simply be remembered differently by the involved parties. I'd prefer to start any of these conversations fresh, if they must come up again.

Archives: 2018 | 2017 | 2016 | 2015 | 2014 | 2013 | 2012 | 2011 | 2010 | 2009 | To do

No!!!!!!!

-MHSstaff 03:41, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

Lol. Like I said in the edit summary when I posted that, I'll likely be around for a few more weeks, but I didn't want to take anyone by surprise, so I'm posting it now. —Aichon— 05:33, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

You'll be sorely missed around here when you go, Aichon. I like the way you're stepping out, though. Like you're weening us all off slowly. Good luck with the degree and all and be sure to poke your head in from time-to-time and check in on us. From one Texan to another, farewell. ~ 05:56, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

I like to ease out of places most of the time since there are less questions. Plus, I don't have anything else at the moment to fill in the time I've been spending here, so that'll likely keep me coming back for a bit. If you ever find yourself in College Station, let me know so I can treat you to lunch/dinner. And who knows where I'll end up come this summer? —Aichon— 06:10, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

I have a cousin graduating at A&M this summer so I might be able to take you up on that if you'll be there. ~ 06:25, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

Well, if things go well, I'm afraid I won't be here, but we'll see. —Aichon— 07:08, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

A sad day indeed. -- Spiderzed▋ 13:49, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

Don't worry, nobody ever leaves the wiki. Just ask me. Linkthewindow  Talk  06:50, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, same thing happens to old message boards I left years ago. I'm sure I'll be around. ;) —Aichon— 07:08, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

another post I note, I know you couldn't leave whilst people continue to make random statements on the wiki! --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 18:43, 7 January 2011 (UTC)

Almost sounds like you're trying to get rid of me. :P Anyway, I said I'd be around for another few weeks, and I meant it. While my contribs may have dropped off, I'm still lurking almost as much as ever. —Aichon— 18:48, 7 January 2011 (UTC)

Not at all, a lurking Aichon is better than users who post on everything regardless, and the feedback from ex sops is really appreciated on the various promotion bids. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 18:56, 7 January 2011 (UTC)

How bad would a

single 54-case switch be as far as tree-hugging, terrorist-supporting wiki page magic inclusion things be? Would it kill the FA page?-MHSstaff 23:11, 19 January 2011 (UTC)

It'd actually be a 108 case switch statements (54 for current and 54 for previous), and it wouldn't be that bad. Each case would basically just have the unique portion of the link to each FA blurb, which would likely just be a few characters long, and anything that was common to the link could be put before or after the switch in the template so that it didn't have to get repeated 108 times. Shouldn't even be close to page-breaking if done right, but I'd suggest sandboxing it first to make sure anyway. —Aichon— 05:23, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Here is what I am thinking. A master switch template that calls one of 54 pre-generated templates based on the number of FA articles we have. Those templates then get the correct FA article based on the current week. I basically have a program that spits out the wiki code so its just a matter of copying and pasting. Here is the 17-article version for example, and here is a 43 article version. Here is sorta what the main template would like, and here is where I am calling it. This way, you wouldn't have to update as you voted in new articles. You just change the number of articles (nofa) variable in the page calling main driver template, make a new FA blurb page, and the main template picks the right one for cycling. What changes should be made? I can update the code to spit out the version with your suggestions but there is no point in copying and pasting it until we have something we all like. -MHSstaff 19:16, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Otherwise, you would have to edit the cases in the template each time you add in articles so the new ones will get called during their week, which would kinda suck. -MHSstaff 19:33, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

This was pretty much exactly what I had in mind when I had some time to wrap my brain around it. The only change I would make is to have a page (or template) which contains the nofo variable. User then just creates a new blurb and updates the page with number of variables and wiki magic does the rest. ~ 19:43, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

I know exactly what you are saying, but I am not sure what that page would look like. Do you have an example?-MHSstaff 19:49, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

It would be a low content page. It's only content would be number of articles. That page is then transcluded on User:MHSstaff/Projects/TestingGrounds4 after the nofa variable. It would just save people from having to edit the main template which is doing the work. I guess it's not really necessary but might make things as simple for editors as it can possibly get. ~ 19:58, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Also, we wouldn't need 54 templates. Since there are already 18 articles, we could start there and go up to 54. Since only one of these templates would be in use at any given time, we'd need to have an ark to keep them off the scheduled deletion list. When a new article is added, the unnecessary template should be deleted.

I keep trying to think of a way of getting around creating 36 new templates but can't wrap my brain around it. ~ 20:26, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

It's easier to just mass create them at the beginning using a code, copy/paste, and store them in an ark IMO. Doing these by hand each time would be a pain. Plus with the prefix variable, it could be used for other things so there is really no penalty to having them already made-MHSstaff 20:33, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

No need to ark them, since they shouldn't be speedy deleted. They all have a purpose after all, and unlike images, which get deleted if they go unused, articles do not automatically get deleted. Anyway, I like the general idea, but having to have multiple different templates (e.g. 17, 43, x) seems like a lot of work.

Honestly, all of our solutions will work out worse than what we currently have, in my opinion, since all of them will end up repeating some articles before they are supposed to be repeated (e.g. we may end the year on FA8 and will then start the new year over again, losing FA9+ for a cycle), and will involve having to edit multiple pages when adding new FA. What we have now works, and it's even easier now that we've gone through the whole FA list, since all you have to do is cut/paste the last blurb up to the top of the FA page and then move the old ones down a notch. Why don't we just focus on making that process easier, rather than trying to automate the whole shebang? —Aichon— 20:40, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

For me, it is going to be used to rotate MHS content every week or so. But if you want to keep on truckin' with a)creating a new FA schedule everytime a new FA is added, actually having users remember to stick by that schedule, and copy/pasting blurbs every two weeks, that's cool too. If the current system is working, we're probably best off not worring about it then.-MHSstaff 21:10, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

You shall be incredibly proud

Got Chrome. :D --Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 08:09, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Sweet! It'll take some getting used to, but you should notice the speed it has going for it, as well as the fact that it just does some things most of the others don't (e.g. it actually displays my name correctly at the top of this page, whereas none of the others besides Safari does that).—Aichon— 15:17, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Yep. I've installed it on my new laptop, and I'm trying to slowly make myself use it on here instead of IE. --Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 15:47, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Your signature is awesome, btw.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 16:40, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Don't I know it! A shame that more people can't see it as it's meant to be seen. It's best if you have the Cochin font installed too. —Aichon— 17:07, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

What is happening with the signature? Is it going woop! woop! and flashing and stuff?--_GANG Giles Sednik _CAPD 11:44, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

Much more subtle than that. Get a real browser and you can see the difference. ;) —Aichon— 11:45, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

BASEPAGENAME

Hey, I thought you'd be a pretty good person to ask. I'm wondering why {{BASEPAGENAME}} doesn't really seem to work on some pages. For example, if the magic word is placed on Fight Factory/Nav, it returns Fight Factory/Nav instead of Fight Factory like I would expect. The help section mentions that {{BASEPAGENAME}} only works on namespaces that have subpages enabled. It leads me to believe that pages in the main space do not have subpages enabled. Do you think that's the case? My eventual goal is to create some subcategories of some inclusion only pages that I use for groups I'm involved in and I'd like the group name to be the subcategory name. Hope that makes since. See here for one of my attempts [1]. ~ 06:47, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, I don't believe subpages are enabled in the main namespace, which basically means that, technically, X/Y is a page named "X/Y" (hence the BASEPAGENAME issues) rather than a page Y that is a subpage of X. You can tell because if you go to something like User:Aichon/Other, Other will have a link near the top that will take you back to User:Aichon, whereas similar behavior doesn't happen in the main namespace.

Anyway, since I'm beyond tired after researching companies for a career fair today, I'll just point you in a few directions. One is that you might look at [[Category:CAT_NAME|GROUP_NAME]] to do stuff. Not sure if it helps. The other is Template:Subcat, which you can see in use here. It may be useful. I'll let you poke through those and see what works, but it should still be doable, though you'll likely not be able to use the magic words. You might also ping DDR or Rooster, since they both have significantly more categorization wiki-fu than I do. I always left that stuff alone since it was messy and hard to see. —Aichon— 11:57, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

Sig

What's your issue with it? I know that some people have trouble with the special characters. And Trips complained once about the green-on-black colour scheme. -- Spiderzed▋ 20:35, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

I just think it looks tacky. Purely aesthetic reasons. The monospaced green on black is not something I'm a fan of, nor do I particularly like the box-like shapes around names in sigs, unless it's just an outline rather than filled in. You don't actually have to change it (maybe I should add that note to A/PM, since it wasn't entirely clear I was kidding), but for some reason I kinda always cringe whenever I see it. I really have no idea why I dislike it as much as I do. —Aichon— 20:40, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Being a fan of old home computers, I actually like the retro-look of monospaced green on black. I might slightly adjust the tone, but it wouldn't be the same if it was only done with an outline. The black box is also needed to replicate the FU logo with text. (And using solely text is important to me, as I dislike pictures in sigs, and as pictures in sigs have occassionally caused trouble as with Mis' and DDR's sig for a while.) For the other group links it's not so much needed, but I still used boxes for them to make them look more similar. As for the kidding, I figured as much. -- Spiderzed▋ 20:48, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

What exactly is the FU text? Is that unicode? Foreign language chartacters? I've always wondered. ~ 20:53, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

The FU text is done with Unicode block elements. You might remember some of them if you are old enough to have worked with text-based pseudo-graphical interfaces as Norton Commander. -- Spiderzed▋ 21:26, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, I know you're going for the retro look. ;) Still though, I'm just not a fan, but I know that you can't please everyone, it'd definitely lose its retro feel if you went with an outline, and I'm being rather uncompromising here, which is not fair to you at all. I certainly appreciate that last fact, so I'm not actually advocating you change your sig. I'm just giving you a tough time while I can. As for images in sigs, DDR and Mis were both using old code (an experimental copy of a new version of Template:Click that I had made) that had been obsoleted because of the problems it had. Had they been using the newer code (the current Template:Click), there wouldn't have been any issues. —Aichon— 21:01, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Random beginnings

It's only fair that as I start to go inactive I take a long look back at my time here. I was glancing through the history for my talk page, and I noticed that I got quite varied introductions from some of the typical wiki personalities around here, which, in many ways, ended up being indicative of my later interactions with them. In order of appearance, here are 30 of them:

1. August 2009: Yonn WN'd me. His first real post on the page wasn't until January of 2010, however, when he hit me up for GSGM 2010 info.
2. October 2009: Giles clarified something I had misunderstood when working on the update to the barricade plan template (my first wiki project).
3. October 2009: Ross wanted to talk about large-AP repairs and then thanked me for being sensible during a (N)POV dispute on a suburb page involving one of my groups.
4. October 2009: Rory complimented me on my then-new page design (it wasn't nearly as good as it is now).
5. October 2009: SA chimed in with random comments regarding page theft. <3 SA.
6. November 2009: Lelouch wanted to find out how I had discovered his secret society on the wiki.
7. November 2009: Midianian asked if I wanted to adopt his userscripts.
8. November 2009: AHLG complimented Macs.
9. November 2009: DDR expressed his love for DOTA. And then he referred to my brother as a faggot indirectly. <3 DDR too.
10. November 2009: Read offered an insightful and helpful comment suggested SA and I start dating.
11. November 2009: J3D was the first user to have a comment deleted from my page.
12. November 2009: Maverick came by to compliment my user page by letting me know he was stealing some of it.
13. December 2009: Bob made a joke and offered a quick encouragement that I may be a decent person for sysop eventually.
14. December 2009: Iscariot dragged wiki politics about RHO's A/PM bid into the conversation.
15. January 2010: Mis apologized for making mistakes and offered me a copy of the internet as compensation for harm done. I told him I already had it.
16. January 2010: Chief Seagull offered information and suggestions for userscripts I had.
17. January 2010: Rooster chimed in with a veteran perspective on the GSGM 2010 affairs.
18. March 2010: Thad complimented my new (and currently still in-use) page design, saying that it reminded him of Assassin's Creed.
19. April 2010: Link congratulated me on my promotion to sysop.
20. April 2010: Poodle of doom asked a technical question for something relatively simple. Misanthropy sniped the answer. This happened a lot, come to think of it. Both the simple questions and the sniping.
21. May 2010: Cornholioo was uncharacteristically polite in asking a decent question. If only we knew then what we know now...
22. May 2010: Spiderzed offered some useful advice to a userscript user in need of some help.
23. June 2010: Axe gave me a cookie for fixing a sig problem he had.
24. July 2010: RHO interjected with a random comment and then disappeared.
25. July 2010: TripleU asked for a custom-coded userscript that would help him destroy all of the Christmas Trees in the game.
26. August 2010: Cheese informed me that I had acted improperly by permabanning Cornholioo when I did. Me banning people too early was a bit of a recurring theme around here...
27. September 2010: Vapor asked about an experimental template he wanted to use that I had been developing but not really publicizing.
28. September 2010: Sexualharrison asked for help after a wikicode mistake left the news on the front page in shambles.
29. October 2010: MHSstaff asked for some design help with the best newspaper in the game.
30. December 2010: Boxy finally made an appearance and informed me very politely that I had made a mistake in correcting something that I thought was a mistake.

So yeah, fun stuff. It's interesting to see who all has stopped by. There are definitely a few notable absences (e.g. I can't believe Revenant never said anything here), but it seems that my talk page has managed to attract a lot of attention while I've been around. —Aichon— 22:52, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

And may I say I am honoured to have WN'd you.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 23:03, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

I have to say, I lawled when I saw it was you that had done it to me, since I couldn't remember. —Aichon— 23:05, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

It's especially surprising, considering how few people I actually WN'd. Epic stuff though. What's the bet the other people I WN'd become sysops?--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 23:09, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Maybe you just know how to pick 'em? :D But yeah, when I saw it, it was one of those, "That's awesome. I can't believe he WN'd me." type of things. As I laughed, of course. —Aichon— 23:15, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

I also WN'd Zensaga, but nobody else notable. I'll never know who WN'd me, because it was sometime in early to mid 2008 that I got an account, and I didn't save my template anywhere. I'd like to think it was Grim or Gnome or somebody, but it was probably just some +1er. :( --Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 23:21, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

If Zensaga ever makes it as an Op (which is unlikely. He rarely uses the wiki), I claim the fact that he's only playing this game because I introduced him to it, and that includes the good ol' wiki. ;) --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 23:35, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Don't leave us, Aichon!!! We love you!!! D= --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 23:10, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Hey, attention whoring like what I'm doing here only keeps me around longer. >_> Err...did I say that out loud? —Aichon— 23:15, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

We'll give you an undeclinable promotion, then you'll have to stay! >:D--Thadeous Oakley Talk 23:26, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Looking at that list makes me sad. Man, I miss the good old days, when guys like Cyberbob, J3D, SA and even Iscariot were active. If only I wasn't such a dick back then, it would have been even better. God damn you Kevan :( --Thadeous Oakley Talk 23:31, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Aichon, if you do not stay, I will go on a hunger strike. How's would you like that to be on your conscience? ...Are you gonna eat that stapler? --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 23:35, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

So...you mean I'd actually have a chance at being the most-linked user? Maybe that would bring me back. :P —Aichon— 00:12, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Lol! Dota Rox! -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 23:34, 30 January 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, yours was another one I really laughed at. Such a wacky first series of posts here, all interjected in the middle of a massive conversation SA and I were having back then. —Aichon— 00:12, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Umm...

I was reading your talk page's archive(2010), and it appears that most of the templated sigs were copied incorrectly. It starts from here, all the way to the bottom (with a few exceptions). Sorry. (I am saying sorry because this makes me feel like some self-important noob for some reason. Sorry if I do come across as such.) -- †  talk ? f.u. 11:03, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Too many template inclusions. Its the wiki's creakyness, not aichon. --Rosslessness^{Want a Location Image?} 11:11, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

That's a relief. Much better it than him. And now I know not to include too many templates, too! -- †  talk ? f.u. 13:24, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, if you view the source for the page (as in, use your browser to actually view the HTML source for the page, not use the wiki to edit the page) and then do a search for the word "bytes", you should eventually find some commented out lines of code that will specify the "pre-expand include size", the "post-expand include size", the "template argument size", and the "maximum". If those first three sum to exceed the last one, then templates start breaking and showing up as just links. The simple way around it is to just break the page up into smaller parts, which is what a lot of folks do, but for archival purposes, I'd rather have them all together. —Aichon— 15:19, 31 January 2011 (UTC)

On another note, where can I get the thingy that lets me view someone's profile on mouseover? I think sexualharrison uses something like that. Thanks (I use chrome). -- †  talk ? f.u. 14:34, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

That's a userscript that I never really used since it doesn't work in Safari. Can't remember the name of it or where to find it, I'm afraid. —Aichon— 15:21, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

Let me be of help: It's Profile Viewer. An older version is floating around somewhere on the wiki - the linked version has been altered by me to use the current RG link, rather than the old one. -- Spiderzed▋ 15:28, 7 February 2011 (UTC)

it works fine in firefox, which i happen only to use when i play UD. i prefer safari and chrome. better integration with my mail and cal apps and what not.--

bitch 17:15 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Help with a Template

Hey Aichon, I made this template: User:Thoroaeborus/Sandbox3, and want to use it here: User:Thoroaeborus/Sandbox4. The problem is that when I add more of this template the next boxes appear below the previous one and I'd like a way to make them appear at the right side (like a map). I've tried using the span tag since this one is used at the Template:CodeInline to produce "in line" results but it didn't change anything. If you know any way to make the boxes appear one after the other, be it editing the template directly or the page where I use it, then it'll be very helpfull. Thanks ~THOROAEBORUS 01:43, 16 February 2011 (UTC)

Should be fixed for you now. The long and short of it is that CodeInline works on text because text is inherently an inline element. Tables, on the other hand, which is what you were using, are considered to be block level elements. Block level elements naturally go one under the other, unless you position them using special CSS stuff. So, I added a "float:left" to the table you were using, which tells each Sandbox3 that they should try and move as far to the left as they can, and shouldn't bump other block to the next line. After that, it was a simple matter of removing the extra line breaks you had on Sandbox4 in order to get them to show up next to each other. Hope that works for you! —Aichon— 02:03, 16 February 2011 (UTC)

It's perfect now, thank you very much! ~THOROAEBORUS 16:54, 16 February 2011 (UTC)

Your sig

Finally using Chrome, so I'm seeing your sig as I'm meant to. Not worth the installation time. 16:54, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

I doubt you have the Cochin font installed. ;) Oh, and check my name at the top of my userspace pages to see how it looks spiffy. The sig doesn't show it off much. —Aichon— 17:03, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

you sir are a wiki dragon!--

bitch 17:12 14 March 2011 (UTC)

The slight fade effect is nice but I feel like something must be missing. 17:14, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Cochin. Great font. Times, which is probably what you're seeing, isn't really a substitute for it. Otherwise, nope. I like to keep things low-key and not too flashy. —Aichon— 17:21, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Me? Nah. I don't really swoop through and do swaths of work any more. Rooster or RHO would be the wiki dragons around here, I should think. —Aichon— 17:21, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Rooster and Dragon are less active than you and became "less active" with much less style. You're therefore still residing dragon. ~ _{17:47, 14 March 2011}

But that's the nature of a WikiDragon, which is why I say they're both better dragons than I am. Personally, I'd say that I was more of a WikiGryphon back when I was more active (with a bit of WikiOgre), and am more of a WikiPrincess now at this point, though I'm a bit light on the socializing. —Aichon— 18:26, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Christ just learn to take a fucking compliment :P --

bitch 18:47 14 March 2011 (UTC)

But then I wouldn't get so much attention. ;) —Aichon— 19:18, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

So in other words, you're a WikiPlatypus. ~ _{18:58, 14 March 2011}

I figure I'm the otter. Prove me wrong. 19:00, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Not gonna hear any disagreement from me. I'd lump both you and Rev in there. —Aichon— 19:18, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Nah. Mis, you're definitely the WikiZombie kidding, kidding ~ _{19:23, 14 March 2011}

Cite your source. 19:33, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

*whistles*. ~ _{20:00, 14 March 2011}

Not a Platypus. The WikiPlatypus doesn't know why it does what it does, whereas the Gryphon changes as the need arises. —Aichon— 19:18, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

YOU'RE ALL WIKICATS! WE ALL AREEEEEE -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 06:57, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

coding ?

how do I get rid of the white crap around my header box?--

bitch 19:03 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Fixed. You had left in a 10px padding on either side of it. 19:09, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

WikiJaguar too. You, that is. Me too, I suppose. —Aichon— 19:21, 14 March 2011 (UTC)

Suburb Template

Thesis break? -

MHSstaff 02:04, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

More or less. Glanced at RC, saw your edits regarding TBD (I have my guesses what that's about, incidentally, but if it's what I think it is, I don't want to spoil it for everyone else), saw Neko's edits to add DEM to some suburb group listings, rage meter filled at additional blatant suburb group listing abuses and examples of guideline inattentiveness, and I went on a purge. Also, the code for your new sig is annoying. You can put it all in one line instead of being like that. :P —Aichon— 02:08, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

How close? I have a chapter and a half left for mine. :) UD makes for a good break sometimes.-

MHSstaff 02:10, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

Not really close, honestly. The writing doesn't worry me so much as just the research itself, which is progressing finally. I've actually written a thesis-length paper in a night before (not that I would EVER do that again, since I literally suffered ill effects from doing so and took about a week to recover physically), and I've been teaching writing as a TA (not that I ever show any semblance of writing skill when online) while writing regular reports for my advisor, so writing doesn't scare me that much these days. —Aichon— 02:16, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

oh fuck off

The first thing I did when getting firefox 4 was jump to your userpage. Still no beautiful shading ;_; -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 13:10, 24 March 2011 (UTC)

Well, I'd have to recode it to support Firefox anyway, since the code isn't even there for it to work with Firefox, but the bigger issue is that Firefox still doesn't have code that does what I want anyway. WebKit browsers work because they have three things:

1. The ability to make an alpha mask from an image
2. The ability to create a gradient from code
3. The ability to treat the gradient from code as an image

Last time I checked it, Firefox didn't have #2 or #3, but apparently FF 3.5 added support for #2. Unfortunately, however, Firefox still lacks #3. Their solution to the third is to tell people to use SVG, which I think is a rather hackneyed workaround, rather than a good solution. There might be some weird ways that it can be coerced into working (using a double background, setting the transparency gradient on the background, making the text transparent, and then masking the background in the shape of the text maybe?), but I can't be bothered to try something that convoluted. —Aichon— 16:28, 24 March 2011 (UTC)

thnx

wish you had shown up 10 minutes earlier. ;) ~ _{01:34, 28 March 2011}

Yeah, I was looking through the changes you made to the template, saw that you had re-used the historic code, and was wondering about whether or not it would break anything. Checked a few suburbs and they looked fine, but then checked another and realized that the first ones had looked fine because you had already edited them. At that point, I just figured it would be fun to make you get a whole lot of "This page has been edited..." messages. :P —Aichon— 01:37, 28 March 2011 (BST)

Gee thanks :D. I got to New Arkham and when I got to the edit page I pasted |other and realized it was already there. I know I hadn't gotten that far so I check RC. Figured you were just lending a hand. Little did I know you were just fucking with me ;). ~ _{01:47, 28 March 2011}

See, that's why I was able to do so many so quickly. Sounds like you do them one at a time, when the real trick is to use Safari (because Chrome handles tab ordering poorly for stuff like this, unless you use extensions), open every suburb in a separate tab, then open each suburb group listing in a new tab while closing the suburb pages, then editing each one in a new tab while closing the listings, then submitting them to a new tab while closing the edit windows. You never have to wait for a single page load after the first one, which means that you can be done just as fast as you can click around and copy/paste. Of course, it makes it easier for people to interfere, since you have them open for longer before getting to them and leaves a window for them to be edited, but your throughput is much higher, even if people mess with you.

And yeah, originally I thought that you had just missed a few suburbs, so I did a few on the second to last row of the city, but then I realized you were going through them in geographic order. Mis and I typically do them in alphabetical order whenever we do stuff like this, hence why I had only done a few before the last row, but once I saw what you were doing, I just went ahead and did the whole last row quickly, figuring I could beat you to the punch for fun. —Aichon— 01:57, 28 March 2011 (BST)

I'll keep the tab thing in mind the next time I take on a suburb project, though I get a distinct feeling that you're just trying to push chrome on me. How much is google paying you to pimp their warez?~ _{02:21, 28 March 2011}

I said don't use Chrome since it creates tabs in the wrong order (it uses tab grouping, which isn't good for tasks like these). :P I'm actually anti-Chrome for ideological reasons now, ever since they removed h.264 support in order to further their business pursuits. It's still a technically excellent browser, but I don't recommend it as much these days. —Aichon— 02:28, 28 March 2011 (BST)

The SA Link

Honestly, probably just GANKBUS members, many of which are also permanently banned users. It should also be noted that while groups like GANKBUS did exist, and a lot of harassment went back and forth between Amazing and users like User:Rueful, User:Jjames, and User:Scinfaxi he also frequently did stuff like this that helped give groups like ASS, which included many well respected wikizens like User:BobHammaro, User:Xoid, User:Gage and even User:Axe_Hack to bring it home. Those disputes were the initial reason civility and user page policies first came up. But, only one of his many bans came from that stuff. --Karek^maps?! 08:28, 7 April 2011 (BST)

^The reply I was posting as the page got protected. --Karek^maps?! 08:28, 7 April 2011 (BST)

Oopsies. That had to have been a hell of an edit conflict. ~ _{14:45, 7 April 2011}

It doesn't even give you an edit conflict when it's been protected, just runs straight to View Source actually. --Karek^maps?! 16:24, 7 April 2011 (BST)

Thought You Might Appreciate These

Just thought I'd pass along some reading on gradient properties and CSS3. Hopefully it'll, at worst, be interesting and at best it could help with getting your header and sig cross-browser consistent.

The first one here is a comparison chart that shows the different gradients and their code comparisons for Webkit and Gecko(mozilla). The second is a W3 editors draft article on CSS3 Images. --Karek^{maps 2.0?!} 05:59, 18 April 2011 (BST)

Sweet. I knew some more work had been done on them since I had set that up in the first place, and it's definitely good to see that gradients are being officially adopted. One problem that still exists, however, is that Mozilla doesn't seem to support the use of code as an input to alpha masks, which is what I am/was doing with Webkit. I suppose I could kinda fake it by creating a gradient that would mimic those colors on a white background, but it wouldn't be the same on other backgrounds, and it'd take twice as much code since I'd have to apply it separately to the "Aich" and "on" due to their different coloration. Still though, I view it as a matter of time before it becomes possible. —Aichon— 14:48, 18 April 2011 (BST)

Would giving your siggie a white background not do the trick? √^¶°® ™ _{15:07, 18 April 2011}

Depends what you mean by "the trick". If you mean, "look different than it does now, but have it consistent on all pages for all browsers", yes. If you mean, "look the same as it does now, and have it consistent across browsers and pages," no. What that'd do is add a white background to the text on darker background pages, whereas before I had a slight effect of the bottom half of my letters blending into the background, regardless of color. Anyway, I've pulled the code from my sig in order to increase contrast, make it leaner, and make it uniform across browsers and the least compromising way possible, so it's a moot point now. —Aichon— 15:22, 18 April 2011 (BST)

Was referring to your comment about faking the gradient but looking inconsistent on different colored backgrounds. It sounds like faking it will drastically change the look, though which seems like something you don't really want to do. FWIW, I think your sig looks great now, even when viewed on my Android tablet. √^¶°® ™ _{15:37, 18 April 2011}

Well, faking the gradient would keep it looking the same, so long as the background is white. On darker backgrounds, it would give it a glow effect as it went towards the bottom of the letters. A white background would fix that problem, but it would mean adding a white background, which would compromise the appearance in an entirely different way. —Aichon— 19:56, 18 April 2011 (BST)

Is Template:BB3currcolor still needed?

Hi, just thought I'd ask if you still have need for this template, or is it okay to post it to Speedy Deletions?--The General ^{T Sys U! P! F!} 17:58, 19 April 2011 (BST)

I've put it back into use as an inclusion in the place that it used to go and would prefer it not get placed on A/SD. While BB3 isn't active, if BB4 comes around someday, I'd like all of those template pieces to still be in place for them to use, that way they don't have to reinvent the wheel. —Aichon— 19:20, 19 April 2011 (BST)

Barrista

Does anybody have any advice for fixing this issue I am having? I'm on Win7 64x Ultimate using up to date Chrome (Same issue on Firefox).
Here's how my Barrista looks: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16374016/Barrista%20Issue.png
Here's how it should look: http://www.aichon.com/dumpbox/ud_userscripts/screenshots/udbarrista3.png
How can I fix my spacing/change the font so that it will look correct? I really want to use Barrista. (Ohh sorry, I missed that it was oldest to newest. Also not used to using wikis, sorry for not signing.) --Ashenden 18:29, 3 May 2011 (BST)

Hmm. Looks like your fonts are a smidge off some reason, and I can't reproduce the issue in my copy of Chrome. While I don't know what the problem is, I think I can do an easy fix for it, but since I can't test it on my end, you'll just have to try it out yourself. Try installing this version that I made for you. It changes the line heights for all of those chopped off lines to hopefully alleviate the problem. They may need to be moved up or down a bit more or less, since I had to use your screenshot to take a guess at what the proper amount was. And for all I know, it may not work at all. Let me know how it looks, and send me a screenshot if it looks different but isn't fixed completely. I can't promise I can fix it, and I don't have time at the moment for anything involved, but if it's simple, I can try to help. —Aichon— 20:07, 3 May 2011 (BST)

Worked like a charm, everything looks great now. Wonder what's up with my fonts. Ah well, thank you for such a quick reply and fix. Here's a screenshot of it. http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16374016/BarristaFix.png --Ashenden 00:00, 4 May 2011 (BST)

Orphaned Images

File:Soc troops.png which you uploaded is currently unused and is subject to deletion if it is older than two weeks. If you wish to ensure that it remains on this wiki then you will need to ensure that it is included in at least one page on this wiki..--Thegeneralbot 22:44, 5 May 2011 (BST)

Feel free to delete it. I left a note to that effect on the page for the image when I orphaned it a few weeks back. I had figured it'd just get cleaned up without any hassle, but I was too lazy to A/SD it. —Aichon— 04:45, 6 May 2011 (BST)

Your A/D Comment

lol.--Yonnua Koponen ^{T G P} ^^^ 10:34, 15 May 2011 (BST)

I'd respond, but I can't figure out where your comment ends and the next line begins. >_> —Aichon— 14:34, 15 May 2011 (BST)

Super lol. We need you back in ops so I can be your op meatpuppet. -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 14:55, 15 May 2011 (BST)

No need for me to be back as a sysop. Just ask yourself the simple question, "What would Aichon do, given this particular situation, the context surrounding it, the history of the interactions between the involved individuals, all with a perspective towards doing what is in the best interest of the wiki, while also seeking to not set a precedent that could be used in a dangerous manner in the future." I like to abbreviate it for simplicity: WWADGTPSTCSITHOTIBTIIAWAPTDWIITBIOTWWASTNSAPTCBUIADMITF. With that simple acronym, anyone can determine exactly how I would make a decision! —Aichon— 18:55, 15 May 2011 (BST)

That sounds like . I prefer W.W.E.D. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 01:29, 9 June 2011 (BST)

Eris? —Aichon— 05:36, 9 June 2011 (BST)

Your AP War Article

Seems misleading. I'm assuming your math is based on your own personal experience because the syringe find rate is much higher than 8%(12AP), even pre-the Dead increase. Here's the last empirical looking data I can find on it. It kinda completely changes your numbers on combat reviving. Especially when I can almost guarantee that they're over 12% and have been since 2007/6. Just thought you might appreciate the feedback. --Karek^{maps 2.0?!} 07:30, 22 May 2011 (BST)

I think I went off of this (i.e. basically what you linked), or I may have had some other source entirely. I can't remember where I grabbed those numbers from, but I didn't produce them from my own research, and I do remember that they came from the wiki somewhere. I typed the entire thing up in one sitting really late at night while tired and procrastinating, so I wouldn't put it past myself to have simply mixed up the numbers and said 12AP instead of 12% (note: I remember I was using the unlit/unruined numbers, not the lit/unruined numbers). Even so, I wouldn't trust any search rate numbers prior to March 2010 unless the person used a script that "clicked" at random time intervals. Otherwise, Groove Theory could have had a significant impact on their results. —Aichon— 10:11, 22 May 2011 (BST)

Grooves lose impact over a large enough test group. That being said the non-groove results, and the assumption that groove was having a search impact, lend themselves heavily to the theory that those numbers were actually low because the people searching were not getting balanced rolls. Also, the DEM numbers arre exactly what you describe, they were pulled from DEM members via user script iirc. --Karek^{maps 2.0?!} 14:57, 22 May 2011 (BST)

Some boob altered my page

I would like to know who changed my page: http://wiki.urbandead.com/index.php/User_talk:Boocat/Sandbox

I never put in the Header "Sarah Palin's Stands on The Issues" User:Money-Grubbing_Neocon_Hack put that up and posted unfounded racist accusations about me. The guy is a coward, and I would appreciate it if you could have a word with him. I don't know who else to ask. Thank you for your time and help in this matter. boocat 22:16, 9 June 2011 (BST)

As it's a talk page, anyone can post on it as they see fit. However, as it's your talk page, you can remove anything and everything you want from it. 22:28, 9 June 2011 (BST)

I'm afraid I'm not really the type that handles mediation (even when I was a sysop, I tried to stay away from it), and while it's a bit harsh to say, I honestly don't have the time to get involved in these sorts of disputes at the moment since my schedule is already crowded as it is. That said, I can point you in the right direction, but you should be aware that he didn't break any rules in posting to your page, nor is there anything stopping you from simply removing the comments, as Misanthropy suggests above me.

Even so, if you don't like the comments he posted you can still protect yourself from future comments he might make. If you haven't done so already, make it clear to him on his talk page that his comments are not welcome on your page. Do so politely and courteously, but in no uncertain terms. You should do it yourself, and shouldn't get someone else to do it on your behalf. After that, should he continue, you should take him to arbitration and ask that he be barred from posting to your talk pages. Should he continue again after that point, you can take him to A/VB and get him brought up on vandalism charges. All of that is pretty standard procedure for how this sort of stuff is handled, so it's what I would suggest you do. —Aichon— 22:33, 9 June 2011 (BST)

Sysop Dream Team

As you may have seen from some of my recent comments, I'm assembling a super sysop dream team, and I feel that you need to be on it, even for the occasional appearance for an epic ruling. As such, I feel you need to reapply for promotion immediately.--Yonnua Koponen ^{T G P} ^^^ 21:58, 10 June 2011 (BST)

I'm afraid I haven't seen those comments yet (I'll look through your contribs in a sec), and I'm very flattered at your suggestion that I be on such a team, but I'm not sure if I'm a good fit for it or not. For one, I have no plans to ever nominate myself, simply because I've never wanted the position for myself. If someone else wants to nominate me, I'll consider it seriously, just as I did when I was nominated before, but I won't be putting myself forward of my own volition. Plus, it looks like we have a decent team right now, with some rather diverse folks that aren't afraid to speak their mind, so I'm not sure how much I can really add to the mix.

Also, I won't have time to devote a considerable amount of attention to the wiki for at least another few months. Even if I were a sysop, I wouldn't be ruling on A/VB often, I wouldn't be helping with janitorial stuff often, and I'd generally only chime in occasionally on matters. I'd be available for "epic" rulings, of course, but I can already chime in on such matters, though my voice carries no weight in an official capacity. —Aichon— 22:15, 10 June 2011 (BST)

:(--Yonnua Koponen ^{T G P} ^^^ 22:18, 10 June 2011 (BST)

Maybe in a few months I'll be more open to the idea. If someone were to put me up today, I'd have to really think about it because I know I couldn't contribute like I used to, at least until my grad work is done. —Aichon— 22:26, 10 June 2011 (BST)

Fair enough, I know the general feeling. I'm heading off to uni in September, and I'll have to really think about a third term as sysop.--Yonnua Koponen ^{T G P} ^^^ 22:54, 10 June 2011 (BST)

I've been bouncing the idea of a nomination around in my head for the last few hours, which I suppose was inevitable once it had been brought up. Just in case anyone was thinking about nominating me (see revision note), I'd probably turn it down if I were to be put up for the position at the moment. That may change in a few months when I have the time to contribute on the janitorial work, but right now I'd only make time for major discussions, and there are already plenty of capable and thoughtful sysops on the team. I feel that my voice wouldn't add much which isn't already being said, so I'd just be adding to the cacophony instead, rather than helping to bring about the best solution. If I saw that there was some serious dysfunction in the team, was convinced that I could offer a perspective which isn't being considered, or had time to contribute in other ways, I'd likely accept a nomination, but without one of those or some other important factor I haven't considered, I think that my addition would not be beneficial. Sorry if I got anyone's hopes up (see revision note again). —Aichon— 00:50, 11 June 2011 (BST)

Aichon is the dream team :/ -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 04:46, 11 June 2011 (BST)

Aichon, Hagnat, Zaruthustra, Swiers, Boxy, Ross, DDR, Red Hawk and the General. Boxy and Hagnat are crats.--Yonnua Koponen ^{T G P} ^^^ 15:23, 11 June 2011 (BST)

And I had hoped you go with Conndraka as sole crat overlord. -- Spiderzed█ 15:33, 11 June 2011 (BST)

Suburb

Just wondering, where is this discussion? The only discussion I can find was settled years ago with the section being kept and up until the removal it was still updated. --Karek^{maps 2.0?!} 08:53, 20 June 2011 (BST)

I think it was this one and maybe some of the other ones from right around then. Since it was up for discussion for a few weeks, received no objections, and the opinion of all the people that actually chimed in was to remove it, I went ahead and did that, figuring that anyone who dissented would simply undo the change (hence my edit comment) and put it back up for debate. You're welcome to do so if you want, though I won't participate in any debate on the matter at this point. ;) —Aichon— 09:17, 20 June 2011 (BST)

Images

Use the image on its own description or talk page. Counts as used without needing to be arked anywhere. You can even have it display at 1px wide so it's almost like it's not there. 02:25, 11 July 2011 (BST)

Still a bit silly, don't you think? I mean, why is something like that necessary at all? —Aichon— 02:27, 11 July 2011 (BST)

I guess it could do with being a speedy, rather than scheduled, crit. That way there's room in intervene before it's processed. 02:29, 11 July 2011 (BST)

I didn't mean so much in those terms. I'm fine with the policy. What I don't like is the wiki's way of figuring out which ones are unused. :P —Aichon— 02:35, 11 July 2011 (BST)

How else would you expect it to figure them out?--The General ^{T Sys U! P! F!} 02:33, 23 July 2011 (BST)

The software already knows which pages are linked to. I'd like it to simply use that with images before declaring an image unused. Why they don't is beyond me. —Aichon— 02:44, 23 July 2011 (BST)

They don't because an image that is linked to isn't necessarily even in use.

Also: We shouldn't really be keeping all to many images around if they're not used. The whole point of the Unused Image page is to tell us which images are no longer needed.--The General ^{T Sys U! P! F!} 02:51, 23 July 2011 (BST)

It's barely even an issue anymore since we can undelete images... Unless Kevan changed it back? -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 02:58, 23 July 2011 (BST)

He didn't, but I think that makes it even sillier. If the images are going to stay regardless, then there's even less reason to be picky about which ones we keep or delete. Might as well consider them used, rather than unused. —Aichon— 03:05, 23 July 2011 (BST)

I think we have a difference in definition here. For me, in addition to placing an image on a page, if it's linked, I consider it to be used. I understand the rationale behind removing unused images, but I simply don't think that linked images should be considered to be unused by the software. I'm not talking about any policy changes, since I think it would be annoying to have a policy that's not in sync with the software, but I just wish the wiki software had an option or setting that could be changed. —Aichon— 03:05, 23 July 2011 (BST)

Well, not sure that I entirely agree with you on that one. The reason for this setup is simple, though: Wikipedia's only use for images is to include them in articles. For them, the only reason to link to an image is really to discuss its deletion. Hence, this setup makes perfect sense for them.--The General ^{T Sys U! P! F!} 03:37, 23 July 2011 (BST)

That may be Wikipedia's only use for them, but that's by convention only. There's no good reason why articles couldn't simply contain links to images as a valid, alternative convention. That's why I think that an option would be nice, rather than locking everyone into their way of doing it. —Aichon— 04:23, 23 July 2011 (BST)

Not really: That would mean regularly clogging up A/SD with pointless doubled-handled requests.--The General ^{T Sys U! P! F!} 02:33, 23 July 2011 (BST)

Here's what I did.. For images I want to be sure are kept I just made a page in my userspace for them to sit. That way they are always in use even if they technically aren't being used in any useful way.       04:49, 23 July 2011 (BST)

Yep. We call that an image ark. My gripe is that I think it's silly that such things are necessary when the image is actually being used (despite what the software says) in some way. In the end though, it's just a gripe, and there's nothing any of us can do to change things. The way we do things now for them is the correct one while the software is this way, and I wouldn't want it changed. —Aichon— 05:08, 23 July 2011 (BST)

Ah didn't recognize the term when it was mentioned above. I can see your point about links should count as use though.       13:59, 23 July 2011 (BST)

katthew bid

I was just getting at the fact that she was considered qualified enough to make the rules of the wiki, and that means the primary rules not the intiracies of them. She was considered able enough to have qwhat, at the time, amounted to a stake of absolute control of the wiki, they were literal moderators. And that she was considered qualified enough to develop most of the systems we use to this day, including but not limited to suggestions. She has shown interest enough to consistently bring real activity to the wiki and influence enough to get ideas implemented in-game without going through the standard system(that she made). The idea that she's not able to do the job seems kinda unrealistic when you consider that she made the job, although I do understand what you mean. She may not know all the rule spam but she does know the why's of the rules better than all but a handfull and the spirit should always trump the letter. --Karek^{maps 2.0?!} 08:45, 13 July 2011 (BST)

I understand where you're coming from, but all of that basically boils down to whether or not we trust her judgment, which is only one factor among several that need to be considered. And, as you know, being a former sysop is not an automatic entry pass. I have no idea where to even begin looking up the discussions from back then that would tell me whether or not she was competent at her job or actually made the level of contributions that you say she did. I also don't know the circumstances regarding her departure as a sysop (not for lack of looking), which may impact her credibility. But without even having to look at her prior record of service, we can see that she hasn't contributed anything meaningful to the sysop-level discussions since after the 2007 purge, nor has she generally been active on the wiki at all. Not knowing the new rules is just the tip of the iceberg. By all indications, she has no demonstrated interest in bettering the wiki. —Aichon— 17:42, 13 July 2011 (BST)

Also, I realized not too long ago that I've been confrontational with you for no good reason. I know it won't mean much without action to back it up, but I wanted to apologize for it regardless, and to make it clear that even though we argue frequently, I still do respect your opinion greatly. —Aichon— 17:57, 13 July 2011 (BST)

UD Tool Script

Do you know of or could make a version of UDTool that works on the updated FF? There are quite a few people that would be interested in it I'm sure.        02:52, 20 July 2011 (BST)

UDTool is a FF extension, and I have no experience in working with those, nor do I have time at the moment to take on a new project (I might in a few months :/). To be perfectly honest though, I'm not really interested in it since the reason I make userscripts is for myself, and I'm afraid I don't use FF typically. I can't remember who fixed up UDTool last time, but you might talk to Revenant, since I wouldn't be surprised if he knows who it was or whether there's someone working on fixing it this time. —Aichon— 03:03, 20 July 2011 (BST)

Pretty sure that's the general's baby.--Karek^{maps 2.0?!} 03:05, 20 July 2011 (BST)

I wasn't sure who to ask I just figured the guy with the userscript page would be a good person to ask lol. I shall ask the general then.        03:21, 20 July 2011 (BST)

Just saw hes on holiday. Dang.       03:23, 20 July 2011 (BST)

You can still ask; talk messages don't degrade if left unanswered for a while! :P

To answer your question, the latest version available here and should work fine with the latest version of FireFox. If you have any problems then feel free to contact me either on my talk page, through email, or by posting on the thread on Resensitized.--The General ^{T Sys U! P! F!} 13:12, 21 July 2011 (BST)

I was just gonna wait :P       14:59, 21 July 2011 (BST)

Perhaps an even better idea would be to make a Greasemonkey script similar to UD Tool, as least in respects to the contacts list. Since there are already other Greasemonkey scripts that handle pretty much all the other features of UD Tool, that seems to really be the deal-breaker for many people. However, with our beloved Aichon not horribly active anymore and bogged down with RL worries, no telling when such a thing might be possible. --Maverick ^{Talk - OBR 404} 18:41, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

Plus, some of the browsers don't support (at least with current Greasemonkey implementations) the ability to locally store variables, meaning that you would have to hard-code in the contacts that you'd want to have colorized, rather than being able to enter them in after installing the script. Basically, it's not really feasible. —Aichon— 18:45, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

you there

I am viewing your page in Chrome. Unfortunately, the breakage of the custom title code has made it icky. You should amend your notice to "Best viewed on another wiki". 04:07, 20 July 2011 (BST)

I'll just change it to "Best on a Mac" instead. ;) —Aichon— 04:26, 20 July 2011 (BST)

Seriously though, I'm downloading Chrome now to check out the issue, since I had deleted Chrome awhile back. —Aichon— 04:26, 20 July 2011 (BST)

I didn't notice any code breakage but I am on a mac.        04:28, 20 July 2011 (BST)

I'm looking at it on Chrome, and I see no issues. Are you on the latest Chrome release, Mis? I'm currently using version 12. —Aichon— 04:29, 20 July 2011 (BST)

Anything that puts content outside the main page area stopped working for me when the wiki was updated, I didn't think it's a browser thing. Is no one else getting that same breakage? 04:34, 20 July 2011 (BST)

Can't say I'm seeing that. In your wiki preferences, are you using the default theme? —Aichon— 04:38, 20 July 2011 (BST)

You know, I honestly don't know. Hold on til I check. 04:40, 20 July 2011 (BST)

04:40, 20 July 2011 (BST)

That was it? —Aichon— 04:44, 20 July 2011 (BST)

That was it. I can enjoy Link's game again now. 04:46, 20 July 2011 (BST)

Yeah the default urbandead theme is borked. Really need to add something to notify people to change that. ~ _{05:28, 20 July 2011 (UTC)}

The default one is fine. It's the others that are borked. I think... —Aichon— 05:31, 20 July 2011 (BST)

If that's the case then we probably need some more testing. General, Karek and I (and probably some others) tested it and put together Help:Wiki Update. It might be that other browsers or macs have different skin specific issues. ~ _{05:36, 20 July 2011 (UTC)}

The custom title template has had issues with other themes for years (I believe that DDR, Rooster, and I have talked about it in the past), so this isn't related to Macs, PCs, or the wiki software update. It's just a matter of it only being designed with the default theme in mind. It simply works with a few of the others because they were based on the default. —Aichon— 05:47, 20 July 2011 (BST)

I suspect you're right and custom title is somewhat borked as well. The fact that it didn't work for Mis after the wiki update until he updated his skin made me think that urbandead was to blame. But I just changed tested it myself and checked a few different pages and it looked fine. Maybe Mis has been drinking heavily again. ~ _{06:06, 20 July 2011 (UTC)}

Actually, I think the problem was that he wasn't using the default theme previously, and that he switched to it, which fixed the issue for him. I use the default theme all the time (I figure things should always look best in it, after all), so I'd have noticed if it had a major issue. —Aichon— 06:40, 20 July 2011 (BST)

Yeah, I suppose that's very possible. ~ _{07:05, 20 July 2011 (UTC)}

We should all swap to the blue theme, because that's the one that Boxy uses. :D --Yonnua Koponen ^{T G P} ^^^ 08:57, 21 July 2011 (BST)

It's borked for me. Any letters that extend like p or q or y etc. are not covered by the custom title splotch of the title of the page. So there's a little square bit of pixels left to be viewed by me as something unsightly and that desperately should be covered up. Indecent exposure, if you will--  AHLGTG THE END IS NIGH! 07:25, 21 July 2011 (BST)

I think that's more of an issue with the template height than anything. I had the same problem with the decender on my user page until I increased the height of my custom title with a span tag. ~ _{07:36, 21 July 2011 (UTC)}

Yeah, I tried fiddling that, and got it everything covered in Safari, but in Firefox, the line under the page title header was covered (so line disappeared), fiddled to try and make the heights more precise, still didn't work. So I gave up. --  AHLGTG THE END IS NIGH! 16:23, 21 July 2011 (BST)

Ah the line. Probably have to cheat and just add ---- just below the cutom title code. ~ _{16:33, 21 July 2011 (UTC)}

meh

i created the fucking tool, i can has the right to not edit it if i wants it --hagnat 04:07, 31 July 2011 (BST)

:P —Aichon— 04:28, 31 July 2011 (BST)

That makes absolutely no fucking sense. -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 05:54, 31 July 2011 (BST)

Does it really matter if it makes sense? So long as he knows to do it next time, he could tell us he didn't do it because he's the Queen of England and it wouldn't make a lick of difference. :P —Aichon— 06:09, 31 July 2011 (BST)

Yeah but he didn't say he would do it next time. he implied the opposite if you ask me, for an illogical, egotistical and generally retarded reason -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 07:42, 31 July 2011 (BST)

Eh, not like it really bothers anyone much, myself included. Practically everyone forgets to do it. —Aichon— 07:47, 31 July 2011 (BST)

looks like he did it next time when suggestion o/d went up. I think hagz was just joking around. Lighten up ddr (or perhaps sober up). ~ _{08:20, 31 July 2011 (UTC)}

Help!

I made a template for rotation but it doesn't work on chrome or safari,only firefox. I can't seem to get it working. Even just the plain code only seems to work on an image. I'm gonna work on it more later but I figured more a experienced coder might get it fixed faster. Heres teh link http://wiki.urbandead.com/index.php/Template:Rotate and one to my sandbox where I've been playing with the codehere       19:46, 4 August 2011 (BST)

Probably have to use a style sheet to make it so. ~ _{20:17, 4 August 2011 (UTC)}

I believe the issue might be that webkit expects you to only use that on block-level elements, not inline elements. For instance, looking at your sample page, the image is flipped in Safari, while your signature is not. Since images are block-level elements by default, while text (even in spans) are inline elements, that seems like the most reasonable explanation to me. When I changed some of your sample code to use divs instead of spans, they reacted as you'd expect. EDIT: Karek just figured out the same thing as I did while I was typing this up. —Aichon— 20:29, 4 August 2011 (BST)

Yeah right as I walked out the door of my house I realized my image used div instead of span but I wasn't sure if that was the cause or not.       04:17, 5 August 2011 (BST)

UD Map Links

Hey-o! I saw that you updated the UD Map Links script after I did -- that's awesome, thank you! I upgraded to your version tonight but noticed the script's description still says that it links to the CDF's map. No big deal, just thought I'd make you aware.  :) Thanks again for the update and also for the other neat, new scripts! Best regards --Lucy Daniels 05:51, 26 September 2011 (BST)

Updated. Thanks for the notice! —Aichon— 06:06, 26 September 2011 (BST)

Profile Viewer

I know it's not your script, but Spidey doesn't have knowledge of how to fix it (he only updated the RG link), and Vic doesn't seem to be around to fix his own script, so a bit of help would be nice. It doesn't work in the latest versions of Firefox or Chrome. Think you know how to fix it and make it work? --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 02:26, 27 September 2011 (BST)

I've never actually used that script since it never worked in Safari, so I don't even have a clue where to start with identifying any issues (nor am I inclined to study the code, honestly, since I'm not playing the game at the moment and wouldn't get to use the script anyway). You might consider hitting Rev up for help. Even if he can't fix it himself, he probably will know someone who can. —Aichon— 01:12, 28 September 2011 (BST)

I'm being bounced all over this wiki because of you guys. Although it looks like Firefox 7 just came out earlier today...Perhaps I'll hold off on asking Rev until I test it in Firefox 7... --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 01:14, 28 September 2011 (BST)

That's what tends to happen with orphaned scripts, unfortunately. :( —Aichon— 01:27, 28 September 2011 (BST)

Asking for permission to adapt elements of your excellent Big Bash 3 page

Hey there, just a quick request for your permission to adapt sections of your FAQ and possibly 'borrow' the odd bit of code from your excellent Big Bash 3 page for the new Mall Tour '11 page. This new Mall Tour is looking like a relatively simple and spartan affair, but a solid page always helps with recruitment, and your Big Bash 3 page has some great writing and code that could be easily adapted for this new undead venture. Let me know how you'd feel about us using your page as the inspiration/source, thank you! --BOSCH 21:34, 4 October 2011 (BST)

I'm fine with you guys borrowing from it (with a few caveats), but I'd suggest checking in with bisfan and Amber if you can track them down. Bisfan was the real leader behind the scenes, while Amber did a lot of leading and made all of the artwork, so getting their okay would be a good idea (and would be a necessity if you wanted to use Amber's artwork). I mostly just made the pages to their specifications, so I consider the pages to be theirs more than mine, though I suspect they might disagree with my sentiment since they've been generous in letting me take undeserved credit in the past.

As for my caveats, they basically boil down to the idea that you should make the page uniquely yours, rather than being an obvious carbon-copy of BB3. At the very least, I'd change the colors (since that shade of red has been used with past BB events, and doesn't MT usually use a shade of bright green?) and would ask that you not directly use any large blocks of text without rewriting them. In my opinion, you're welcome to use BB3's headings and organization of the pages, and you can use BB3's text as a basis for your own, but I'd prefer that it wasn't directly copy-pasted (the blocks of text, that is; feel free to copy the headings). We went for a unique vibe in the writing of BB3's pages, and I'd like to keep it there. Changing the width of the page might be a good idea too (you don't want to go smaller though, for various technical reasons), just to help separate the two visually. Again, make it uniquely yours and distinctive from BB3. So long as you do, you'll have nothing but support from my end since I'm VERY happy to hear that MT'11 is happening (even if I won't be participating). :)

Also, just to check, you're aware of the BB3 admin page, right? It's linked from the bottom of the Thanks page and has instructions for how pretty much anyone can update everything easily. I tried to make it as full-featured as possible while still being simple enough that a wiki novice-to-intermediate could maintain it by themselves. —Aichon— 00:22, 5 October 2011 (BST)

Thanks for getting back to me so quickly! We have both bisfan and Amber on board, so asking them for permission shouldn't be a problem. I won't be re-using any of the artwork, because it wouldn't fit (different titles and styles), but also because I'd like to make the page original too. I'll definitely re-write whatever I use of your words to give us our own voice, I mainly wanted to use them as a basis as, for example, your FAQ covered everything as well as it could be covered. Finally, thank you for the pointer towards the admin page. Perhaps have a look at our page again soon, and hit me up if you have any queries, concerns or suggestion! Cheers, Aichon! --BOSCH 03:02, 5 October 2011 (BST)

The FAQ is pretty generic stuff, so feel free to crib liberally from it. If you have bis and Amber on board, then you should be fine doing pretty much anything you want. It sounds like your head is in the right place (I figured it would be, since it is you, after all), and I mainly wanted to make sure we were on the same page with the idea that a blatant copy wasn't cool but most anything else is fair game, so I doubt you'll hear any complaints from me. I still respond to stuff on my talk page quickly, so if you run into something odd when copying all of the templates that BB3 uses over to MT'11's space, feel free to hit me up for information on them. It's been over a year since I built the pages for BB3, but hopefully I can remember most of it. —Aichon— 03:30, 5 October 2011 (BST)

Question about the inner working of this Wiki

Hi Aichon. I know you are not around much anymore but I also know you still read your discussion page. You've always been helpful and civil toward me even when our opinions diverged so I feel more comfortable asking you this question than I would begging trolled and spammed by others in other parts of this wiki.

I was looking around in neighbor suburbs of Yagoton lately and noticed that The Dead have their name in the active zombie group in every single one of them. They tried to add their group to Yagoton too but I removed them on sight when they tried for obvious reasons and then I didn't bother to keep up with their ridiculous act further for the rest of Malton. Very recently I stumbled on their group page (or lack of group page, if you know what I mean) and in the discussion page I noticed that they purposely tried to add themselves to every single suburbs of Malton to abuse the so called honor system (I think it was in the suburb massacre section of their discussion page). It seems like not many people care about that listing and thus their name remains listed Malton whole, irrelevantly of the exactitude of that claim or not.

My question thus follow: would you know where I would need to go or post to ask the powers that be in this Wiki to either remove The Dead in every suburbs they are not really active in, or give me the right to do it myself without having to create a drama war? I looked myself but I really have no idea where I should do that. And everybody know that if I were to do it directly then the sky would fall on me... You cannot expect anything better from The Dead (or rather Awful Forums...).

Thank you for your time and answer. -- •Eagle of Fire• 

 •[Talk]•  02:49, 24 October 2011 (BST)

Just wait for the next Great Suburb Group Massacre. Where we get to work cleaning out the group listings on each and every suburb. --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 03:08, 24 October 2011 (BST)

Axe's solution is definitely the most straightforward and simple, but which one you want to pursue depends on how willing you are to deal with drama and/or the potential for drama. The options I see are to remove them yourself (which is perfectly fine, but may cause drama with The Dead if they object), encourage others to remove them once The Dead leave their suburb (low drama), take The Dead to arbitration to force them to use the system correctly (that'd be a VERY hard ruling to enforce, assuming it went your way, and would mean some very involved drama), or to wait for the next GSGM, which will clean up all of the issues of this sort when it happens (no drama). The GSGM tends to be an annual thing at this point (maybe even longer now), and the next one probably won't roll around until sometime in the Spring.

Personally, I'd probably clean them out of every suburb where their horde isn't located at the moment, since their influence has waned significantly after their spurt of activity around March or April, and I wouldn't expect much drama at this point. I'm sure some of them will object, but most of them are like any other wiki denizen: unwilling to put forth anything beyond a marginal effort. So long as you leave them alone in the suburbs where they truly are active, they won't have any grounds on which to object, meaning that they'd have to put forth some serious effort to undo your constructive edits. Few of them would likely be willing to try and take you to arbies over it, and even if they did, those listings would get locked in the contested state (i.e. how you left it) for the duration of the proceedings.

Thank you for your answers. Unfortunately I have no idea where The Dead are actually active, if they are really actually active anywhere in the first place. I however thought that the fact that they purposely (tried to?) abuse the system in place might mean there would be a quick and efficient way to get rid of them without drama. Maybe it was only wishful thinking though. -- •Eagle of Fire• 

 •[Talk]•  10:33, 24 October 2011 (BST)

They're active in the NE certainly, and have a small presence in several other places.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 11:37, 24 October 2011 (BST)

Unfortunately not. Just because someone abused things in some cases doesn't mean that every instance is an abuse, and we have a responsibility to set things as they should be, rather than what's simplest. You can probably remove them from about 90% of the suburbs in the end. I'd just look for reports of their activity on the wiki, or else leave their mention in suburbs that are listed as red in the area where they were last known to be active, and wouldn't worry about it beyond that. I honestly wouldn't expect there to be any drama if you remove them from most suburbs, and if there is, then there's nothing saying you can't just walk away from it and try a different tactic later while letting them put their name back for now. I.e. remove their names, and if it sticks, great, but if it doesn't, just leave it alone and try something else. I was just talking about worst cases earlier. I honestly doubt you'll get any drama so long as you're civil about it, and if you do, then you can just walk away. —Aichon— 14:30, 24 October 2011 (BST)

Hummm... It seems to me then that there is only two really cost effective solutions to this problem then: 1) Simply remove them from all suburb listings and ask them nicely on their discussion page to add themselves to those suburbs they are really active in or 2) Ask them on their talk page first where they are really active and only after they reply remove them from those suburbs they didn't mentioned.

Solution 1 would be the one I prefer because it is straightforward, easy to do and I simply don't expect The Dead to be civil even if we are to them. It could however potentially lead to high drama on their part, maybe even to a low wiki war. Solution 2 would be the most civil toward them and might lead to good results if they are in a good mood but as I said I don't expect it to be the case because of past experiences. It might be worth a shot if you think it is the best option though, which I think it is judging by what you said so far.

On a related note, their group page is The Dead 2.0 right? -- •Eagle of Fire• 

 •[Talk]•  20:14, 24 October 2011 (BST)

Yep for the page. As for the options, #2 is basically just GSGM, except you'd be doing it early, would be singling them out for it, and would likely be met with the exact sort of response you're already expecting. #1 is closer to what I'd recommend, but to keep it more civil, I wouldn't remove them from every suburb immediately. Instead, I'd remove them from everything except the ones where they might be, which, based on what Yonn said, would be all of the northeast suburbs that are red or orange. I'd then revisit it in a few weeks and would remove them from any of those that had turned green or yellow, since they clearly weren't there any longer. It's easy, doesn't involve having to contact them, and isn't controversial in the least since you're not removing them from any places where they actually are. It may not be as thorough as quickly, but it's what I see as the path of least resistance which yields the best results for everyone. —Aichon— 01:08, 25 October 2011 (BST)

Interesting way to handle it... However, I don't agree: even if the suburbs turn yellow or green it doesn't mean they are not present or active in the suburb. Take when they visited Yagoton for example, the suburb was red for Gods know how long and we were active and kicking all along. In fact, we purposely stopped updating the map to make them think that we were not and they should not come back. I never took the danger map as any real indication of what is really happening in Malton so I don't agree about using that Wiki tool for this particular problem. -- •Eagle of Fire• 

 •[Talk]•  04:39, 25 October 2011 (BST)

Well, that's your call. Personally, I see it as a case of them being a horde and being interested in making it clear how destructive they are, so I think it's a safe assumption that a green or yellow does not have them present in it. If you don't want to make that assumption as well, that's fine, but that leaves less options available to you. Keep in mind that with your #1 option, if you remove them from every suburb, then you're not even making an attempt to leave them listed in the suburbs in which they might be. The reasoning behind my idea was that it would be making an effort in good faith to leave their listing in the suburbs where they are most likely to be. It doesn't need to be 100% accurate since even they aren't making that information publicly available, but it is a best effort to not act solely in our own interests. —Aichon— 13:53, 25 October 2011 (BST)

I am SO coming back for the next GSGM. :D:D --Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 11:37, 24 October 2011 (BST)

Go to A/A. I could always use a chuckle. In fact, take it anywhere anybody says, I'm sure I'd fill my chuckle quota with whatever you try. annoying 10:30, 25 October 2011 (BST)

I offer to arbitrate.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 13:37, 25 October 2011 (BST)

I'd rather see a jury involved. >_> --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 16:42, 25 October 2011 (BST)

I'd prefer that this whole thing with them be done already and that people would stop feeding the trolls. They were fun to have around when they imbalanced the entire game, but now they're just boring. Up until then they spiced things up. Once they stopped that, however, they stopped being interesting. Now they're back to their usual state of "dull" that they were in for the last few years. Call me when they march again. —Aichon— 06:29, 26 October 2011 (BST)

Dude they aren't even around. It's hardly fair calling them dull when they don't do anything anymore. annoying 10:11, 26 October 2011 (BST)

Speaking of which, Gaddafi's been kind of dull this past week.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 11:44, 26 October 2011 (BST)

Zombie Gaddafi keeps making a ruckus though. I wish he'd shut up already since he's no longer relevant. —Aichon— 13:39, 26 October 2011 (BST)

You missed my point. They continue to be a nuisance in the meta-game (else this discussion wouldn't exist), yet they aren't contributing anything to the game because they "aren't even around". The fact that they're not around was exactly the reason I made that comment. If they were still around, I wouldn't have a complaint. —Aichon— 13:39, 26 October 2011 (BST)

Wiki Suggestions

Hey you seem to be somewhat active right now. It might be a lot to ask but do you care to weigh in on some discussion here? I'm trying to develop a system for formal requests to Kevan to make updates to the wiki. I thought this might be somewhat up your alley. ~ _{07:01, 26 October 2011 (UTC)}

I get e-mailed when my talk page gets edited. Otherwise I'm less active than I've ever been. Is that sort of thing really a problem, however? We've typically just used A/PD in the past, and it's worked okay. Kevan seems reluctant to make updates, given the dwindling nature of the game and the added cost that these updates to the wiki brings to him (whether in time, money, or the need for better hardware for the wiki). I guess the question I have is why we need something besides A/PD, since requests of that sort really shouldn't be commonplace (i.e. don't bother the boss-man) and should be the sort of thing that's big enough that the entire wiki community agrees it needs to be updated. —Aichon— 13:45, 26 October 2011 (BST)

A/PD isn't appropriate for these requests in my opinion. They simply are quite different in nature than what should be considered official wiki policy. There are about 5 requests to be submitted to Kevan at the moment. Some are to make minor tweaks to fix some of the problems caused by the wiki update and others are aimed towards stopping spam or making our lives a little bit easier in other ways. Discussion of these issues tends to happen on irrelevant pages and when a decision is reached, there really is no formal way of making them through Kevan.

I'll use Wiki_Questions#Spambits as an example. A few people had an opinion on the subject and it looks like consensus was reached about how to approach Kevan about necessary updates. We could simply ask Kevan on his talk page and direct him to the discussion thread and hope for the best but it seems sloppy to me. Several of us would like to see a more formal method of making these requests.

Coincidentally, none of the updates so far would be difficult to implement nor costly. They just involve making one or two changes to the database. That isn't to say that every requested update will be that straightforward, but I think the majority of them will. Anyhow, I appreciate the input and I completely understand not getting more involved in this project. ~ _{14:26, 26 October 2011 (UTC)}

Inactive. Idle. Uh huh.

Your userpage lists you as inactive, yet I very clearly noted you making edits to this here wiki within the last week. I get the impression that we both fail at keeping ourselves completely removed from UD. Maybe I'll see you around, and maybe I'll just stalk your Backloggery. (I also commented on the UD Tool comment up above, in case you missed it) --Maverick ^{Talk - OBR 404} 18:47, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

Feel free to stalk my Backloggery page, since I still go there almost daily. The SoC are doing an activity that I thought was worth swinging back around for, so I'm back in-game for that, but otherwise I pretty much only come around for AHLG's game these days. Also, I responded to your comment up above before you posted this one. :P —Aichon— 18:55, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

You two can't hide yourselves from Axe Hack the Recent Changes Stalker!!! We all know you're both secretly plotting your dramatic returns to UD. --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 19:33, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

I'm always reachable via my talk page. What more could you possibly want? ;) —Aichon— 19:44, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

I demand Aichon be reinstated as a SysOps. :P --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 20:08, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

Don't you have things under control? :P —Aichon— 20:11, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

I don't care if everything is already under control. I still demand Aichon be reinstated as an Op. :P --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 20:15, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

This template is approiate for all of us here! I made it awhile back :P

Are you a stalker?
List of abbreviations: N This edit created a new page (also see list of new pages) m This is a minor edit b This edit was performed by a bot (±123) The page size changed by this number of bytes 21 December 2024      12:41  User:DangerReport/The Lenthall Motel‎ diffhist +59‎ AndyMatthews talk contribs      12:41  User:DangerReport/Phipps Library‎ diffhist +91‎ AndyMatthews talk contribs	we stalk Recent Changes so much he put a template of it on their userpage.

       20:42, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

I made one ages ago as well.

	Stalker
	This user stalks the Recent Changes page.

--•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 20:49, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

Some of us just get e-mails whenever you yahoos post here. —Aichon— 20:53, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

It's because we love you. Hell, you can be my wing-man any time, Aichon. (No homo.)  ;) --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 21:00, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

For the record I have no idea what dramatic return Axe is speaking of. All I know is that LoZ: Skyward Sword comes out tomorrow and that I need to find a new mask after I clean the blood of the CAPD off my current one. --Maverick ^{Talk - OBR 404} 00:52, 20 November 2011 (UTC)

Because this page needs it too, just so you know I'm onto you and Mav's secret plans to take over the wiki when we're all not looking... ;)

	He's Watching You...
	Axe Hack has his eyes on this User. All seven of them.

--•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 06:48, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Hmm? —Aichon— 13:57, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

A friendly reminder, then, that I am always watching you. Even when I sleep. ;) --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 14:07, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Me too! ~THOROAEBORUS 14:11, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Speaking about that, is there any way to use hover in this Wiki? Thanks in advance. ~THOROAEBORUS 14:39, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Aside from {{ht}}, none that I know of really, and that's not really what you were looking for, I'm guessing. We don't have access to the CSS or Javascript, and that's how you would typically change text styles for hovering. —Aichon— 14:54, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

	Stalker of Templates
	This user likes making templates about the Recent Changes page.

--Shortround 12:51, 18 January 2012 (UTC)