UDWiki:Administration/Promotions

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A/PM

Candidates currently under community discussion

Revenant

Revenant (talk | contribs | logs | block | IP Check | vndl data | discuss)

See also: UDWiki:Administration/Promotions/Revenant

See also: Crap for brains

This time I am posting my own promotions bid, rather than having it posted by one of the most notorious former wiki users as revenge. Let's see if it goes any differently.

N.B.

I currently have lots of free time, as anybody on my Facebook can attest, and I would like to put it to more constructive use, i.e. further serving the Urban Dead community.

Cheers,

ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 01:19, 29 March 2011 (BST)
ƒc|B^j

• AGAINST WHAT A FAG NO IM LYING VOUCH MAYBE AGAINST FUCK IF YOU DONT KNOW REVS CAPABILITIES AND UNDERSTANDING OF THE RULES AND SHIT HERE YOU SHOULDNT BE VOTING.--If my name was MisterGame AKA Thadeous Oakley, I would be a massive flaming faggot. >:| 01:28, 29 March 2011 (BST)
• Vouch - Better than Boxy--THE Godfather of Яesensitized, Anime Sucks ^{Yalk | W! U! WMM| CC CPFOAS LOE ZHU | Яezzens} 02:02, 29 March 2011 (BST)
• question - what's changed since your last bid? not a lot by the looks of it. -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 02:08, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  I am active on the wiki, have the free time to work on wiki projects, and have not been nominated as a joke by Grim. As I said in my bid above. Got any questions I haven't already answered? Oh, and I've now got mobile internets access, so I can edit and (assuming this bid goes well) psyop while out, too. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 03:13, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  If you want to use your free time helping out the UD community, why do you have to be an op? To be honest and not as offensive as I probably sound, the only reason that springs to mind is that there's some sort of lol quota on a forum somewhere which needs meeting. -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 04:17, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  That's also on the to-do list, TBH. And I'll respond more fully when I get the chance, just heading out the door ATM. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 04:26, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  That's cool, no hurry. -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 05:19, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  Also, I have another question. How come when you (and other non-'wiki addicts', if you're cool speaking on their behalf) run for promotion, you feel the need to meatpuppet the crap out of the bid? Before anyone judges please note I'm of course not against meatpuppeting, nor for it, I'm just curious why you do it when A/PM is a system that is designed to diametrically oppose the influence of meatpuppets? -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 12:31, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  Eh, none of my vouches were meatpuppets, except for the one that couldn't read and voted me by mistake. Or, if they were puppets then I had no knowledge of it. --Ash  ^{|  T  |  яя  |} 14:34, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  "Meatpuppet" is such an ugly word. This may come as a shock to you, but the wiki is hardly the centre of the UD-verse. In fact, most people play quite happily without consulting it much if at all. Instead, I would say that I am attempting to reach out to the broader Urban Dead community and encourage participation from different demographics. In fact, I can name at least one person who has returned from at least ~3 years of absence due to my linking this on Facebook. How can that be a bad thing? ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 15:13, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  So basically meatpuppet is an ugly word, but you basically deconstruct your actions as getting people who don't use the wiki much at all but know what it is, to bring support to your bid where they would otherwise be spending that time (for example ~3 years) away from the wiki? Doesn't sound like meatpuppeting at all. You didn't even answer my question either? -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 22:27, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  I don't think he voted for me – he can't stand the wiki – just started playing again. Also, like I said, UD community and UD Wiki community have overlap but are by no means identical. If you only post on the wiki you disenfranchise those who do not spend much time on here but still have an interest in favour of the more vocal minority. Also, I thought I sorta answered it in one of my other responses below? ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 22:59, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  Wait, so the reason you get people here in hordes is not to dogpile your promotions bid, but to extend other metagaming media to ud players who don't wiki much? -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 04:26, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  Have you ever thought that there's a reason a lot of people avoid the wiki like the plague? These people know me and what I stand for. I'm not telling them what to write, as I'm sure you can see. I'd point to Toast's Against as an example but he's busy avoiding the place like despite my encouragement. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 05:02, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  I couldn't care less about why people avoid the wiki TBH. I would like for his place to be used lots, and I am always trying to help out people who have a keen interest in the place where I can, but if people don't come here that's just how it is. Having you ask them once every month to come here and support someone/thing they don't care about won't improve the situation, lest you being promoted. -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 05:50, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  Yes, I can see that… ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 01:24, 31 March 2011 (BST)

  I said people who have a keen interest in the place, not people who come here cause they're asked and fail the one thing they have to do right to have their vote counted. -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 07:39, 31 March 2011 (BST)

  It means that a very very large part of the player base knows and supports Revenant and is willing to vouch for him. Stop trying to make out like being respected by most/a large part of the game community means he's not trustworthy, it's shit and it's a part of how the wiki's lost the community. I mean shit, the guy is a mod on all four major metagame boards somehow and you think he's untrustworthy? --Karek^maps?! 05:09, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  I ctrl+f'd this entire conversation and didn't find the word "trust" or "untrustworthy" in any of the above dialogue, so I don't know what you're talking about. Didn't find Karek either, odd. Can he be trusted? Why not. Will he be able to do the job properly? Eeeeeeeehhhhhhhhhhhh. The only time I've seen Revenant deal with rules and policy on this wiki he's tried appallingly to just rules-lawyer his way through the argument to get his way. Granted, sometimes he stands down if told/proven/argued to be wrong. But some times, he chucks colossal shitties, then creates drama across multiple admin pages just incase the fallout wasn't crap enough, let alone the crying we had to read when he wanted to be deescalated too. Ugh. Given, I haven't had him act like this since, but given a new conflict of interest come along I won't hold my breath for a changed man, sorry Rev. -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 05:47, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  You quoted me in your ruling for that case and let me tell you, there was nothing wrong or drama-full about his arguments there. They actually bring up some good points that a more rationally minded group probably could have used for a discussion on the extensions of specific vandalism rules and precedents and their relevance to blatantly meta roleplaying. In that case specifically he was escalated for something that we normally always used for people trying to recruit for groups without any basis as to interest not users who have entered into a discussion or vote being swayed to change it(which we've actually always overlooked when done on promotions, policy, etc. when the user had already voted and thus shown involvement in discussion). Well that and claiming that a blatant joke about a user that would never ever ever be repromoted or, probably, unbanned being nominated for promotion as a sysop. That's crap and no more vandalism, drama mongering, or bad judgement than, say, a promotion attempt by a recently escalated vandal who was involved in a poorly handled sysop ruling that partially mocks the reasons for one of the sysops involved. The only drama in either of those is generated largely by the user who didn't assume good faith or good humor and when that's relevant to the reason why he would be beneficial to the team(he doesn't start at the assumption that all rules violations are vandalism) that's nothing but a good reason to promote him. It's like if we'd denied promoting you because you knew and were involved in some of the dramas of Jed and Nallan simply because we'd decided that you're magically incapable of understanding or enforcing rules. --Karek^maps?! 06:03, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  The arguments behind that case are irrelevant in this context (though I feel forced to, for the 4000th time, discredit 80% of the personal shit you just said on the basis of the sysop team are the ones that ruled on the case rather than the one man who brought it there and didn't rule). If he thinks he's wrong there are more mature ways to deal with it than immature. He hit about 75% of the immature ways head on. If you're going to butt in with conversations and try and argue over the subsequent tangents can you please stop and address some of the things I said? Otherwise please just deal with this elsewhere like my talk or talk:A/PM or let Revenant deal with it here himself. Please. -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 06:25, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  How have I not done that, you brought up that discussion as immature and drama mongering because as an involved party, and the person who brought the case, you viewed it as such. You brought it up as your reason for why you feel he can't do the job. You brought up the Grim case as him drama mongering even, I pointed out it wasn't drama but a very blatant joke. You brought up claims of him meatpuppeting, I pointed out that he's trusted by these communities and people being willing to vouch for him from communities he's moderated is the exact opposite of meatpuppeting and is the point of this page. You brought up concerns about his ability to do the job because of these cases, I pointed out that we had the same concerns about you but faith enough that you knew the rules and had a valuable viewpoint that we, while not always in agreement with, thought would be a useful contribution to the administrative discussion. Put all of the personal crap aside, he's a good levelheaded user that's shown himself trusted by the community and able to work with diverse groups of the playerbase quite amicably, that alone should be reason enough.--Karek^maps?! 06:38, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  How can I possibly be the biased one when you attempt to discredit the ENTIRE event as not drama mongering (or, stupider yet, not drama at all) because it was in good humour? What? Why the hell do you think I'm not going to promote him just because I think/know he'll do a shit job? Why the fuck are you still even here, can you go 10 contribs without trying to butt heads with me via walls of texts over shit that has nothing to do with you? Are you going to go for promotions now so you can just have your say via one bolded word and be done with it, rather than waste my time with your fucking arguing? Holy fucking god Karek.

  Back onto the topic, I don't think you have the right definition of meatpuppet to work off. Google it, if Rev recruited them simply for this function it is most definitely meatpuppetting. Again, I'm pretty indifferent to whether he does it or not (I am one of the two people on this wiki who has the power to nullify every single one of them if I so wished and no that is not a threat or prediction of my future actions so don't bother complaining about it), I was just curious as to why he should bother doing it, then tried to make a point of how hollow his excuse was and its righteousness. Again, to re-iterate, if they wouldn't have given input on this without a nudge from Revenant, it's meatpuppeting, regardless of good faith by the users or their genuinity (both of which, I agree with you, are genuine). I also discussed the drama mongering above too so I guess I'm done with this reply. awaiting another 1,900 characters of time waste -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 06:51, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  I guess the standard for claiming I'm around just to butt heads with someone has gotten pretty small if all it takes these days is to try and have a discussion relevant to one A/VB case about how it was dealt with and one promotions bid about how you're distorting his actions with your views of them/how he's shown community trust. It's actually kinda sad really, there was a time where you were at least sorta reasonable enough to listen to someone outside your head. --Karek^maps?! 07:06, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  You're breakin my heart. -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 07:17, 30 March 2011 (BST)

• Supreme Vouch - If you don't know how hard Revenant can work, you don't play this game! --Karloth Vois ^¯\(°_o)/¯ 02:16, 29 March 2011 (BST)
• Against - Creating a bunch of crit 1 pages to set the tone? Meh -- boxy ^{talk • teh rulz} 02:26 29 March 2011 (BST)

  IMO we need more, less-burned-out psyops with a sense of humour. I think I fit that profile. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 03:13, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  If you were a sysop, what would you do if someone nominated such pages for speedydeletion? -- boxy ^{talk • teh rulz} 09:10 29 March 2011 (BST)

  Assuming that 1) I had not created them and b) I found them funny, I would vote to keep and attempt to improve said pages until they were no longer eligible for Speedy Deletion. (Which is probably what I'll do assuming nobody else gets it…)ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 09:31, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  How do you suggest we improve those specific pages? Wouldn't any expansion sort of kill the whole joke (what there is of it)? -- boxy ^{talk • teh rulz} 10:56 29 March 2011 (BST)

  Bump -- boxy ^{talk • teh rulz} 12:20 30 March 2011 (BST)

  Oh right! Possibly add Category:Humour and perhaps “See also: Recursion” and/or an InterWiki link to the relevant page on HSwiki. I'd be tempted to make a template, actually… Which reminds me, InterWiki links are another thing I want to set up that also requires the Administrator bit. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 12:30, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  None of which would make them any less eligible for crit 1 and 2 speedydeletion. The answer I was looking for was that you would either delete them, or move them to an appropriate place. A big part of a sysop's duties is to try to keep the main namespace relevant. Informative pages about Urban Dead, the groups that play, events that happen and the way players interact, is what goes there. It's not a place for circular pages linking to each other with nothing more than "See also:" on them -- boxy ^{talk • teh rulz} 02:25 31 March 2011 (BST)

  I don't consider “delete them” to be a valid response to “improve until no longer eligible for deletion”. And moving wouldn't make them particularly less valid for deletion unless it was to the User: namespace, which would defeat the point. Although I was tempted to change to Templates and… hmm… ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 05:35, 31 March 2011 (BST)

  What do you need access to to set up interwiki linking? Sysops and crats don't have that many more buttons, and unless it's just a matter of editing a protected (special?) page, then I suspect it would fall to Kevan anyway -- boxy ^{talk • teh rulz} 02:25 31 March 2011 (BST)

  Oh right, keep forgetting we can't easily have extensions installed. Bug Kevan for Extension:SpecialInterwiki, I suppose, and then establish consensus for links, probably based on what wikis are most linked to or would be most useful to link to. (Also: holy hell is this wiki out of date.) ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 05:35, 31 March 2011 (BST)

  Yeah, no kidding it's old. Tell ya what, you get Kevan to update the wiki and I'll vouch you as supreme overlord crat-op-min with an expiry time of infinite. Dooo eeet! ~ _{06:06, 31 March 2011}

  Heck, I'll give it a go. Been meaning to email him about a few other things anyhow. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 06:21, 31 March 2011 (BST)

  The last few earnest requests for an update have been met with...nothing. I'd wouldn't be too surpised if he hasn't been pinged via email a few times about it either. But hey if ya got an "in" then give them man a shout. I want me some extensions. Moar extensions and bettah parser functions would be keen. And there's a pretty important security update I think we're missing. ~ _{07:14, 31 March 2011}

  Not to mention that anyone that knows better knows you've been actively lurking about for many years now. --Karek^maps?! 03:50, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 15:58, 29 March 2011 (BST)

• Boodroscotch? 03:17, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  Assuredly. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 03:47, 29 March 2011 (BST)

• Vouch - His rehab calls for him to be a contributing member of society! -- Bisfan 03:36, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  Lies, damn lies, statistics, and vaudeville! ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 15:41, 29 March 2011 (BST)

• Vouch - Because he's my grandpa and hobbies are good for old people. --Amber Waves of Pain 03:44, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  Get off my lawn! ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 15:41, 29 March 2011 (BST)

• Vouch - He knows lots of stuffs and shares well with others.--CyAdora 03:46, 29 March 2011 (BST)
• Vouch - He's pretty much the epitome of trusted user when it comes to UD and he knows more than a fair bit about wikis, wiki maintenance, and what the job entails. Certainly a better candidate than half the sysops we have now, if not all but two. --Karek^maps?! 03:50, 29 March 2011 (BST)
• Vouch - He's done a great job of doing nothing for me since the last Mayoral election. I respect his integrity as a person of responsibility. --DJ Deadbeat 03:53, 29 March 2011 (BST)
• Vouch - Revenant has always been there for me. And he's a cuddly beast. Myk 04:16, 29 March 2011 (BST)
• Vouch he will bring balance to the team and hopefully piss in thad's milk and question his sexuality.-- The preceding signed comment was added by these amazing looking
  
  bitch 05:32 29 March 2011 (UTC)
• I like Revenant! He does 'good' 'things';) (thanks for the bribe :D ) Loki84au 06:33, 29 March 2011 (BST)
• Vouch - These are popularity contests, right? Because Rev is pretty popular where I come from. RinKou 07:06, 29 March 2011 (BST)
• Vouch Bringing new people here is a good thing. This game is dying and a big part of that is because this wiki is so unfriendly and takes itself too seriously. Too many sysops see the role as a badge of honour and authority rather than a chore they have volunteered for. --Honestmistake 08:43, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  A-freaking-men. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 12:30, 30 March 2011 (BST)

• Strongly Against - Revenant smells and does bad and naughty things on the wiki.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 09:00, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  Yonnua wants to get fired from his cushy Malton Government job? ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 09:28, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  You aren't mayor any more, I don't need to listen to you! >:( --Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 15:38, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  I'm still Deputy Mayor and in charge of Harmanity. Also, I think Jorm idled, which I think makes me de facto Mayor until such time as he awakens from his slumber in the depths… TL;DR: YES YOU DO. >:D ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 15:44, 29 March 2011 (BST)

• Vouch or whatever Oidar 09:15, 29 March 2011 (BST)
• Vouch -- because Revenant and me would make perfect sysops. --Ash  ^{|  T  |  яя  |} 09:37, 29 March 2011 (BST)
• Vouch -- As Karloth, Karek, SexualHarrison, and Ash. - Goribus 09:48, 29 March 2011 (BST)
• Vouch - we need more revenants as psyops --People's Commissar Hagnat ^{[talk] [wcdz]} 15:37, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  If I could find any more, I'd nominate them as well! ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 15:58, 29 March 2011 (BST)

• Vouch - Mostly because DDR is annoying me, yet again, with his attempts to de-legitimize opinions by dragging out the meatmuppet slurs. Oh but yeah, I guess Rev would be alright. I mean he seems like he might not have a stick up his ass about everything. Then again, he has chosen, of his own free will, to waste a significant portion of his life on the zl. Does not say much for logic. Smells kinda Boy Scouty. But fuck it, can't be any worse than Thad or Yonnua.--
  
  | T | BALLS! | 15:41 29 March 2011(UTC)

  Firstly, thanks for the vouch, but I should note for the sake of clarity that I'm actually too lazy to do much grunt-work with the Zerg Liste. Hence, technical/advisory role. Which reminds me of another list-related project I need to get off the back-burner… ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 15:54, 29 March 2011 (BST)

• Abstain - I think you have the mindset and the abilities to be a capable sys-op. However, I'd be far more comfortable if I could see you first committing a couple of months to maintenance and janitorial stuff. (OTOH, we have promoted Thad, whose greatest achievement within 3 months was to half-way re-arrange the bids chronology and then drop that "project" as soon as he had the buttons...) -- Spiderzed▋ 15:45, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  TBH, the biggest thing I want to fix here actually requires the Administrator bit set (CSS overhaul), and with Aichon de-opped I'm not confident we have current sysops experienced enough in that area to implement the changes I have in mind. I may be wrong. Also, I've done plenty of maintenance over the years (check my contribs, assuming history wipes have left much – actually, that reminds me…), but my boredom threshold is kinda low and I tend to get something “polished enough” and move on. As mentioned in my previous bid. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 15:59, 29 March 2011 (BST)

• I would like to see you around more often, but you do a good job. I suppose I can vouch for you. =p -- Cheese 15:48, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  I will likely be around more should this bid prove successful. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 15:58, 29 March 2011 (BST)

• Vouch - he is always helping out as much as he can from what I see --Carrie Cutter 17:16, 29 March 2011 (BST)
• Vouch - Rev can has vote! Also he promised me something shiny. --Saralan ^{Talk 404 ZHU ❤} 22:49, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  This is not a vote. --VVV ^RPMBG 23:12, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  Call A Rabbit A Smeerp… ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 01:17, 30 March 2011 (BST)

• Couch - For the most comfortable man in Malton. --Strata 23:22, 29 March 2011 (BST)
• Against Since Revenant has been placed in Administration positions in 4 forums I am involved in, within 3 weeks each forum was hacked into and pretty much destroyed. There seems to be a common theme in which anyone that raises concerns about his "powerrush" appears to have their account deleted by "hackers" or thier email account spammed with emails from "Save the Tasmanian Devil society" and I beleive he simply gets involved in things simply to see what he can break or personally gain. His abuse of admin rights on the University of Twente Urban Terror server lead to the creation of the Cornholio account that has rampaged across the wiki. I can see this is a vieled attempt to get rights to ban MisterGame due to some falling out over Wotans Templar. --Rapture 23:28, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  LOL Please tell me this is true!--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 00:38, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  He's been an admin at Red Rum's forums for years and they work at least 10% of the time (this post brought to you by the Tasmanian Devil Society) --Karloth Vois ^¯\(°_o)/¯ 00:53, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  Baseless lies. I have no idea what this clearly deluded man(?) is talking about. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 01:20, 30 March 2011 (BST)

• Vouch He's a stand up guy! --Akbar 02:16, 30 March 2011 (BST)
• Vouch I can see no reason why not, he makes a positive contribution to the wiki. Gordon 02:53, 30 March 2011 (BST)
• Vouch He linked to TVTropes a bit up. That's enough for me. Smyg 10:52, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  Truth In Television: TV Tropes Will Enhance Your Life! ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 12:34, 30 March 2011 (BST)

• vizouch assumed he already was a sysop............--  ▧  ^{: : : : : : : : : : : : : : : :} 13:22, 30 March 2011 (BST)
• Against - His support comes from people who probably wouldn't be affected by his election. He also doesn't seem like he takes the position seriously. --^A_O^R_D^M_O^P_R^I _! ^T 13:38, 30 March 2011 (BST)

  Right, because existing sysops totally won't be affected. Also, I am as serious as cancer. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 13:47, 30 March 2011 (BST)

• Weak Against - Would have probably been a vouch because I've seen some pretty good contribs from rev and he's a pretty long-standing member of the community but the above comments about his tenure as forum admin on several UD boards concerns me. I don't know if any of it is substantiated but I have to assume at least some of it is. I'd need to see some more positive contributions around the wiki before the trust would be enough to vouch. Maybe come back later with some more wiki-related projects to show if you're serious. ~ _{15:13, 30 March 2011}
• Vouch - Competent, dedicated, and friendly. I can see that his contributions to the wiki, considered alone, leave something to be desired, but I'm persuaded by his level of participation in other community projects that he is a valuable asset and, if given additional buttons, would press them well.--FT 19:12, 30 March 2011 (BST)
• Weak Vouch - I can't really speak for the other forums but Rev's always been solid with regard to his mod/admin duties on Barhah.com, although he is not as active there as he was in years past. I think he has more than enough experience in wiki/technical magic things to be an asset to the wiki. That said, some of his actions on the wiki do give some serious pause and concern over his motivations / judgment. Yeah, while I can see him rocking out and becoming the world's greatest sysop, I can also seem him - I don't know --accidentally crashing the car or something over a cliff. But hey, it's a rental. Give him the keys and see what happens. -MHSstaff 23:17, 30 March 2011 (BST)
• Vouch - Trustworthy. I don't say that about many Australians... --Papa Moloch 23:47, 30 March 2011 (BST)

DevilAsh

• Ashley_Valentine (talk | contribs | UDWiki contribs | vndl data)

What can be said about a Hyperintelligent man such as DevilAsh. Well, if one were to take a mere 30 seconds to get to know him you will find out that:

• He owns his own apartment in England, which is a pretty monumental task since the world knows that apartments are for renting.
• That he is a honor student in the field of psychology. So this tells me that on top of his ability to make a wiki a better place, he will do so with a flare of slick helpfulness and give our more suicidal members a place to turn when their A/VB and Arbitration cases make them feel hopeless.
• He has awesome hair, an amazing defined jawline. Some might classify this as arrogance, but arrogance is a flaw, the DevilAsh is perfect.
• Being English, he enjoys high tea. But he also have a love for coffee, showing how diverse he can be and willingness to accept all choices, no matter how hard.
• His favorite band is Brand New, and when I learned this, I had no idea who this band was... perhaps because they were brand new. But that wasn't what caught my eye. What caught my eye was his choice of spelling of the word "favorite." His purposeful use of the American spelling of the word gives us great insight into the mind of DevilAsh, telling us that he is accepting of all cultures and beliefs. Certainly this would include those who are into cross dressing.
• He is a staunch supporter of those afflicted with Seasonal Affective Disorder, a disorder which causes those who are without sunlight to fall into a deep depression, and has a campaign to end the embarrassment they face because of their anacroym.
• He does not own an MP3 player, which in today's society says a lot that he's got higher priorities even though he really, really wants one, he uses his resources and wealth to help those who are less fortunate than him (the irish).
• He also thinks glassjaw are an awesome band. He singles this band out specifically because he supports their humanitarian efforts providing hair nets to the less fortunate people of Latin America.
• He is also completely, utterly mad! Mad the direction the world is taking in regards to febris e causa ignota, otherwise know is the Fever of Unknown Origin. His dedication to finding a cure for this disorder which afflicts literally hundreds of people around the globe. To this day, the United Nations continues to ignore his calls and letters about this blight upon the world's citizens. Imagine the catastrophic events that would occur if this went viral.

Needless to say, this is just a sampling of all the qualities that DevilAsh possesses showing his true character which he might be too humble to state for himself, it doesn't take a rocket scientist (a profession he sought out before he was inspired to help others) to figure out after spending any time with this wonderful human being. Sure, he doesn't have the "guideline recommended" number of edits, but really, we all know the guidelines aren't written in stone, otherwise they would say "must" not "should." Sometimes its good to be understated. I would much rather have someone take their time and make thoughtful edits, rather than bombard the system with unnecessary changes and useless rhetoric to bump their status like some recent members of the sysop team. DevilAsh's sense of justice is blind. That is why he was named chief biscuit of RedRum. He has the ability to make non-discriminatory decisions for the good of the group, and that can apply here. He is also a friend to the bearded and the undead, and I have been told by Suburban Ed when asked to describe DevilAsh:

Suburban Ed from IRC

<&Suburban_Ed> Great kisser

That is quite an endorsement. DevilAsh is your friend. DevilAsh will take you to the next level. DevilAsh will make you better. DevilAsh will make you less oily. And that is why, I, Godfather Anime Sucks, endorse this bid and invite you all to share a story or a moment in your support for DevilAsh for sysop, because he kicks Ash! --THE Godfather of Яesensitized, Anime Sucks ^{Yalk | W! U! WMM| CC CPFOAS LOE ZHU | Яezzens} 21:48, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

Accepted

I was told to accept this, and so I have. But first, let me try and explain a little why I am accepting this: It's been at least half a year now since I have seriously thought about applying for sysop. (I highly recommend reading my thoughts). Most of what I thought there still stands. I haven't changed that much as a person since then, and if I would tell you about my history, or who I am I would be pretty much repeating my previous ideas. Ever since then I have continued my activity, in again most of the drama-prone areas. And drama there has been, some of which I was personally involved. Still I handled myself during those times well enough I believe. Again, referring to my old thought, meta-experience in A/A, A/VB and A/M since 2008. I'll say what I think, directly and honestly. There have been some moments, especially in my troubled past, where I was a bit too compassionate leading me into (personal) conflicts but I put those times past me. I try to be open to criticism, but in the end the skill that I deem most important to have in drama sections, is the ability to get along with people you just had an incredible heated discussion with. To overcome each others disagreements is the key to any sort of harmony and respect needed in a community of any sorts. This issue was certainly something in the last six months. If you want to compare me to the other sysops, I have somewhat common ground with probably...Thadeous Oakley (hope he doesn't feel offended now) minus a lot of (life) experience. Not because I necessarily always agree with him (I don't) but more in his approach of things. Moving on: I chipped in here and there with some paper work contributions. Deletions, protections, created a policy in my mind (that was eventually shot down by my other mind) fixing some stuff. However, as a janitor these things were mostly minor, and certainly not anything spectacular. I'll always do my share of this stuff, as regular user and as potential sysops, but I'm not going sugarcoat this, I'm nothing more then average as a janitor. Not much has changed, and you may ask yourself if that's good time considering my last mind-bid failed. Well, I think I did actually almost nailed a promotion last time. Grown a bit wiser too. Not to mention my vandal history is now...history. My last infraction being in March 11, I think I have overcome most of my devious flaws. Still not perfect, never will too, but I think I can handle the job and responsibilities. Sincerely, --Thadeous Oakley Talk 11:52, 24 January 2011 (UTC) --Ash  ^{|  T  |  яя  |} 22:15, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

Nice comeback man! Keep it up, you'll be a great wiki member in no time. --Thadeous Oakley Talk 22:40, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

(Since you're allowed to comment here, I figure it is only fair if I am allowed to retort) -- You are certainly leading by example! --Ash  ^{|  T  |  яя  |} 23:42, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

*takes a huge breath* aaaBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 23:44, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

• For - I am proud to be the first person for vouch for you, DevilAsh. You truly inspired me to put my grudge on hold and donate to the red cross to help out the relief in Japan. You eased my fear of the conspiracy that all the money would go towards anime-related endeavors. --THE Godfather of Яesensitized, Anime Sucks ^{Yalk | W! U! WMM| CC CPFOAS LOE ZHU | Яezzens} 21:48, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
• For - Cause I owe them D:--^TCAPD(╯°□°)╯ ┻━┻ 21:49, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
• Necessary Sys-Op Vouch - He is neither Thad, nor does his name rhyme with it. -- Spiderzed▋ 21:50, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
• For - I want Ash! --Suburban Ed 21:51, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
• Strong Against - Fails criteria, joke bid nadada etc. Feel highly inclined to move this to the talk page. --Thadeous Oakley Talk 21:53, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

  Again, the criterion isn't written in stone. They are not "must have" requirements, otherwise the verbage would reflect this. Also, removing such a bid, would constitute bias, as per some of your comments in dealing with DevilAsh in the past, and I would assume bad faith.--THE Godfather of Яesensitized, Anime Sucks ^{Yalk | W! U! WMM| CC CPFOAS LOE ZHU | Яezzens} 22:04, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

• Against - The sysop team is no place for women. ~ _{21:54, 21 March 2011}

  Nice try. --Thadeous Oakley Talk 21:58, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

  The perfect reason to vote for me, then, I am male! --Ash  ^{|  T  |  яя  |} 22:52, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

  The sysop team is no place for cross-dressers. --VVV ^RPMBG 23:01, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

• Against - No. -- Cheese 21:59, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
• For - Oh God please yes. He satisfies me every need. -Austin Hunt 22:02, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
• For – Obviously. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 22:07, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
• IV 22:28, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

  You rang? IV ^PK 04:49, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

• Strongly Against - Although Anime made many good points, the spelling of "favourite" as "favorite" is unacceptable practice. As, when I get up tomorrow morning, DevilAsh will be permanently banned for this vile utterance, it makes no sense to promote him to system operator.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 22:46, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

  Oh yeah, also this is a joke bid crawling with meatpuppets.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 22:47, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

  Prove Joke Bid and Prove Meatpuppetry.--THE Godfather of Яesensitized, Anime Sucks ^{Yalk | W! U! WMM| CC CPFOAS LOE ZHU | Яezzens} 22:55, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

  I don't need proof, I'm Charlie Sheen.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 22:56, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

• A/VB - As Cheese. --VVV ^RPMBG 23:01, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
• Fore! For 4 - DevilAsh is actually a lot smarter, openminded, and perceptive than most people allow themselves to think about him. To his credit, he is not a current member of the SysOps team, which I think says a lot about him. --DT^PK 23:05, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
• For - I hear good things. Very good things. -- Bisfan 23:12, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
• For - He will bring balance to the force, from my extensive experience with DevilAsh I have to say he has always impressed me with his dilgent nature, diplomatic class and soft hands.--Rapture 23:17, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
• who the fuck says 'for'. against -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 23:31, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
• vouch i don't know ddr golfers?. and I am not a meat puppie. i just hate thad.--
  
  bitch 23:54 21 March 2011 (UTC)
• For - Revenant meatsockpuppet. The Grimch ^{U! E!} 00:04, 22 March 2011 (UTC)
• Strong Vouch- I've known Ash since before I was babah Mimey, He's a good bloke, still in game after all these years. He has the ability to make non-discriminatory decisions and is very open minded. Temperament is level headed. I've seen it in action. Also, unlike Thad. <3 --_♥AU10♥Pantomime _{Mistress of Pain}┌∩┐(◕‿◕)┌∩┐ 00:25, 22 March 2011 (UTC)
• strongest vouch possible why the hell not. I mean, just looking at this bid makes me happy so imagining what he could do with the POWER means i can't possibly say no. --Honestmistake 00:48, 22 March 2011 (UTC)
• Against - With all the recent shenanigans on A/VB recently, I don't think you're ready for it yet. When you're causing less drama, then come back and give it another shot. --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 01:04, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  u suck axe. i'm coming to you're high school and i'm gonna shove you in a ya locker--

  

  bitch 01:06 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  You go do that, Harrison. You probably won't find me. I graduated a good 2 years ago. ;) --•▬ ▬••▬ • •••• •▬ ▬•▬• ▬•▬ ^{#nerftemplatedsigs} 01:42, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  There's always reunions!--THE Godfather of Яesensitized, Anime Sucks ^{Yalk | W! U! WMM| CC CPFOAS LOE ZHU | Яezzens} 02:19, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  Queens ain't that big axe. shit i've known you for a long time.--

  

  bitch 04:54 22 March 2011 (UTC)

• Strong Vouch: As a relaxed, easy-going chap he will fit in badly with the role of system operator and will probably be relentlessly ground down into a rules lawyer within 2 months. I look forwards to the bitter relinquishing of his principles as is befitting any entry into politics (on a more serious note: awesome, cheery guy with plenty of perspective, exactly what the top chaps could do with). --Karloth Vois ^¯\(°_o)/¯ 01:16, 22 March 2011 (UTC)
• Strong Vouch - Anyone that's ever worked with Ash on any level knows that he's an easy going guy but he can get the job done. He'll do this job to the best of his abilities and do it because it needs done. Also the SysOP staff could use another competent member. So far there are only two SysOPs (three including Kevan) that fit that description. The rest are either corrupt/power hungry douchebags and people I've never heard of. -- Goribus 02:16, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  Haha Iove this dude's reasoning. I'm sure you've never heard of me but incompetent? ~ _{02:27, 22 March 2011}

  You gotta keep in mind which sysop is his idea of able :| -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 03:16, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  Vapor, I think you might have failed basic reading comprehension. Because that was an either/or statement. If I've never heard of someone I can't exactly gauge their level of competence can I? You got a free pass because I have no clue who you are. And DDR's right, my idea of a good sysOP is someone that isn't corrupt, doesn't abuse their position for power and status, and does their job. So not him or his buddies. -- Goribus 06:12, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  And misconMeatpupanthropy fits that criterea! -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 06:49, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  You are so amusingly butthurt over everything aren't you DDR? Why yes, Misanthropy does fit my criteria and he happens to be a friend. But if basic math didn't fail you I said there were two Sysops that fit my criteria aside from Keven himself. I feel that Spiderzed fits the criteria as well and I barely know him/her. In fact, I'm almost certain that we've never even spoken in any capacity. I've simply observed them pitch in and help on projects and was impressed with their ability to do so. Just like I've seen what Ash is capable of. He's Red Rum's chief diplomat as far as I know. He's capable of negotiating with other PKers and as a Pro-Survivor player you do not have any idea of how volatile people are that kill others in game for laughs. The man is perfectly capable of doing this job, yet you and your group of likeminded Sysops are trying everything you can to discredit him simply because one of you has a personal issue with him. You're a Sysop like your buddies. You're supposed to be held at a higher standard than we (normal users) are.

  Case in point: you and your cronies are currently derailing the discussion at hand. The reply I'm replying to really should have been left on my talkpage and not here and it borders on a personal attack on more than one person. Sterling behavior from one of the two non-Keven Sysop Bureaucrats isn't it? And you lot wonder why people are hoping that other Sysops get elected to balance out the current staff... -- Goribus 23:26, 24 March 2011 (UTC)

  Whoa, what? assumptions galore? All I said was 5 words, I wasn't implying half the stuff you took for granted. projecting much? I have nothing against Misanthropy personally or (I say hesitantly) professionally, and if he takes as much as you do from the times I disagree with his actions then I'd think a lot less of him too. I don't mind misanthropy at all, but the only reason I said what I did was saying that Misanthropy is less corrupt than other ops, and doesn't abuse position for power or status as much as other ops, is a joke, sorry.

  And also personal attack lol? Welcome to the internet! -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 23:50, 24 March 2011 (UTC)

• For I vote of my own volition and not because I expect gold and or hamsters to overflow in my basket. --Karek^maps?! 05:49, 22 March 2011 (UTC)
• Vouch He amuses me. Of the current sysops only Dancey, Rossy, Missy and Spidey does. We need more amusement. (And yes, I naturally expected a bribe for this. A hefty one.) Oidar 16:27, 22 March 2011 (UTC)
• Against - Joke bid. --^A_O^R_D^M_O^P_R^I _! ^T 20:02, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  false, might wanna have your mind reading powers checked.--THE Godfather of Яesensitized, Anime Sucks ^{Yalk | W! U! WMM| CC CPFOAS LOE ZHU | Яezzens} 20:13, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

• Question - Is this a serious bid or is it not? I've been going on the assumption that it is not but some people seem to think otherwise. ~ _{21:53, 22 March 2011}

  This is not a joke bid. I don't know if I'll need to repeat this again or not, but this is very serious in its nature. I welcome questions as to why I accepted/think I would be good in this role, but I hope this is now ironed out and will not need to be asked again. --Ash  ^{|  T  |  яя  |} 22:02, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

I started ignoring the discussion on other pages a day ago so if it was mentioned elsewhere I missed it. ~ _{22:22, 22 March 2011}

• Question - To those of us that view your contribs to admin pages in the past as "jokes", how are we to expect you will conduct yourself in the future if promoted? Will it be business as usual? Or should we expect more reverence towards admin pages? ~ _{22:22, 22 March 2011}

  I don't see it as so much 'business as usual' or 'reverence towards admin pages'. More that, in the end, for a strong and active community to exist on the wiki there needs to be a healthy balance between guideline-enforcing and being too lax. It's a given that I deserved to be warned yesterday, but the joke only came about because of the handling of the case. If things were taken in a much more sensical way, and people weren't making themselves too easy to milk, then it wouldn't have been the clusterfuck for the sysops that it was.
  As for me in the future, it pretty much stands in the same way: I do not purposefully set out with a preemptive plan for things to happen (for example, yesterday) -- and the only expectations of placed on me currently are those I have of myself. If I was to become a sysop, this will change accordingly and I will act accordingly. I do honestly think that a lot needs played with on the policy front, though, and will try to initiate changes either way. --Ash  ^{|  T  |  яя  |} 22:44, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  But looking back through your contributions, the only admin pages you've edited recently are VB and arbitration. You don't appear to have done any janitor work at all. So why do you think you need the buttons? -- Cheese 22:47, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  But as I'm sure you've probably seen, the drama on admin pages is always present and sysops will likely always act how they feel accordingly. Given that the sysop reactions won't likely change if you're promoted, would we expect to see the same reactions from you? Humor in sysops is a good thing but making a total mockery of the sysop team...not so much. ~ _{22:59, 22 March 2011}

  Cheese: True -- although I have always offered myself as an Arbitrator, I have not had much time within this wiki outside of voting and questioning policies and adding my own remarks to them. The main reason I feel I 'need the buttons', as so to say, is because I believe I could advance policy and discussion in a greater way if I had them, and I feel that I could combine objective judgement with subjective reasoning in my janitorial work to better the wiki in general. I feel that I can do this with my relative knowledge of how a wiki works, knowledge of the current guidelines and regulations and with my own qualitative and quantitative thoughts.
  Vapor: Short answer, no. You will not see me reacting in the same way as most other sysops for reasons already described, although I would try my best to lead by example and teach a better way of reacting to those that feel they need it. --Ash  ^{|  T  |  яя  |} 23:06, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  But then that just makes it sound like you're just after being a sysop for the status rather than wanting to do the actual job. You also only meet two of the guidelines. -- Cheese 23:10, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  Eh, not so. The reasoning behind my acceptance of the sysop bid is because, like I'd picked upon above, I feel like I could make a heavy, positive contribution to the wiki. I would do this through my own addition to cases via the combination of objective and subjective thought, and the ability to advance policy and discuss the ins and outs of the wiki with the people that actively run and maintain it to better everyone -- not just the guidelines, the actual users of the wiki too -- in the long term. --Ash  ^{|  T  |  яя  |} 23:14, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  Do you realize, that all things you're saying you want to do, actually don't require sysops powers at all? You can do that as a regular user. Doesn't it make more sense to be a well contributive and experienced regular user before becoming sysops? -- Thadeous Oakley Talk 23:20, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

• Against - I don't know if this is a joke bid or not and I haven't been paying attention to A/VB recently to know what everyone is going on about, but I don't see how this bid can be treated seriously since Ash fails at two of the criteria, one of which is easily the most important one. Ash hasn't even made 500 edits in total in his entire time here (which goes back to 2008). More importantly, however, he hasn't demonstrated an interest in maintaining the community by taking on leadership roles or doing significant maintenance tasks (voicing an opinion here or there is a start, but it's not sufficient, generally speaking).

  He's indicated that his behavior would change if he became a sysop, but that's not the way it works, nor how it should work. Changes in behavior need to precede promotions, rather than the other way around, otherwise we have to take it on faith that candidates are capable of acting in a way that has not yet been demonstrated. Doing it the other way around is how you get incompetent people into positions of power (which we don't need any help with, since we've got it covered already :P). In the few interactions I've had with Ash, I've enjoyed myself and have thought he's a cool enough person, but that alone is not enough. Not nearly enough. There need to be significant steps taken before Ash would be ready to be a sysop, but I wouldn't discount the possibility at some point in the future.

  Also, some of Ash's comments make me question whether or not he understands what a sysop is. For instance, #3 and #4 at my old page. I still haven't seen a satisfactory answer for why Ash needs to be a sysop, since all of the things being cited are things that do not require sysop powers.

  —Aichon— 23:25, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  Nice. DDR is going to love this, all he has to do now is say "As Aichon" and be done with it ;). Man, you should never have left us.-- Thadeous Oakley Talk 23:32, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  If we are going by with the "guidelines" say (again, guidelines are guidelines not minimum requirements) it states underneath: If a user is highly exemplary in one criterion, a certain amount of leeway may be given with the other criteria. And certainly #4, Desire to be a sysop is one of those guidelines. And I would say based on his feedback, and acceptance that he is, in fact, highly exemplary in his desire to become a sysop. Therefore, by the guidelines, the other "criterion" should be given leeway.--THE Godfather of Яesensitized, Anime Sucks ^{Yalk | W! U! WMM| CC CPFOAS LOE ZHU | Яezzens} 23:38, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  He's not that exemplary in that criterion; he didn't even make his own bid.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 23:41, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  I certainly accepted my own bid, though! --Ash  ^{|  T  |  яя  |} 23:44, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  "Your" acceptance speech was just a mockery of Thad's, though. Almost verbatim. That's a big reason why I have a hard time taking the bid seriously and why I doubt you seriously want to be a sysop.~ _{00:10, 23 March 2011}

  ... And more to the point, in my own honest opinion I could never make my own bid simply because it would mean that I'm not fulfilling one of my own ideas about what a SysOp should be: representative of the users. --Ash  ^{|  T  |  яя  |} 23:51, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  That's a silly argument, and you know it. Just because someone REALLY wants it does not mean that they are sysop material, otherwise we'd have to have Jerrel in the sysop ranks as well. Being exceptional can help smooth out rough edges (e.g. close to but not quite 500 edits, no major leadership on projects but some decent participation, etc.), but it can't act as a substitute for a complete failure to fulfill them. —Aichon— 01:16, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

  The guidelines say Should. Not need. He is not in fact required to have 500 edits. And I'm calling you on the 'behavior must change before' thing. Misanthropy was promoted. And god help you should you say anything about Misanth being a reasonable, likable or "model" user. Furthermore, the best answer as to why Ash needs to be able to press buttons is that he doesn't. He needs to be able to represent a larger base of Users in Policy Interpretation than the current team is able to. He didn't up and decide, I'll be a SysOp now! People told him "You need to be able to post on Admin pages" because nobody is listening to you as is and he was like 'ok'.Additionally, as awesome a guide for moderating internet community sites as your page is, you ought to think about taking the advice you wrote at the top of the page yourself. Otherwise, add a new # saying "don't rock the boat and upset the other SysOps before accepting a promotion bid from a chunk of active wiki users". That'd be helpful too. ARGH FUCK YOU DEVILASH EDIT CONFLICTING ME IM WITHDRAWING MY SUPPORT IN RAGE--DT^PK 23:52, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  Excellent point, let's demote Misanthropy.--Yonnua Koponen ^{Talk ! Contribs} 23:55, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  Sounds like a plan. -- Cheese 23:58, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

  DT, I know they are guidelines (trust me, I know), and I'm fine with accepting users who are deficient in some areas, but he's not even in the ballpark at the moment. I'm not the sort that will be a dick and say "no" just because someone is at 250 or 300 edits, so long as they make up for it in other ways, but he's around 250 right now (and he only seems to have that many because of all the VB cases that he's involved with), and he is also severely lacking in criteria #3, which is the most important one. If he had a record of leadership on projects and of doing significant maintenance on the wiki (e.g. he was a new Rooster, back when Rooster was in his prime), I'd be fine with overlooking the edit count thing, but he doesn't have that record.

  As for calling me on the behavior thing, go back and look over Misanthropy's bid. He was a well-liked, reasonable, model user. Suggesting otherwise is to take a revisionist approach to wiki history. And I didn't say anything about the buttons before. I said I hadn't seen a valid reason for needing to be a sysop, period. There are ways that non-sysops can offer their opinions, and it's been my experience that so long as they are well-reasoned and well put that the sysops will consider them seriously. If they don't, either your opinion is in the wrong, or theirs is, and if it's theirs, A/M might be something to consider. You don't need to be a sysop to change the opinions of sysops and sway the direction that policy is being interpreted. —Aichon— 01:16, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

  Yes, there are ways for users to offer their opinions. This consists of posting on the talk pages of project pages and then be told that they are either trolling, posting the same thing over and over, or are simply not worth the time of the sysOp(s) in question. Either that or they are simply ignored outright. Please don't insult my intelligence by suggesting that any of them actually change their opinions based on ordinary users with whom they do not interact on a very regular basis.

  As for Misanth being well-liked, so is DevilAsh. Is DevilAsh not liked by the right people? Whoops.

  And listing the number of edits he has as his greatest pitfall...seriously? The gentleman has stated that he's run a wiki, and been a serious contributor to yet another one. The only reason I see for him not editing this wiki much is because nobody expected him to. Give him a mop, and watch him pick up the team's slack.

  Don't believe he's capable of serious responsibility because he hasn't been tracking down orphaned pages and listing small groups with little wiki presence up for deletion despite most of them still being active? Well, then consider his diligence in returning Red Rum to its former glory - Before he stepped up to the plate, Rummurs planned organized strikes...and 2 of them showed up. On a good day. Now they're all doing things together, touring malls, breaking 'burbs, like the Red Rum of old. That sort of change doesn't happen because he made a nice-sounding speech once. It's because he was dedicated enough to chase down the wayward Rummurs and get them back on track, which must have taken more than a month. With that sort of track record, he'll be quite capable of sorting out a few categories on the Special Pages list. --DT^PK 02:00, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

  On the contrary, I think he sounds like he'll be a great candidate...at some point in the future, and I don't think that he's incapable of handling responsibility, though I do think that he has failed to demonstrate his ability to do so on the wiki. To quickly go through your arguments, I never said that edit counts were the most important thing, and have even vouched for users with less than 500 in the past. On the contrary, what I twice said was that his lack of leadership on the wiki and lack of significant maintenance activities were the largest issues. His leadership elsewhere is a good sign that he can cut it here, but he needs to do so first in order to establish trust and prove that he can do so. As for voicing opinions, once again, if the sysops are acting contrary to policy, take them to A/M. And in my experience as a sysop, opinions voiced by "ordinary" users did, in fact, contribute to the opinions of the sysop team and did, at times, direct the decisions that were made. —Aichon— 02:40, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

  So basically you're saying sysops ignore regular users, and you need to be a sysops in order to make a difference here. Christ, give me one example where this has happened. -- Thadeous Oakley Talk 07:33, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

  No offense intended to Thad, but that's a discussion for DT's talk page: it's a derailing comment that only furthers to impair the discourse, at best. I take on board Aichon's arguments, and agree, to an extent. Yes, in a perfect wiki all of the criteria would be passed or, maybe, marginally overlooked, however at the same time I also feel the need to say that this isn't a perfect wiki. Sysops have, in the past, fulfilled all listed points only to behave like absolute dee dee heads and shame the sysop team in general, which has brought us to the point we're at now. I think DT has been trying to point out that Sysops represent the users in their roles, as well as their janitorial positions, and that a large amount of the users are backing Anime's bid for me to be a Sysop. If there's no mutual trust/you feel you need to know me in order to vouch for me, feel free to ask me questions. I will gladly answer them to the best of my ability, and hopefully that may change your opinion slightly -- same goes for everyone else that is against the present bid. --Ash  ^{|  T  |  яя  |} 14:39, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

  I am interested in learning more about your hybrid quantitative/qualitative/subjective/objective decision-making process that will alter the landscape of the wiki. In your acceptance of the bid, rather than using that opportunity to promote your past experience with other wikis, your past ownership of a wiki, your leadership qualities, your abilities to interact with users in a positive and constructive manner, your specific qualifications and motivations for the position in the first place, or -- really, anything at all, you instead decided that copy/pasting a parody of another user (although, admittedly, was absolutely hilarious) was a better way to represent yourself and gain trust. Walk us through that decision if you please. Also, some of your answers strike me as more or less "empty rhetoric." Can you give me something a little bit more "concrete" to base a vouch on? -MHSstaff 17:55, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

• Against - For now. The bit about previous experience with wiki ownership/management and general leadership is encouraging, but it couldn't hurt to see some more involvement here first.-MHSstaff 05:23, 23 March 2011 (UTC)
• Heck yes - Good man. Strong morals. Why not? --Sam 2334 16:04, 27 March 2011 (BST)
• I say nay. He's serious about it, he's knows where the line is drawn with silliness, and he has his own thoughts and opinions, but can he maintain those particular stats with the keys to this place? I think at this moment, no! If he can roll a natural 20 though, I'll support him. Who can argue with that?--SA 23:01, 28 March 2011 (BST)
• Against - lol promotion in responce to being vandalbanned -- boxy ^{talk • teh rulz} 02:28 29 March 2011 (BST)

  they get more likeable every time! -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 02:39, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  I didn't get banned :S --Ash  ^{|  T  |  яя  |} 14:35, 29 March 2011 (BST)

• I like Revenant! (thanks for the bribe :D ) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Loki84au (talk • contribs) 02:37, 29 March 2011.

  You should probably take the time to support the right bid then -- ϑ^anceϑ^anceℜ^evolution 12:35, 29 March 2011 (BST)

  It's OK, I bribed him to vote for Ash too. ᚱᛁᚹᛖᚾᚨᚾᛏ 15:38, 29 March 2011 (BST)

• Against - Who?--
  
  | T | BALLS! | 15:48 29 March 2011(UTC)
• Vouch - Besides his undeniable looks, Ash has done great work keeping our group running when interest was fizzling and if he even puts half that effort into the wiki you'll be lucky to have him. --Strata 23:15, 29 March 2011 (BST)

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